Build Thread BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.


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Thread: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

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    Default BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Okay, first off, I've been building this spindle for a few months already, but only got a buildlog on a Swedish forum, then I thought wny not share this build with you guys too!

    For you who wounder, I work as a tool maker for mold injection, that's why I have access to all the machines.

    Oh yeah, almost forgot, I'm making this spindle because milling spindles really fascinate me. I have a small chinese bench-top mill that I re-built to 99% and made a new BT30 spindle for (that was ~1½ year ago.) But the design and my job wasn't that great. (Because I didn't have enough knowledge and not access to good enough machines) But with the first spindle I learned a lot, so now move on to the next one!

    Let's start with a section view of the spindle design. I might make some minor changes to the design through out the build tho.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-00-jpg



    Manufacturing time!

    When the spindle is done, I need to measure the run-out of the tool taper somehow. So I started making a "test bar". I used Uddeholm Stavax for the test bar because it is a rust-resistant tool steel which can be tempered.

    I lathed the shaft to nominal diameter + ~0.4mm, which will later be removed with the cylindrical grinder. Then I turned the part around and lathed the tool taper, bored and tapped the hole for the draw-bar.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-01-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-02-jpg


    Then I started making the rings which will offset the angular-contact bearings(for added stiffness) and also the rings to adjust the pre-load in the back roller-bearing(the bearing have a tapered seat on the axis, so the harder I tighten it on the bearing seat the less clearance it will have, or in my case, preload.)

    The rings are made of Uddeholm Orvar Supreme(2242), it is a good "all-round" tool steel.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-03-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-04-jpg


    Latheing a small part for the gripper.

    I made this out of Orvar, too.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-05-jpg


    Now, let's get serious and start making the spindle shaft!

    For the previous small parts I used the smaller lathe, now for the shaft i used the heavy-duty one! I actually like the smaller one better, but for this job the bigger one is better suited.

    This, too is made of Orvar, quite a big chunk of tool steel!

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-06-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-07-jpg


    Some hours later...

    Annnnnd it's done! Well, operation 1 atleast. :P

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-08-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-09-jpg


    Turning the shaft around and boring out the shaft.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-10-jpg


    Making the labyrinth-seal for the front-bearings. I made the play around 0.2mm/side.

    These 2 are made of Stavax, because it is rust-resistant.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-11-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-12-jpg


    I lathed the front-lid for the spindle and drilled the holes for mounting. But I accidentally f*****-up.(got the hole and head clearance off-center to each other) To fix it, I used the sinker-EDM(sure i could've fixed it in the mill/drill-press, but it looks muuuuch better EDM'ing it! ). Cylindrical ground a electrode for me to use.

    The front-lid is made of Stavax too, for it's rust-resistant properties.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-13-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-14-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-15-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-16-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-17-jpg


    While the sinker-EDM was running I made the drawbar in the lathe.

    It is made of Uddeholm Impax Supreme.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-18-jpg


    I sent all the Orvar and Stavax parts off to tempering! Now there around 52HRC hardness. Nice!

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-19-jpg


    Now the precision work begins! For higher parallelness, I began with grinding the magnetic table.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-20-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-21-jpg


    Surface grinding the parts to tolerance on both sides.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-22-jpg


    The spacer rings between the front AC-bearings need to have a really tight parallel tolerance, I measured the parallelism against a flat-surface and a 1µm dial-indicator. I measured the parallelism to 2µm on the bigger ring, on the smaller one it is 1µm. Yeah, I'm happy with the result.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-25-jpg


    Then off to the cylindrical grinder.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-23-jpg


    Mmmmmmmm... Ground parts!

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-24-jpg


    And they fit, too!

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-26-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-27-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-28-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-29-jpg


    Measuring the axial-play in the labyrinth seal, turned out perfect!

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-30-jpg


    Some ground and "to be ground" parts for the gripper assembly.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-31-jpg


    Time to grind the spindle shaft!

    First of all, I started grinding the tapered bearing-seat for the roller-bearing and measuring the taper in the measuring machine.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-32-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-33-jpg


    Some hours later, it was finally done! And my god it is beautiful.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-34-jpg


    Next up, the test bar! Ground in a single clamping to get 0 run-out.(or atleast verrrryyyy little run-out)

    Made a short video confirming this.


    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-35-jpg


    Ground some small parts for the gripper.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-36-jpg


    I bought a roller bearing and some lock-nuts for the spindle.

    The roller bearing is a SKF NU 208 ECKP-C3, (I wanted a bearing with lesser play, but the only one they got was with C3 play, oh well.) This bearing is kinda special too, because of it's tapered bearing seat (1:12 taper).

    The nuts are SKF KMT 10 and SKF KMT 8, high-precision locknuts.

    I already got 2x SKF 7210 BEGAP AC-bearings from my previous spindle build, I'm re-using those.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-37-jpg


    Time to grind the thread for the lock-nuts! Yes, I said grind...

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-38-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-39-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-40-jpg


    When the ATC is in progress, you want a stream of air to clean the taper, made a small hole (~1.3mm) through the drawbar to get that stream of air.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-41-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-42-jpg


    Just for fun, I tried mounting the AC-bearings and the spacer rings and check the run-out of the bearings.

    Yeah, I'm quite happy with the result.


    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-43-jpg


    Ground the tool taper - check.

    Run-out of the bearing seats was around ~1-2µm.

    Feels like the run-out of this spindle is going to be really minimal. My guess/hopes are around 10µm, 200mm out from the taper(that's the length of the test bar).

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-50-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-51-jpg


    Time to sinker-EDM the large hole in the spindle for the drawbar assembly.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-44-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-45-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-46-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-47-jpg


    And sinker-EDM the thread to hold the gripper assembly in place.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-48-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-49-jpg


    A huge chunk of Uddeholm Impax, will be the spindle housing! Raw material weighs 23.3kg!

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-52-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-53-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-54-jpg


    First tempo done. Should weight around 16-17kg.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-55-jpg


    Did the next tempo in the CNC-mill. Milled in the height and front diameter +0.2mm saved for grinding.

    Also drilled 2 holes thru the whole housing, those holes will be used as starting-holes for the wire-EDM.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-56-jpg


    Ground 2 electrodes to sinker-EDM the space where the gripper opens.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-57-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-58-jpg


    Made some drive dogs, they are made of Impax.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-59-jpg


    Milled the electrodes for the "drive dog track" for the spindle.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-60-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-61-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-62-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-63-jpg


    Milled and sinker-EDM some drainage tracks for the front-lid, so liquids don't enter/get stuck in the labyrint seal.

    Then I polished it.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-64-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-65-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-66-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-67-jpg


    Time to fit the roller-bearing. Right now there is ~0.07mm radial play in that bearing, but I want a preload of a few µm. That's why the bearing seat have a 1:12 taper, the harder I tighten the nut the more the inner ring expands. That's why I need a spacer ring, ground to tolerance beneath the roller bearing so I don't over-tighten the nut and get too much preload.

    I used a dial indicator with 1µm resolution to check the radial clearance in the bearing, then I tightened the nut more and more until I got a pre-load. Then I measured the distance beneath the bearing with gauge blocks.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-68-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-69-jpg


    Lathed, ground and sinker-EDM the gripper, All that's left is to split it in the wire-EDM.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-70-jpg


    Just for fun, I assembled most if the stuff I could. I can promise you, this is a sturdy piece of metal!

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-71-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-72-jpg


    Well, that's a few months work up til' now, hope you like it so far!

    I'm going to start wire-EDM earliest next week.

    If you have any questions or design improvements(It might be a little late for that now but one of the reasons I'm making this spindle is to learn something), feel free to tell me!

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Wow.Beautiful work.Makes you appreciate what goes into the making of a spindle.As you say you have the machines and more importantly you know how to use them.Thank you for the pictures.
    What improvements did you make from the first spindle you made?



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Intense tools and skills you have going.
    My spindle has like 3 bellview set washer stack, I see like 15 in your drawing.
    Anyway very impressive work.
    md



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Impressive.
    Now how much for one?



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Thanks guys, I'm glad you like it so far! Right now the housing is being wire-EDM'd. I'll show a pic in a day or so.



    shedbob, About the design, here is the new vs the old one. Quite the difference if you ask me, hehe. Not only that, the shaft was made from some unknown steelbar, non tempered, the taper compared to the bearing seats had a lot of run-out, back-bearing no pre-loading, and so on...

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-untitled-1-jpg


    mountaindew, I use 93 springs, 3 stacked parallel in 31 groups. At 50% compression one spring generates around 1000N force, I need around 3000N force, that's why I use 3 in parallel. I can't compress the spring more than 75% for maximum lifetime, the compression length between 50% and 75% is 0.125mm. I need around 3.5mm stroke + some safety margin, that's why I chose 31 stacks, that way I'll get around 3.9mm stroke and a force of 3000N.


    hjl4, Sorry, but it's not for sale.



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Amazing build, thanks for showing it in such a detail...!


    Pablo

    ● Distribuidor Syil en Argentina ● "www.syil.com.ar" ●


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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    I kind of figured "Not for sale".
    But if you made more then one, I bet you people would be interested.
    Business potential?



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    PEU, Thanks man!

    hjl4, Well, the thing is it would've been just as expensive or expensiver as a "real" BT30 spindle. The amount of time i put into this spindle is huge! And because more or less all the stuff i do is in manual machines it doesn't go quicker to make one or 10 spindles. And one more reason, I don't want to "mass produce" stuff for others at my job, I got the great privilege to use the machines after work, I wouldn't want to loose that for anything.



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    When I got to work this morning the wire-edm had only run halfway, started it again after work. It SHOULD be done tomorrow morning.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000246-jpg



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    So we share that Privileg great
    Question do you do wire EDM at home and if Yes is it a build or bought one ? EDM is now on my List ..



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Tkamster: Lol, I don't own a wire-EDM, my job got one. :P



    Here we go! Wire-EDMing done!

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000250-jpg


    Started machining the first bearing seat, got really bad surface finish, but that doesn't matter, will grind it later. :P

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000257-jpg



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Time for another update!

    Milled the back bearing seat in the housing today, left some material for grinding.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000261-jpg

    I also made a "clamping plate" for the grinder/housing for better clamping when grinding.

    I MIGHT start the cylindrical grinding tomorrow, if not then i'll do it in 2 weeks.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000258-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000259-jpg



  13. #13
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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Hi is it RAM or wire EDM ,..



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    RAM? The only RAM I know is for computers, haha!

    It's a wire-EDM.



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    looks like he has wire and ram / sinker edms.



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Now i am jealous ,..



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    The gripper is finally done!

    There was a slight problem when splitting the part tho, wasn't clamped good enough so it moved.(check the pic below, you can see a mark in one of the petals.) But I think i'll work anyway, I really don't want to make another one... Took me 2 full days to make this one.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000293-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000292-jpg

    Here's the gripper assembled.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000296-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000298-jpg

    And a inside shot, too.

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000301-jpg

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000302-jpg

    And it works too!

    BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.-wp_000288-jpg


    I tried grinding the housing in the manual grinder a week ago but the machine was too weak(actually, the morse taper is too weak which holds the magnetic chuck).

    I asked my colleague if he could help me in the cnc cylindrical grinder, he agreed. He was going to help me today but had a job rigged in the machine, we'll see next week if he's able to help me.



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Great work question are your grippers hardened ? And did you use a plan or did you Design it yourself ?



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Thanks man! It's made of Uddeholm Impax, a pre-hardened tool steel; should be around ~30HRC. Tho I'm thinking about plasma nitride these to get a hard surface, around ~58HRC if I remember correct.

    Yes, I designed this myself, in fact every part in this spindle beside the bearings and the bearing nuts is my design. Tho I did a lot of research, looking at commercial spindles and such when designing it.



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    Default Re: BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

    Cool i also about to do similar at existing iso 30 spindle to factor atc able ,..



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BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.

BT30 spindle built from scratch, with ATC possibility.