Problem 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning


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Thread: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

  1. #1

    Default 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Yesterday my 1-1/2 year old 1100M developed a Y axis groaning/growling noise. Thought for sure it was a bad ball nut the way it sounded. First I checked the ball nut bolts, the coupling bolts and the motor mount bolts. All were tight. There was no visual damage to the portion of the ball screw that I could see. On a whim I shut the machine down and restarted it and the noise went away. That was temporary as it did come back after a few minutes of machining time. Repeated the shutdown/restart and no noise until I ran a tool path. I'm now thinking it could be control related. I shut down and opened the electrical cabinet and did a visual inspection paying attention to the Y axis driver and wiring. Disconnected the wire connector and didn't notice anything unusual. Reseated the connector and made sure it was properly seated. Checked the Y axis wiring terminations to make sure they were tight. Started the machine and the noise comes back after a few minutes of run time. No lost steps that I could determine. X and Z axis are fine; smooth and quiet. That's the history.

    Anyone experience this type of problem? Could it be a bad driver?

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Perplexing. Can you jog back and forth without the noise? If it doesn't make noise when jogging, do a PP routine to machine a pocket (in air) or something? Good luck, Bruce



  3. #3

    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Quote Originally Posted by BGHansen View Post
    Perplexing. Can you jog back and forth without the noise? If it doesn't make noise when jogging, do a PP routine to machine a pocket (in air) or something? Good luck, Bruce
    Once the noise starts it's there while jogging and at cutting speeds. Not as noticeable at the slower speeds though, but it's still there.

    I opened a ticket with Tormach. That was an experience. Waiting to hear back from them.



  4. #4
    Member AUSTINMACHINING's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pastaman View Post
    Once the noise starts it's there while jogging and at cutting speeds. Not as noticeable at the slower speeds though, but it's still there.

    I opened a ticket with Tormach. That was an experience. Waiting to hear back from them.
    Not sure how Tormach is built, but I had a Novakon that did same thing on X axis. The non driven end of the ball screw went through a bushing on the other end. Coolant washed all the grease out and it would howel at higher rpm/speed.



  5. #5

    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    I did more testing today confirming that the bus board was getting the proper voltage, 72.5 VDC and the resistance through the motor windings was within range. At a loss as what to do next I jumped on the net and found a blurb that said drivers can act up if they get too hot. Now my shop was in the low 80's and the Tormach site requirements list the upper temperature as 100 deg F. And the electrical cabinet cooling fan sits directly above the Y axis driver so ambient air is blowing directly on the driver. For the hell of it I opened the electrical cabinet door and pointed a 20" box fan at the drivers. The Y axis was making the growling noise when I started the fan and a few minutes later there was no growling noise. I didn't shut down and restart either. Obviously the Y axis driver is sensitive to temperature. The question I have is the driver ready to fail or just temperature sensitive? I'm hoping Tormach will call me Monday and answer that question.



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    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Quote Originally Posted by pastaman View Post
    I did more testing today confirming that the bus board was getting the proper voltage, 72.5 VDC and the resistance through the motor windings was within range. At a loss as what to do next I jumped on the net and found a blurb that said drivers can act up if they get too hot. Now my shop was in the low 80's and the Tormach site requirements list the upper temperature as 100 deg F. And the electrical cabinet cooling fan sits directly above the Y axis driver so ambient air is blowing directly on the driver. For the hell of it I opened the electrical cabinet door and pointed a 20" box fan at the drivers. The Y axis was making the growling noise when I started the fan and a few minutes later there was no growling noise. I didn't shut down and restart either. Obviously the Y axis driver is sensitive to temperature. The question I have is the driver ready to fail or just temperature sensitive? I'm hoping Tormach will call me Monday and answer that question.
    This.looks to be what happened to me. X axis was getting hot from use and the yellow and red wires started arcing and burned the connector.
    First time I inspected every thing it was like you said OK, went step by step thru the manual. so I figured it was a sticky gib and went thru lube system to check for good operation. Couple days later I started machine and went to home it, noise come back and it ignored limit switches and I had to estop machine. It then would not jog off limit switch. I had to take everything off table vise and 4th axis and motor coupler housing and turn move axis by hand back over limit switch.
    Tried one more time and it did same thing. I opened cabinet and at that point I could see the burned connector that I had not seen before. I thought I just missed it but now think the damage come from the last time I tried to home it.
    ordered and replaced leadshine drive and all is back to normal.



  7. #7

    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Quote Originally Posted by mountaindew View Post
    This.looks to be what happened to me. X axis was getting hot from use and the yellow and red wires started arcing and burned the connector.
    First time I inspected every thing it was like you said OK, went step by step thru the manual. so I figured it was a sticky gib and went thru lube system to check for good operation. Couple days later I started machine and went to home it, noise come back and it ignored limit switches and I had to estop machine. It then would not jog off limit switch. I had to take everything off table vise and 4th axis and motor coupler housing and turn move axis by hand back over limit switch.
    Tried one more time and it did same thing. I opened cabinet and at that point I could see the burned connector that I had not seen before. I thought I just missed it but now think the damage come from the last time I tried to home it.
    ordered and replaced leadshine drive and all is back to normal.
    I'm thinking that's what I'll be doing, ordering another driver, or I'm hoping Tormach will have pity on me and send me one.

    I did read yours and Popspipes posts about the burned connector. I've looked at my connectors several times to make sure I didn't miss anything. They look like new.



  8. #8
    Member mountaindew's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Quote Originally Posted by pastaman View Post
    I'm thinking that's what I'll be doing, ordering another driver, or I'm hoping Tormach will have pity on me and send me one.

    I did read yours and Popspipes posts about the burned connector. I've looked at my connectors several times to make sure I didn't miss anything. They look like new.
    I was able to keep my x working for a while and was testing it while sizing stock. When it did fail bad it did it when machine was cold and it made bad noise and ignored the home switch and went right over it. I' was shaking my head and at that point I had no control and it only jogged one direction no matter what I did.
    My mill is in a mostly air conditioned shop and temps never get very high. And if they did I would shut down and just draw stuff. But this summer they did and I ran mill anyway. I also had my 200lb 4th axis and 100lb vise on table, thinking this might have added to the driver stress. I was even looking over my last couple of projects for tool paths and my habits for swarf control to see if I was stressing x. But this didn't seam to be the case. Y axis was moving more then any.
    I was glad or I hope this fixed it long term anyway. The diagnostic tree in manual pointed to more expensive fixes.
    My mill has been running for just under 8 years and im thinking it would be good idea to keep some extra parts around like a driver, stepper and limit switch and i will most likely place another order. These days with supply chain disruptions it would be a pain for mill to be down for weeks.



  9. #9

    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    I noticed that the driver dip switches are set for 8.3A (peak current)/5.9A( RMS), which is the max driver current setting, and the standstill current switch is set to ON. The OFF setting reduces idle current draw about 40%. Does anyone know if these are the correct settings? Reducing the current to the next lower setting and changing the standstill current to OFF will reduce motor and driver heating.



  10. #10
    Member kstrauss's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Do you have a Leadshine part number (Tormach PN: 32000) for the replacement driver? Tormach's charges for shipments to Canada seem excessive.



  11. #11

    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Quote Originally Posted by kstrauss View Post
    Do you have a Leadshine part number (Tormach PN: 32000) for the replacement driver? Tormach's charges for shipments to Canada seem excessive.
    That's the part number on my existing drivers. Probably going to end up ordering one.

    Tormach Tech Support contacted me this morning and I spent the day running tests and feeding them the results. Nothing has changed with the recurring Y axis growling sound; run the machine for a few minutes and it begins growling, wait a few minutes and it goes away. I did the driver swap and I couldn't reproduce the noise. When I swapped the green connector and the ribbon connector back to their original locations the Y axis driver alarm light is now on. Not sure if this is a connection issue or the driver died.

    Edit: Yes, I do have a Leadshine part/model number. It's a 3ND833. The difference is it doesn't have a ribbon connector like the Tormach driver. As best I can tell the green connector for the power and motor wires is the same.



  12. #12

    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    I installed a new Y axis driver and after running the machine a couple of hours there is no evidence of the Y axis growling noise. It appears to be fixed.

    When I first got my mill internal and external radii surface finish had unacceptable faceting. Tormach tech support made some suggestions and it did improve but still not good. I use F360 and turn on the Feed Optimization feature and this helps but I have to slow the feedrate down to 2 - 3 IPM to get an acceptable finish. In yesterday's run Feed Optimization was turned off and the finish was excellent. Can a bad driver affect surface finish?



  13. #13
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    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Tormach Tech Support called me this morning, and I spent the day conducting testing and reporting back to them. The recurrent Y axis growling sound hasn't changed; run the machine for a few minutes and it starts growling, then wait a few minutes and it stops. I tried swapping drivers but couldn't replicate the noise. The Y axis driver alert light came on after I switched the green and ribbon connectors back to their original places. I'm not sure if the problem is with the connection or if the driver has died.
    .io games



  14. #14

    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Quote Originally Posted by pastaman View Post
    Can a bad driver affect surface finish?
    Absolutely. Any interruption in motor commands would effect surface finish, and those motor commands are all sent by the driver.



  15. #15

    Default Re: 1100M Y Axis Growling/Groaning

    Quote Originally Posted by footpetaljones View Post
    Absolutely. Any interruption in motor commands would effect surface finish, and those motor commands are all sent by the driver.
    Thanks for confirming this. I may have a warranty claim. Hopefully I can convince Tormach to issue me a credit for the driver I just bought.



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