440 spindle break in needed ?


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Thread: 440 spindle break in needed ?

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    Default 440 spindle break in needed ?

    I'm expecting my controller next week so I'll finally get to use my new 440 .
    I've looked in the manual and can't find a thing about if the spindle bearings need a run in period before use , or if it just needs 10 or 15 minutes at a slow speed to get the lube warmed up and moving around .

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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    for break in on any mill it is wise to run the spindle from low to high speed in increments of 500-1000 rpm over at least and hour long period . If I remember right haas is 2-2.5 hrs for break in
    After that then it doesn't hurt to do a spindle warm up each time before machining , but , it's not totally necessary . I don't see any thermal expansion on the 440's as I do with one of my other mills



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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Yabbadabbadoo View Post
    I'm expecting my controller next week so I'll finally get to use my new 440 .
    I've looked in the manual and can't find a thing about if the spindle bearings need a run in period before use , or if it just needs 10 or 15 minutes at a slow speed to get the lube warmed up and moving around .
    It may need a run to spread the grease around, these machines are normally run before shipping, so just a general run / warm up is always a good idea

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    I was hoping that because there wasn't any mention of a break in procedure that it had already been done , I'll still give it a short run in . It can't hurt any .

    I took the front way cover off , I'm glad I did .
    Crappy cosmoline all over the place , so the rest of covers are coming off once I can move it under power



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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    It may need a run to spread the grease around, these machines are normally run before shipping, so just a general run / warm up is always a good idea
    My 24r router spindle did not sound good for the first few seconds. Now you cant even hear its turning at any rpm until it starts cutting.
    i figured the lube had settled in bearings from heat and shipping.
    it had a short break in detailed in manual. old 1100 mill didnt detail any break in or warm up but it only runs 5k speed.



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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    Quote Originally Posted by mountaindew View Post
    My 24r router spindle did not sound good for the first few seconds. Now you cant even hear its turning at any rpm until it starts cutting.
    i figured the lube had settled in bearings from heat and shipping.
    it had a short break in detailed in manual. old 1100 mill didnt detail any break in or warm up but it only runs 5k speed.
    2 completely different spindle designs, the 440 runs at up to 10,000 RPM your high speed spindle is 24,000 RPM and has a different Bearing configuration so yes needs to be run through a RPM cycle every time you use it, the 440 should also have a run cycle before use if he is going up in the high RPMs if only being used in the low RPM range up to 5,000 RPM then he only need a short cycle up to the highest RPM he is using

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    mine have never seen a warm up cycle other than the initial break in . If they were to sit for any extended periods of time then I'd probably run a 15 minute warm up



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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    Quote Originally Posted by metalmayhem View Post
    mine have never seen a warm up cycle other than the initial break in . If they were to sit for any extended periods of time then I'd probably run a 15 minute warm up
    If you have the 1100 machine then it would not matter at all, they did not have a 10,000 RPM spindle

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    I thought we were talking about the 440

    My torus is only 6000rpm and if it is cool it needs a warm up , otherwise the thermal expansion is noticeable on the parts . I don't get that happening with the 440's which are fired up at 10k out of the gate



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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    Quote Originally Posted by metalmayhem View Post
    I thought we were talking about the 440

    My torus is only 6000rpm and if it is cool it needs a warm up , otherwise the thermal expansion is noticeable on the parts . I don't get that happening with the 440's which are fired up at 10k out of the gate
    You mentioned the 1100 in your posts, it all depend on the spindle design as to which way the thermal expansion affects the spindle, they all have thermal expansion, no matter what spindle or machine you have

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    I didn't say anything about 1100 and I don't have one to compare with , I only stated that I don't see thermal expansion as I do with one of my other mills .

    Thermal expansion is the nature of the beast . While some machinery the expansion is noticeable , others aren't unless a guy is working within extreme tolerances . The 440's appear to be set up in a way that expansion is extremely minimal and not noticeable on everyday parts , and a spindle warm up is not all that necessary unless the machine sits for long periods of time .



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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    Quote Originally Posted by metalmayhem View Post
    I didn't say anything about 1100 and I don't have one to compare with , I only stated that I don't see thermal expansion as I do with one of my other mills .

    Thermal expansion is the nature of the beast . While some machinery the expansion is noticeable , others aren't unless a guy is working within extreme tolerances . The 440's appear to be set up in a way that expansion is extremely minimal and not noticeable on everyday parts , and a spindle warm up is not all that necessary unless the machine sits for long periods of time .
    Should of looked more carefully it was another poster mountaindew that was posting 1100 machine

    Hobby type machines yes they don't normally need a warm up, after they have been run, a simple warmup though can add life to the Bearings, as I said thermal expansion is happening to all machine spindles even your 440 it is going upwards instead of down, that is why you don't notice very much in your part Z depth change, been building spindles and Bearings for more than 20 years, it's all in the design as to where the expansion goes, and how accurate the Z axis positioning is, It's not always the spindle that causes Z depth to change as things heat up

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    How does your 440 react to the difference between a spindle warm up vs not



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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    I'm all hooked up and chips flying so ... no need to argue

    I did run a short break in cycle , started at 500 and went up in 500 rpm increments every 5 minutes .
    It started quiet and ended quiet so that's all it'll get .

    Spindle barely got warm to the touch .



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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    awesome , have fun



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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    Should of looked more carefully it was another poster mountaindew that was posting 1100 machine

    Hobby type machines yes they don't normally need a warm up, after they have been run, a simple warmup though can add life to the Bearings, as I said thermal expansion is happening to all machine spindles even your 440 it is going upwards instead of down, that is why you don't notice very much in your part Z depth change, been building spindles and Bearings for more than 20 years, it's all in the design as to where the expansion goes, and how accurate the Z axis positioning is, It's not always the spindle that causes Z depth to change as things heat up

    I referenced instruction manual of router only as an informative guide as to what it recommended. When information is incomplete I tend to look at what other tools require as a guide to how to service or use a similar cnc tool.

    I quoted mactec's post only because he referenced a possible lube issue as a reason for running spindle and breaking it in. This is what I think I experienced with the router spindle. And thus a good idea to follow directions.

    And I only mentioned and referenced 1100 because instruction manual did not detail much of anything about anything! Leaving a new user guessing about every step of the setup and running process. Some of the setup and install instructions years ago like power draw bar install. Did not even exist or were not helpful. Tormach does a better job now, but still could improve a great deal.

    final note: if I chase accuracy it is always on z axis!
    a very short list of problems i see !
    tts system, offline measure, holder flex, fully seated holder, tool pull out, holder pull out...........



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    Default Re: 440 spindle break in needed ?

    Quote Originally Posted by mountaindew View Post
    And I only mentioned and referenced 1100 because instruction manual did not detail much of anything about anything! Leaving a new user guessing about every step of the setup and running process....
    It would be good if they provided that kind of information , or better yet that info along with there being a warm up/break in program in pathpilot . A full warm up program which ramps up the spindle speed and has all axis in motion is ideal for getting the juices flowing



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