Pcnc 440 questions


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  1. #1
    Member Portlyinohio's Avatar
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    Default Pcnc 440 questions

    I'm super happy with my 770 , so happy that I've been telling everyone I know exactly how happy i am .
    Because of that word has gotten around that I have a cnc mill and this morning I was offered some work .
    It's a short term job that pays pretty decent , but would tie up my 770 for 4-5 weeks and I don't want to put my own work that far behind
    The pay is good enough that I could buy a basic 440 , run The job and pay for the machine while still putting a nice chunk of change in my pocket.
    The parts are rather simple , not super high accuracy and only need a single tool to make .

    So ... to make it work and keep as much cash in my pocket as possible I would want to avoid buying a stand .

    I currently have two possible solutions , one is bolting it down on top of my snap on tool cabinet that has a 1.5 inch thick maple top .
    The other is mounting it onto the cast iron table saw I use for a work bench .

    Thoughts ?

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    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    If you need flood cooling, that comes down from the front-center of the tray. You can't flood cool if it's not on a stand with raised bosses so the tubing can route down under it. If you use air or mist, it'll be fine anyway.
    Also, the power draw bar uses a mechanical pneumatic button that you hold in while changing the tool, not an electric button that goes on/off. Not a big deal, but another difference from the bigger brethren.
    Cast iron table is likely more rigid than a toolbox. The 440 stand is like a toolchest, but has additional flat steel bars that get clamped in to stiffen it up.



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    Member Portlyinohio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    Won't be using flood coolant or a power draw bar so no worries there .
    I was considering using the tool cabinet because it's quite a bit higher then the cast iron table saw work bench .
    Be easier to change parts and tools etc etc etc .
    Plus as I don't plan on it being a permanent installation it would be a lot easier to plug the mounting holes on a wood butcher block then a cast iron table .



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    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    If your part involves tool changes, then it's SOOO worth it to have the power draw bar. (I ran a 1100 with wrench tool changer for a long time; the PDB is such a huge upgrade for a relatively low cost!)

    If you want to use the maple, you could probably drill some holes in some 1/2"x1 1/2" flat bar to make two rails for it to stand on, to give it a little more footprint surface area for rigidity. E g, you'd place the bars on the maple top, place the mill on the bars, and bolt the mill to the maple through the holes in the bars.

    Sounds like you came into a nice job there, so good luck! :-)



  5. #5
    Member Portlyinohio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    Yea I did luck into it , I guess the shop that usually does them is closed for virus and no one else wants to do the job or can't do it in a timely manner .

    I'm trying my best to crunch the numbers without screwing myself
    , having had a bit more experience would make this a lot easier .
    But I think I can buy a 440 , pay for the tools and still put about $450-500 a week into my pocket , and still have a bit of a margin in case I have a few screw ups

    Using some flat bar doesn't sound like a bad idea , I have a small shop 21'x 21' I don't really have extra room for another machine on its own stand .
    And I use the table saw work bench a whole lot and don't really want to give it up .
    Maybe someday I'll hit the lottery and be able to build a bigger building .



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    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    I use this table for my 440: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00LY1ADTM/

    I drilled holes in it and bolted the 440 down, shimming for tram.



  7. #7

    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    Find somebody with a machine who can help you make the parts. You might only make 15% profit, but you've done very little work and you get to keep your long term customers happy.



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    Member Portlyinohio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    Keeping my long term customers happy is my priority .

    Maybe I'm looking at this wrong , I see it as an opportunity to make a few bucks and at the same time get a back up machine that is small enough to put on a dolly and stick it in my spare bedroom closet when the job is done ... without going out of pocket .
    And a person never knows , it might lead into more work in the future .
    As far as just subbing out the work , I'd be more inclined to just say no .

    Another option that I don't like as much because the whole idea of getting the 770 was to not work as many hours would be to just commit to working 75-80 hours a week till the jobs done .

    As a person who has quickly come to appreciate his leisure time
    That isn't a very welcome option .
    Spending the money on a second machine and still making a fair wage on top of that is pretty attractive .

    There's also a time factor , come Tuesday or Wednesday I'll have to poop or get off the pot .
    The customer is offering enough cash up front to pay for the machine , but figure in 4 weeks to get the machine and I don't have a lot of time to make up my mind .
    Obviously I'm not good at making snap decisions.

    The biggest attraction to me is getting an extra machine that I could set back up in an afternoon in case I ever have a seriously bad screw up with the 770 ...



  9. #9

    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    There is a 440 for sale in the tormach buy and sell group on FB. Its in Kentucky. Person is asking $7k

    Anyone want to buy a 440?
    It has the enclosure and the cabinet pedestal.
    Has path pilot controller
    Has a vise and tool holder kit
    Chip pan
    Water proof led light
    Comes with an extra new way cover for the front
    Does not come with the smart cool kit unless you want to work something out
    $12,000 when bought new
    Deck has been sprayed with corrosive guard as you can see in the pics
    Bought it from a friend In hopes to use it but just haven’t had time.



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    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    Having two machines next to each other would be nice; one can square stock while the other is doing cutting, for example.
    Or one doing the final decking off while the second one does the main cutting of the part.
    Depends what your work looks like, of course, but two spindles COULD mean a permanent improvement in throughput.

    Also, I believe the Section 179 "you get to write off machine investments right away instead of having to depreciate them" tax rules are still in effect, in which case there's not even any tax consequence of taking the money now but buying a long-lived machine. (Don't quote me on this though -- check with whatever tax authority you usually rely on.)



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    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    From the general sound of the way you work, privately in a small space on your own terms, I'd just jump on it right now before the weekend and get on with it. Sooner you have the job nailed sooner you can have the spare machine. You'll find a way to keep it set up... you know you will. And if you are trying to run a fixed amount of free time the extra machine as everyone has said is only going to help you knock out all the time consuming secondary ops and stock prep while the 770 is chunking away on the long ops.

    Get on with it! If opportunity is knocking and it's paying cash and nothing out of your pocket to add a machine... why the heck not? Few weeks of your time AND you make money besides? Worth it.



  12. #12
    Member Portlyinohio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    I decided to quit waffling and jump on the opportunity , maybe once it's here I'll get rid of my little horizontal mill or shaper
    It's a tough decision , I don't use either of the two very often .but I still covet them .



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    Default Re: Pcnc 440 questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Portlyinohio View Post
    I decided to quit waffling and jump on the opportunity , maybe once it's here I'll get rid of my little horizontal mill or shaper
    It's a tough decision , I don't use either of the two very often .but I still covet them .
    I sold off a Clausing horizontal mill and Rhodes shaper/slotter several years ago to make room for a Tormach lathe and haven't missed the sold off machines at all. But it all depends on what tools you need and for me, the decision was pretty easy. Good luck with whatever you decide to do.



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