Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver


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Thread: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

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    Default Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    I have a Grizzly G0720R (Sieg SX4) and like many of these, the spindle motor controller doesn’t work. Instead of wasting my time with a board that will just break again, I ordered a new motor/driver from Alibaba.

    The new motor is a “Hishine 2200W 6000 RPM motor”. The documentation is almost unintelligible. I have no idea if it’s working properly or not. I hooked it up according to the wiring diagram but it sounds very rough.

    Here’s a video of it:

    https://youtu.be/1DeY9XZA53g

    The controller says it’s an AC Servo driver. The manual seems to list different modes it has, and lists different parameters that can be configured such as motor pole pairs and amperage, but gives no explanation how you can even configure this. The front panel only has MODE and SET, and just switches back between 2 different screens.

    Are the parameters configured correctly from the factory since they sent me both the motor and the driver? Does anyone know how to set this up?

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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    It sounds like the Hall sensor wires might be connected in a wrong order. Are the motor wires labeled (U-V-W for the motor windings and A-B-C for the hall sensor)?



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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    The wires are connected according to the wiring diagram, but I have no idea if the wiring diagram is correct.

    I'll include more information. I've attached the manual for the motor, driver, and the wiring schematic as well as a picture of the driver wired up. One thing that's confusing to me is that the motor says it's a BLDC motor, the driver manual says it's a brushless DC driver, but the driver itself says it's an AC Servo driver. But I've seen people say that there's no difference anymore, since a brushless DC motor essentially is a 3 phase AC motor. I'm kind of confused by all of this.

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver-wiringdiagram-png   Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver-img_6362-jpg  
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    Last edited by Mzrshall; 04-24-2021 at 10:47 AM.


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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    I had wire colors mixed up in a different BLDC driver, so the colors are not 100% guarantee. I suggest you try all 6 possible combinations of U-V-W wiring order. A wrong combination will not fry anything, just try it at a low speed and don't crank it all the way up.



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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    I did try the different combinations the other day while trying to figure it out, and a couple of them the motor wouldn't turn at all, while others the motor was even louder. I couldn't find a combination that was quiet. I was wondering if the driver knows how many poles there are since the manual does mention configuring the driver for that. But I don't know how to get to those menus.



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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    Quote Originally Posted by Mzrshall View Post
    The wires are connected according to the wiring diagram, but I have no idea if the wiring diagram is correct.

    I'll include more information. I've attached the manual for the motor, driver, and the wiring schematic as well as a picture of the driver wired up. One thing that's confusing to me is that the motor says it's a BLDC motor, the driver manual says it's a brushless DC driver, but the driver itself says it's an AC Servo driver. But I've seen people say that there's no difference anymore, since a brushless DC motor essentially is a 3 phase AC motor. I'm kind of confused by all of this.
    Your input Power wiring is incorrect L1 and L2 is the connection for 240v single phase you have added a jumper which could cause problems unless it is ok by design, if it was it would not be used in this way

    If you are in NA and using 240v single phase then you can not use a white wire as the Live power wire it must be covered with shrink tubing or Black tape

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    Quote Originally Posted by Mzrshall View Post
    I did try the different combinations the other day while trying to figure it out, and a couple of them the motor wouldn't turn at all, while others the motor was even louder. I couldn't find a combination that was quiet. I was wondering if the driver knows how many poles there are since the manual does mention configuring the driver for that. But I don't know how to get to those menus.
    It is in the manual you need to add some of the motor spec's the Pole # is FN045 You can check your motor number of poles, with the power off cross any 2 wires of the U V W and bump test by turning the motor shaft to see how many bumps per rev that is your pole count, so the parameter may be listed as pairs so the number for that parameter would be half of what your count was so 4 bumps would be 2 pairs Parameter =2

    Usually when a motor like this makes a lot of noise is that the Gain is set incorrect

    As for the servo drives being the same that would be a stretch of the imagination, there are some servo drives that can run both but this is not the norm

    Mactec54


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    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    Your input Power wiring is incorrect L1 and L2 is the connection for 240v single phase you have added a jumper which could cause problems unless it is ok by design, if it was it would not be used in this way

    If you are in NA and using 240v single phase then you can not use a white wire as the Live power wire it must be covered with shrink tubing or Black tape
    The wiring diagram instructs you to put that jumper there. Normally in the US we use a split phase where we use half of the phase. The peak to the center tap (neutral) is 120v. If you use the full phase the + peak to - peak is 240 volts.

    This is right isn’t it? It “sounds” right to me but I’ve been wrong once before.



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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    Quote Originally Posted by Mzrshall View Post
    The wiring diagram instructs you to put that jumper there. Normally in the US we use a split phase where we use half of the phase. The peak to the center tap (neutral) is 120v. If you use the full phase the + peak to - peak is 240 volts.

    This is right isn’t it? It “sounds” right to me but I’ve been wrong once before.
    Not by the PDF Manual , they are showing it wired for 3 Phase and single phase

    Single Phase NA 220/240v is 2 Hot wires No neutral if you have a Neutral then you only have 120v which will not run this

    240v Single Phase NA does not use a Neutral so you should have 2 Hot wires 120v each connected to L1=S L2=T any other wiring would be incorrect and may damage the Servo Drive
    The instructions are very clear how to wire it

    Remove the Jumper and hope that there is no damage

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver-l1-png  
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    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    Not by the PDF Manual , they are showing it wired for 3 Phase and single phase

    Single Phase NA 220/240v is 2 Hot wires No neutral if you have a Neutral then you only have 120v which will not run this

    240v Single Phase NA does not use a Neutral so you should have 2 Hot wires 120v each connected to L1=S L2=T any other wiring would be incorrect and may damage the Servo Drive
    The instructions are very clear how to wire it

    Remove the Jumper and hope that there is no damage
    I removed the jumper and it runs exactly the same. No better, no worse.

    The picture that shows the jumper can’t possibly be a 3 phase wiring diagram because there are only 2 phases coming out... if it was 3 phase there would be a different wire for R, S, and T.

    I do appreciate the help, btw.

    Last edited by Mzrshall; 04-24-2021 at 11:13 PM.


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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    Quote Originally Posted by Mzrshall View Post
    I removed the jumper and it runs exactly the same. No better, no worse.

    The picture that shows the jumper can’t possibly be a 3 phase wiring diagram because there are only 2 phases coming out... if it was 3 phase there would be a different wire for R, S, and T.

    I do appreciate the help, btw.
    No you are dealing with a Chinese drawing you have to know what you are looking at and it is not showing a jumper and it does not mention to use a jumper , you can not go by the picture only the PDF instruction which is very clear

    R S T Terminals on any type of drive is for 3 Phase connection, for Single Phase it is always in the manufacturer's spec's as to which Terminals to use and in your case it is S=L1 and T=L2

    It may be damaged or you may just have to set the correct Parameters for the motor spec's

    If you can't change the Parameters then there is a lock Parameter that you have to set first and then you will be able to set /change the Parameters

    Ask the manufacture for the Parameters that need to be set for that motor look only at the FN00 Parameters these are the main Parameters that will change how your motor runs

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    On the subject of the menus: I was able to get into the menus by holding down the Mode button for about 10 seconds. I took a look at the different parameters, and the motor pole setting looks to be correct.

    On the subject of the wiring: I wonder why they sent me a diagram telling me to connect it with R and T jumped? The manufacturer (Hishine) sent me that. The manual is suspect since the specs inside do not match what I'm actually seeing. For instance one of the parameters (Fn039 for motor amperage) lists a default setting of 4 and a range from 1-10. Mine was set to 80. I tried setting it to 4 and the motor couldn't rev past about 1500 rpm so I put it back to its original setting and it works fine.

    I do want to point out that regardless of the wiring, the motor and driver never got hot, never smoked or made strange noises, didn't malfunction, and no alarm was present. I would think that with 240V, if something was wired incorrectly or shorted out it would be pretty dramatic, or at the very least it would detect an error. So I think the setup is working properly, it's just a loud motor. Another thing that bothers me is that there is some grime on the motor and in the shaft keyway, which makes me think that the motor is used.



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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    I hooked up the original spindle motor to this driver to test it out. With the original settings it accelerated too rapidly, but I went into the menu and reduced the amperage down to 8 amps (instead of 80).

    It accelerates smoothly and is pretty quiet:



    Last edited by Mzrshall; 04-25-2021 at 03:12 PM.


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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    Quote Originally Posted by Mzrshall View Post
    On the subject of the menus: I was able to get into the menus by holding down the Mode button for about 10 seconds. I took a look at the different parameters, and the motor pole setting looks to be correct.

    On the subject of the wiring: I wonder why they sent me a diagram telling me to connect it with R and T jumped? The manufacturer (Hishine) sent me that. The manual is suspect since the specs inside do not match what I'm actually seeing. For instance one of the parameters (Fn039 for motor amperage) lists a default setting of 4 and a range from 1-10. Mine was set to 80. I tried setting it to 4 and the motor couldn't rev past about 1500 rpm so I put it back to its original setting and it works fine.

    I do want to point out that regardless of the wiring, the motor and driver never got hot, never smoked or made strange noises, didn't malfunction, and no alarm was present. I would think that with 240V, if something was wired incorrectly or shorted out it would be pretty dramatic, or at the very least it would detect an error. So I think the setup is working properly, it's just a loud motor. Another thing that bothers me is that there is some grime on the motor and in the shaft keyway, which makes me think that the motor is used.
    I guess who ever did that was confused as well, because that does not mean they have a jumper, it means that it could be connected to either of those 2 terminals, no Jumper in the picture they should of written the information next to the connections, English is hard for them, that is why they have a manual

    Yes this does not always cause damage to the drive, it just depends how the first stage rectifier is configured

    The Parameter's in the PDF Manual are not for your motor, they are the factory default which is normal, everyone has to set there drives to the motor spec's it they don't do it automatically when the motor is connected, or someone at sales preset the Parameters

    The amperage has to be set correct for what the motor is rated for, or you will fry the motor, 8 Amps sounds about right for that 2.2Kw motor although a little low 8.5A to 9 A is normal for that size motor this would not be 80A the drive would not get much over 12A to 14A check to see what the name plate rated Amps are if it has one

    Mactec54


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    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    I guess who ever did that was confused as well, because that does not mean they have a jumper, it means that it could be connected to either of those 2 terminals, no Jumper in the picture they should of written the information next to the connections, English is hard for them, that is why they have a manual

    Yes this does not always cause damage to the drive, it just depends how the first stage rectifier is configured

    The Parameter's in the PDF Manual are not for your motor, they are the factory default which is normal, everyone has to set there drives to the motor spec's it they don't do it automatically when the motor is connected, or someone at sales preset the Parameters

    The amperage has to be set correct for what the motor is rated for, or you will fry the motor, 8 Amps sounds about right for that 2.2Kw motor although a little low 8.5A to 9 A is normal for that size motor this would not be 80A the drive would not get much over 12A to 14A check to see what the name plate rated Amps are if it has one
    Yeah, I agree that “80 amps” seems kind of unrealistic.

    As for that jumper, the plot thickens. I found another page for essentially the same thing:

    https://designconceptschi.files.wordpress.com/2017/09/2200w-cnc-milling-spindle-kit-documentation.pdf



    Also, check out this video I found from Automation Technologies. It seems they have the same driver/motor I have, and they also wired it up with that jumper:

    https://fb.watch/55tPgPcd1u/

    If I knew he was selling this I would have just bought it from him. I got my other stuff from him and he’s very knowledgeable.

    Last edited by Mzrshall; 04-25-2021 at 03:30 PM.


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    Default Re: Need help figuring out Chinese spindle motor + driver

    Quote Originally Posted by Mzrshall View Post
    Yeah, I agree that “80 amps” seems kind of unrealistic.

    As for that jumper, the plot thickens. I found another page for essentially the same thing:

    https://designconceptschi.files.word...umentation.pdf



    Also, check out this video I found from Automation Technologies. It seems they have the same driver/motor I have, and they also wired it up with that jumper:

    https://fb.watch/55tPgPcd1u/

    If I knew he was selling this I would have just bought it from him. I got my other stuff from him and he’s very knowledgeable.
    It is just saying it can be connected to either of those Terminals that is the same snip as yours, don't go buy what they have on there site as they have just followed what you did, they know no more about what they are selling than you do at least you connected the Ground and they did not which is very unsafe even as a test run

    Yours is running without the Jumper, so this is telling you it is not required, your PDF Manual is correct on how it should be wired

    Mactec54


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