what vfd to buy for closed loop control of 7.5hp Yaskawa spindle motor?

[slodat]

As the subject says, I’m having a hard time identifying what vfd to buy for closed loop control of 7.5hp Yaskawa spindle motor? This is for a Tree Journeyman 425 milling machine. Not concerned with keeping the original control. Will be changing control out for Centroid.

Thank you in advance!

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[Jim Dawson]

This VFD would do the job and has enough reserve capacity to run your spindle at maximum power. https://www.amazon.com/Variable-Freq.../dp/B07G97DQQ5

These VFDs seem to be pretty good, top of the line Chinese if you will. I was pleasantly surprised when I opened the manual and it was actually readable, a good translation. Note that both of these VFDs are the GT series; sensorless vector control rather than the less expensive HY series with V/F control. These also support braking resistors where the HY series apparently do not.

I have its little brother running my 5HP air compressor on single phase. https://www.amazon.com/Variable-Freq...54&s=hi&sr=1-3

Both of these will run on single phase according to the ad, I know the 10HP unit does because I'm doing it. I don't know if they will support encoder feedback, can't find anything regarding that. Not really needed for a spindle motor, the sensorless vector control will handle the speed regulation just fine.

[slodat]

Thank you for the links, Jim. Seller says it outputs 220v. My motor has a max input voltage of 200v.

I see lots of references to closed loop/vendor control. Having a hard time finding drives that say they do it. Was going to go with a Fuji Frenic Mini drive. Not sure if it’s the right style drive.

[Jim Dawson]

I really wish the manufactures marketing departments would stick with one standard term describing sensorless vector control, it really confuses the specs. They call it all kinds of things trying to make their system sound better than the other guys.

A full closed loop system implies encoder/resolver or hall sensor feedback to the drive for commutation, commonly found in servo drives/permanent magnet AC motors. Something you are not going to find in most VFDs. Sensorless Vector control basically does the same thing by electrical magic in the VFD processor for induction motors.

For your application SV is just fine, you don't need closed loop vector. I do rigid tapping with mine on the lathe, but I do have an encoder on the spindle and my control supports rigid tapping. I could close the loop on my lathe VFD because I do have the encoder module installed, but I have disabled it because it wasn't working for what I wanted to do. As far as speed control, just the SV control is fine, on both my lathe and mill. I've never enabled rigid tapping on my mill, haven't needed it. When I need to thread holes on the mill, I normally do thread milling.

I haven't read through all of the parameter settings for the Huanyang VFD, but most 200V class (180 to 240V) VFDs can be set to output about 180 to 240 V, my lathe spindle is also 200V and I have my VFD set to output 200V max to match the motor nameplate.

I chose to link to the Huanyang VFDs because they meet your requirements, won't bust the budget, and I have been happy with the performance of the one I bought to run my air compressor. It has been running for about 8 months. On my lathe and mill I use Automation Direct GS3 VFDs, but the largest one they have that is rated for single phase input is 3 HP. The larger ones are 3 phase only.

[Sam_Beckham]

The automation direct G4 series will handle larger motors with single phase input but don't seem to have the option of adding an encoder card. They put one hell of a derating on them for single phase. I think you can still use rigid tapping if you send the encoder output back to the centroid control. I'm not certain about that last part though.

ETA: I'm not sure about the drive mentioned above, but you can usually set the max motor voltage in the parameters. It's P0.00 on the GS4 (0.0~255.0V)

[mactec54]

As the subject says, I’m having a hard time identifying what vfd to buy for closed loop control of 7.5hp Yaskawa spindle motor? This is for a Tree Journeyman 425 milling machine. Not concerned with keeping the original control. Will be changing control out for Centroid.

Thank you in advance!

What happened to the original VFD Drive, you should have it repaired or buy one the same a regular VFD Drive is not going to run your Yaskawa spindle motor

[slodat]

The original drive is 29 years old. I want to replace it. I just don’t know what drive to buy. I willing to buy a 20hp RPC to supply the spindle vfd.

[Jim Dawson]

.......... a regular VFD Drive is not going to run your Yaskawa spindle motor

It's a standard 4 pole induction motor, not a BLDC servo motor. A VFD will run it just fine in SV mode.

[mactec54]

It's a standard 4 pole induction motor, not a BLDC servo motor. A VFD will run it just fine in SV mode.

You are mistaken they are closer to a servo motor that a regular AC motor just the same as the Fanuc spindle motors you can't run successfully with a regular VFD Drive

The spec's on the VFD Drive tells you what the VFD Drive has to be to run this motor

[slodat]

Like I said in my first post, looking for suggestions on make/model of drive as a suitable replacement.

Applicable schematic on my machine:

[Jim Dawson]

You are mistaken they are closer to a servo motor that a regular AC motor just the same as the Fanuc spindle motors you can't run successfully with a regular VFD Drive

The spec's on the VFD Drive tells you what the VFD Drive has to be to run this motor

I disagree, I have been successfully running my lathe spindle on a GS3 VFD for the last 1.5 years. Similar specs as the Yaskawa spindle motor.

Here is the data tag on my spindle motor.

[mactec54]

The original drive is 29 years old. I want to replace it. I just don’t know what drive to buy. I willing to buy a 20hp RPC to supply the spindle vfd.

Good luck with a RPC running a VFD like this is not advisable with as they usually fry the VFD Drives

That drive will run on single Phase 240v if you have a large enough amperage supply

This drive is Saftronics or Magnetek drive made under the Yaskawa name there is a Yaskawa drive which is almost the same

The only things that need to be replace on these drives are the caps so if you where to have it serviced out of caution would be all that would be replaced

[slodat]

The drive does not power up. No display. Previous owner said it failed.

[mactec54]

I disagree, I have been successfully running my lathe spindle on a GS3 VFD for the last 1.5 years. Similar specs as the Yaskawa spindle motor.

Here is the data tag on my spindle motor.

Lucky you not all are created equal

[mactec54]

The drive does not power up. No display. Previous owner said it failed.

That's a different story so the drive needs repair with some luck it may only be the caps that have failed if the boards are not damaged then they are repairable

Where they running it with a RPC also if so this is to be expected

Phase Perfect is the only safe way to run a Drive like this

[slodat]

I don’t want to throw money at a failed 29 year old vfd. I like to replace with a new one. I need help with what drive to buy.

[Jim Dawson]

Here is the specs on the Yaskawa general purpose VFD. And repair costs, and technical documentation http://www.precisionzone.net/inverte...a/cimr-g3u27p5

The Huanyang VFDs I linked to above will work just fine in this application. I would go with the 15 HP unit to run on single phase.

[mactec54]

Here is the specs on the Yaskawa general purpose VFD. And repair costs, and technical documentation http://www.precisionzone.net/inverte...a/cimr-g3u27p5

The Huanyang VFDs I linked to above will work just fine in this application. I would go with the 15 HP unit to run on single phase.

I thought he had a varispeed VFD Drive for his spindle motor which is what is normally used for these spindles motors, It may not be the original drive for that motor, and could be why it failed, if it is then you could try any matching VFD Drive Spindle Hp x1.333=

VFD Drive sizing is HP x1.333= Drive Hp needed for single phase

It would be a push to run 15Hp VFD Drive on single phase, if he has a spare 100A single Phase supply he may get away with the 15Hp, 10Hp to 12Hp VFD Drive is normally around the limit for single Phase supply

[mactec54]

The drive does not power up. No display. Previous owner said it failed.

So the first thing you should do is call Yaskawa Tec support and ask them what Drive your spindle motor can use, they will tell you from your spindle spec's and this UAASKA-06CA1 number, what drive you will need, once you have that information you can then use that information to find a VFD Drive that is going to run your spindle

[slodat]

I've read through Yaskawa's manual for the motor. This is where I started. It states a VM3 (closed loop) vector drive, for this motor. The mill came with the G3 as shown in the photo above and this drive has no provision for encoder input.

I do see that Fuji's Frenic Mega drives has an encoder input option card. The issue I see with these drives is they have a output frequency limit of 200Hz when run closed loop vector. My motor has an encoder built in. In order to run full speed, it would need 267Hz. It did not come from the factory with a closed loop configuration with the G3 drive. I see lots of references to recommendations to run spindles closed loop.

I'm kinda lost on how to proceed. I'm concerned with the budget priced Chinese drive not working for me.