TB6564AHQ (THB6064AH) PCB design - Page 2

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Thread: TB6564AHQ (THB6064AH) PCB design

  1. #13
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    The boards are shipped and I expect them next week.

    All other parts are ordered also.
    The heatsink is a bit of a problem, the fuse is in the way for an easy mounting of readily available ones.
    I will have to drop the fuse and rearrange the components behind the chip, I searched for another type of fuse holder but can't find any, they either are partly off the board and a vertical one will interfere with some types of heatsink.
    With the fuse gone there are a lot of heatsink possibilities, from a simple 2" or 50mm wide U profile to more sofhisticated ones.

    It can be done as I did it using a "heatsink raiser block". The one you see in the pictures is a piece of one coming from a 5 phase, Berger Lahr drive.It had 10 mosfets on each side (20 total !) and a big 100 x 160mm heatsink mounted flat on top of it, I've seen similar arrangements in other equipment too.
    But it's a bit of a hassle, needs accurate drilling and tapping.

    I will need some more input before finalising: Is this the design you guys want or would there be more interest in a cheaper design with less options:
    - No optocouplers?
    - No on board voltage regulation?
    - Other?

    Please let me know.
    Luc.



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    Just a quick update:

    The layout is modified: fuse is gone, diodes moved to the center behind the heatsink and added diode for reverse polarity.

    The preliminary schematic and a PCB layout print are on my website:

    http://users.skynet.be/ldt/CNC%20ele...%20-%20PCB.pdf
    http://users.skynet.be/ldt/CNC%20ele...0Schematic.pdf

    Regards,
    Luc.



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    Quote Originally Posted by lucas View Post
    . . . .

    I will need some more input before finalising: Is this the design you guys want or would there be more interest in a cheaper design with less options:
    - No optocouplers?
    - No on board voltage regulation?
    - Other?

    Please let me know.
    Luc.
    A couple of comments.

    1. I would have thought complete opto-isolation (i.e. separate grounds) is a preferred option, to protect the PC's LPT port, so long as the selected optos have a high enough slew rate.

    2. In using the fairly robust THB6064 the worry over power sequencing is removed. I would say keep the 5v regulator to simplify connections to the board.

    3. One thing I have missed is whether or not the oscillators of multiple drivers using this chip may be/should be synchronised. If it is a requirement provision should be included.



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    A couple of thoughts:

    I don't know about the optocouplers. Since the interface is the PMinMo header, pc parallel port systems will need a break-out-board which is where the opto's can be placed. This way, the board would be a simple drop in replacement for numerous other boards using that interface, such as Linisteppers.
    (As an aside, and request, I'm love to see a 'PMinMo-plus' interface which changes pin 7 to be a fault output - low when all is well, high when the drive faults. So connect it to the Alert output of the THB6064AH. Maybe with a jumper for older systems that force pin 7 to ground.)

    Any chance of positioning the DC power in connectors to make busing a set of driver boards easier? The easiest might be V+ and GND terminals duplicated on opposite sides so that short pieces of solid copper wire could link boards together.

    Should the current adjust pot screw be side mount or top mount? I guess the pad pattern allows either.

    p.



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    The interface is indeed the PMinMo header, this one has been adopted by others like usbcnc and planet cnc, but these "expensive" boards copied the signals and don't have opto's, they need drives with opto's on board, that's why I want them also. Another reason is to be "compatible" with leadshine and many others wich also have them.
    They are optional, a few wire runs will do if you don't want them.

    I must have missed something: never heard about the 'PMinMo-plus' interface,
    this feature is very usefull, will look into it tomorrow.

    Bussing drivers is a bad idea, every drive should have its power wires connected individually to the power supply where they should join as close to the filter cap as possible.

    The current adjust pot is a critical one, imagine what would happen with the motor current if it fluctuates value.... so I used a multiple turn quality brand. I had some with side screw, there are top screw ones wich use the same layout.

    @Boldford:
    1: The opto circuit as on this drive performs excellent, not like the ones on the chinese TB6560 PCB's.
    2: I fully agree but others might have another opinion. It's always optional, don't install the regulator and related components, then it's just a matter of injecting +5V from a seperate supply into the drive without creating ground loops.
    3: Don't understand what the benefit would be, I have a vague memory of a 3 axis drive where they used only one oscillator for cost saving. I think it's impossible with this chip .

    Thanks and regards,
    Luc.



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    I know that it is better to let people think you are stupid than to open your mouth and prove them right. but I am going to open it anyway and ask this question.
    Could you not have inputted the signal to the anode of the opt diode ( cathode to gnd) and have a non inverted signal and not have the inverting transistors? I am thinking I am missing something.



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    Quote Originally Posted by lucas
    I must have missed something: never heard about the 'PMinMo-plus' interface, this feature is very usefull, will look into it tomorrow.
    No, you haven't missed anything. A PMinMo+ interface doesn't exist yet. But hopefully we can encourage its creation...

    Quote Originally Posted by lucas
    Bussing drivers is a bad idea, every drive should have its power wires connected individually to the power supply where they should join as close to the filter cap as possible.
    Yah, I figured as much. I'm too use to jumpering terminal strips together in control cabinets.

    Quote Originally Posted by lucas
    The current adjust pot is a critical one, imagine what would happen with the motor current if it fluctuates value.... so I used a multiple turn quality brand. I had some with side screw, there are top screw ones wich use the same layout.
    Absolutely multiturn, I figured something like this one.



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    Quote Originally Posted by lucas View Post
    2: I fully agree but others might have another opinion. It's always optional, don't install the regulator and related components, then it's just a matter of injecting +5V from a seperate supply into the drive without creating ground loops.
    Doesn't that also open the PCB up for use with the TB6560 (I haven't checked every pinout) and using a sequencer within the PSU?
    Quote Originally Posted by lucas
    3: Don't understand what the benefit would be, I have a vague memory of a 3 axis drive where they used only one oscillator for cost saving. I think it's impossible with this chip .
    Not for cost saving, but if not possible of no consequence. My understanding, with some drive chips, it's recommended to minimise noise in the ground plane of one drive having any effect on others. Your comments on wiring "star" fashion back to the main filter cap also significantly reduce this effect.

    Great work!



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    Quote Originally Posted by vegipete View Post
    No, you haven't missed anything. A PMinMo+ interface doesn't exist yet. But hopefully we can encourage its creation...
    It would be very nice to have the possibility to create an estop or tell Mach there's a problem.
    But this needs new BOB designs, I could include it and adapt my BOB design to support it if there's a "market".
    Why don't you start a poll in an appropriate thread?

    Quote Originally Posted by vegipete View Post
    Absolutely multiturn, I figured something like this one.
    Yes similar to this one, but there are many versions, some will increase the current if turned CCW........


    Quote Originally Posted by boldford View Post
    Doesn't that also open the PCB up for use with the TB6560 (I haven't checked every pinout) and using a sequencer within the PSU?
    The TB6560 has a different pinout and other functions like current setting are completely different. Why would you use the TB6560, do you have some stock?

    Quote Originally Posted by boldford View Post
    My understanding, with some drive chips, it's recommended to minimise noise in the ground plane of one drive having any effect on others. Your comments on wiring "star" fashion back to the main filter cap also significantly reduce this effect.
    This might be needed if a design is using 2 chips for one drive like the LMD18245 or L6203 to synchronise the currents in the 2 coils, is this what you mean?



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    Quote Originally Posted by lucas View Post
    The TB6560 has a different pinout and other functions like current setting are completely different. Why would you use the TB6560, do you have some stock?
    I was thinking of those with stock to use up on a well designed board. I.e decent optos as you indicated earlier.
    Quote Originally Posted by lucas
    This might be needed if a design is using 2 chips for one drive like the LMD18245 or L6203 to synchronise the currents in the 2 coils, is this what you mean?
    Perhaps I mis-read things but my interpretation of articles elsewhere on such matters suggest it is desirable to synchronise the currents for all drives in a system. Obviously this becomes academic if it isn't possible to slave the oscillator of one TB6564AHQ/THB6064AH to another. I was thinking of the synchronisation to be in a broadly similar manner to that shown for the multiple L297s in Fig 3 of http://www.st.com/internet/com/TECHN...CD00000063.pdf accepting that a L297/L298 combo has far more crude current control.

    Always happy to be corrected and learn.



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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveWill View Post
    I know that it is better to let people think you are stupid than to open your mouth and prove them right. but I am going to open it anyway and ask this question.
    Could you not have inputted the signal to the anode of the opt diode ( cathode to gnd) and have a non inverted signal and not have the inverting transistors? I am thinking I am missing something.
    Sorry, forgot to answer.
    The transistors are there to clean up the output signal of the optocouplers, this isn't nice and square especially if the input is driven with a low current.
    It was needed in a previous design with 3V3 logic. The TB chip uses 5V and has schmitt trigger input's so here they are probably not needed, I will scope their outputs and see if there's a nice transition around 2V.



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    Quote Originally Posted by boldford View Post
    I was thinking of those with stock to use up on a well designed board. I.e decent optos as you indicated earlier.
    I do have a TB6560 design (single drive) with everything on board wich performs very well here, maybe I will post in the appropriate thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by boldford View Post
    .
    Perhaps I mis-read things but my interpretation of articles elsewhere on such matters suggest it is desirable to synchronise the currents for all drives in a system. Obviously this becomes academic if it isn't possible to slave the oscillator of one TB6564AHQ/THB6064AH to another. I was thinking of the synchronisation to be in a broadly similar manner to that shown for the multiple L297s in Fig 3 of http://www.st.com/internet/com/TECHN...CD00000063.pdf accepting that a L297/L298 combo has far more crude current control.
    That ST synchronisation is only needed for boards with multiple drives and where good grounding can't be achieved. In a single drive setup you need to eliminate ground noise by a proper wiring scheme and it's almost impossible to sync seperate drives.



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TB6564AHQ (THB6064AH) PCB design

TB6564AHQ (THB6064AH) PCB design