Comments on Keling KL-6090?


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    Default Comments on Keling KL-6090?

    I'm considering the KL-6090 and I have a few questions.

    (1) Does anyone have any experience with these machines, or have any comments?

    (2) My usage requires high accuracy/repeatability at normal feed rates. For example, making a 1/4" cut in 3/4" MDF with a 1/4" two-flute tool at 100 IPM, what would be the maximum flex error? Other examples using different numbers would be ok.

    (3) The packing list shows two collets. What size(s), US or metric? As with parts are they easily obtained in the US?

    (4) Availability of parts. US or metric, sources?
    For example, bearings, spindle components, VFD, BOB. Can parts be sourced and purchased easily?

    As you can tell, I'm nervous about purchasing a Chinese or other metric machine.

    Thanks!
    --jim

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    Member jalessi's Avatar
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    Jim,

    John at Keling has been very good with customer service.

    I am guessing the machine is actually built by Excitech.

    Here is a very long ongoing thread that you may want to read.

    http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...46637&page=202

    The machines are extremely popular in Australia.

    Repairing the machine wont be very difficult.

    Anyone that is well versed with these types of machines should be able to handle any crisis.

    Jeff...

    Patience and perseverance have a magical effect before which difficulties disappear and obstacles vanish.


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    Thanks for the link to the thread, Jeff.

    I'll email Keling directly over the weekend with specifics and keep an eye out here as well.

    Regards,
    --jim



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    Question

    Jim,

    What do you plan on making with the router?

    Jeff...

    Patience and perseverance have a magical effect before which difficulties disappear and obstacles vanish.


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    Primarily one-off engineering prototypes in MDF, acrylic and aluminum. some recent examples include several different speaker cabinets, an underwater camera housing and chassis/small parts for a remote antenna coupler for a transmitter. If it involves audio, RF or (to a lesser extent) optics I seem to end up with it.

    I currently have a machine from a small US manufacturer that requires slowing down to roughly 5 IPM in MDF and acrylic to get kind of accuracy/repeatability I'm looking for. To get right to tacks, I'd like to have something like .002" repeatability at 100 IPM, but am willing to compromise a bit from there. The 5 IPM I'm getting right now is too slow for even prototypes. My clients love the results and being able to have the design and prototypes done in one step, (from their perspective) so there's no going back now even if I wanted to.

    So... in a nutshell, I use the CNC router more like a large mill. I've done exactly one sign in my life, and that was under orders from my wife. :-)

    Thanks,
    --jim


    Quote Originally Posted by jalessi View Post
    Jim,

    What do you plan on making with the router?

    Jeff...




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    "http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK1mI9tP5As&feature=channel_page"]YouTube - SHG0609 - Excitech

    Patience and perseverance have a magical effect before which difficulties disappear and obstacles vanish.


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    "http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GMJ52gN8E4"]YouTube - Test

    Patience and perseverance have a magical effect before which difficulties disappear and obstacles vanish.


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    Very nice! Thanks for linking those up.

    I did notice that the Excitech SHG0609 shown in the videos resembles the Keling KL-6090 , although the SHG0609 that turns up most often with a web search doesn't resemble either of them.

    I'll have to see what Keling says about ultimate repeatability, but assuming the model they sell chews up material like the one in the video without flexing much it would appear to be a substantial improvement over what I have now.

    Well over 10 hours today babysitting a 12" x 12" x 3/4" cast acrylic parts nest at 5 IPM. It just finished at almost 2AM PDT.

    Thanks again, Jeff. I'll look into it further.
    --jim



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    Quote Originally Posted by jbarber View Post
    Thanks for the link to the thread, Jeff.

    I'll email Keling directly over the weekend with specifics and keep an eye out here as well.

    Regards,
    --jim

    Thank you, Jeff

    Hi Jim,

    The machine is very good.
    If you have any question, email me at support@kelinginc.net

    http://www.kelinginc.net/CNCmachines6090.html



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    what is the stand alone controller. i am looking for one like that



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    I'm emailing you right now, thanks.
    --jim

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelinginc View Post
    Thank you, Jeff

    Hi Jim,

    The machine is very good.
    If you have any question, email me at support@kelinginc.net

    http://www.kelinginc.net/CNCmachines6090.html




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    Question

    the4thseal,

    Are you talking about something like this?

    http://www.visionengravers.com/produ...roller.html#ov

    Jeff...

    Patience and perseverance have a magical effect before which difficulties disappear and obstacles vanish.


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    if it is stand alone. it would be nice to load your program and run it or other canned stuff; i can not find them and there was no price.....i wish people would put prices on the adds. thanks though. did you recognize the one in the movie? what are they called since the do more than just pendants. thank you for your fast response.



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    the4thseal,

    It still is a glorified pendant with a digital display.

    The extra functionality is in the controller not the pendant.

    There are several company's that sell stand alone CNC controls that have microprocessors and memory.

    Just to name a few: Fanuc, Siemens, Centroid,Mitsubishi,Ajax...

    Whats wrong with using Mach3 and a dedicated P.C., , it will save you many thousands of dollars.

    The reason the price is not posted is because it is expensive, they don't want to scare anyone away.

    Jeff...

    Patience and perseverance have a magical effect before which difficulties disappear and obstacles vanish.


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    i do not disagree with he pc and mac3 i just like the idea of a small tidy controller to go between machines.



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    ... and ended up buying the machine.

    Now to go figure out what an ER11 collet chuck can handle. From what I've seen so far, it looks like I may have to retire my 1/2" shank bits. If so, I'll be looking for new strategies for doing box miters for speaker cabs and spoilboard surfacing. Most of the rest I think I have figured out.

    --jim


    Quote Originally Posted by jbarber View Post
    Very nice! Thanks for linking those up.

    Thanks again, Jeff. I'll look into it further.
    --jim




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    Jim,

    You are very welcome.

    Let me know how you like the machine.

    Please keep me posted.


    Jeff...

    Patience and perseverance have a magical effect before which difficulties disappear and obstacles vanish.


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    Here's one of the acrylic parts nests I was complaining about taking so long. This one ran over 12 hours on the old machine. I'm very interested in seeing how the Keling machine does in comparison.

    --jim

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Comments on Keling KL-6090?-housing-jpg  


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    Talking Bought the KL-6090 CNC router - first impressions and notes

    I received the new KL-6090 CNC router 29 June 2009 and spent some time over the last couple of days getting it set up and tuned.

    First, let me say THANKS to John at Keling for outstanding support before and after the sale. Now that I've been through the process of buying, shipping and setting up the machine I would do it again with full confidence.

    Here's my notes thus far. I have pictures I can post if anyone's interested.

    UNLOADING/POSITIONING
    . The machine arrived nicely crated, roughly 500 pounds gross. I hired a Bobcat and driver to move the crate from the road to the shop and help me unpack and position the machine. There were a few minor scuffs in the paint and sheet metal covers, which is normal for heavy machinery. Otherwise it arrived in good condition.

    . Once the machine was positioned where I wanted it, I used a floor jack and 1/8" felt leveling pads to get it level and stable. (it actually only took one pad. the machine frame was pretty square, my shop floor isn't perfect)

    OVERALL IMPRESSIONS
    . For its size, the machine is by far the heaviest-built I've seen. It uses 640 ounce-inch NEMA 34 motors and the gantry rigidity is quite good. The table appears to be cast aluminum with a T-slotted top, and has pieces of hard foam attached to the top beween the T-slots. (this is a GOOD thing) A quarter-sheet of 3/4" MDF slides right in without any cutting required for the spoilboard. Six spoilboard clamps are provided.

    WIRING/SETUP
    . The initial wiring wasn't difficult at all. Each axis, the spindle and the limit switches each had their own cable. The axis cables were marked X,Y,Z . The other two cables weren't marked, but used unique connectors so that they couldn't be confused. (the original markings were in ballpoint ink, I made new ones with a permanent marker)

    . I initially thought the Z-axis stepper driver was bad, but it turned out that the parallel cable wasn't seated correctly at the computer. I found that out after checking the cable for continuity. (I'll remember to check that first if there's a next time...)

    . My shop has 240V 60hz single-phase power that actually measures about 247V. (my property has its own power transformer so the line voltage is on the high side) The switching power supplies are handling that fine, running nice and cool. The provided power cord is on the light side, (18 AWG conductors) but showed no signs of heating after an hour or so of use.

    . After setting up Mach3, I found the X and Z-axis motors were running reversed. I changed the wiring to correct it, but John tells me that you can reverse the motors in Mach3. Now that I know that, I'll change the software instead of the wiring if it comes up again in the future.

    . Initially, I have the motors tuned for 200 inches/minute maximum and 8 inches/second acceleration. Those numbers may change with experience, since the only cutting I've done so far is to surface the spoilboard.

    SPINDLE COOLING
    . The machine came packed with a plastic tank, tubing and a little fish tank pump for cooling the spindle. The pump was bad out of the box, so we raced to town last night and picked up a fountain pump, some 1/2" tubing and a 1/2" to 1/8" adapter to fit the 1/8" tubing supplied with the spindle. After a half- hour or so of runtime at a light to medium load the spindle body was perhaps 85 degrees F. The 1 gallon of water I put in the tank raised 5 degrees F (measured) over that hour, which is actually very little. I am quite impressed with the efficiency of the spindle and VFD! (A remote speed pot would be a good add-on, but adjusting the VFD from the control cabinet will work for now)

    FIRST USE
    . The first use was, of course, surfacing the 3/4" MDF spoilboard. I used the 7/8" flat bit handily supplied with the machine, since my regular surfacing bit is too big for the ER11 chuck that comes on the spindle. (ER11 supports up to 1/4" bits, basically) I created a 22" x 30" x 1/16" pocket toolpath with VCarvePro, set up the cut and let it go. At 200hz (12000 RPM?) 100 inches/minute and a single-pass 1/16" cut it took about 18 minutes to surface the spoilboard, read my email and have a cup of coffee.

    That's really all I know for now. I plan on making a series of test cuts over this coming weekend, which may generate a few more notes and pictures.

    SUMMARY:
    From what I've seen so far, the KL-6090 is built like a battleship and is a truly great value. After I've run some tests on it we'll find out about accuracy and repeatability, but for now I'm very impressed. Does it work? Yes! Will it make signs and cabinet doors? Yes! Will it mill high-precision prototype parts at high speed? That one we'll find out in future installments.

    SHORT LIST OF RELATED PROJECTS/ACCESSORIES
    . Build a dust foot for the spindle (!!!!)
    . Check into a remote speed control pot for the VFD

    AND LAST:
    For those that may be wondering, I have absolutely no business or other relationship with Keling, their employees, suppliers, pets, etc.

    Regards,
    --jim

    James (Jim) Barber
    Yakima, WA USA



  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by jbarber View Post
    I received the new KL-6090 CNC router 29 June 2009 and spent some time over the last couple of days getting it set up and tuned.

    First, let me say THANKS to John at Keling for outstanding support before and after the sale. Now that I've been through the process of buying, shipping and setting up the machine I would do it again with full confidence.

    Here's my notes thus far. I have pictures I can post if anyone's interested.

    UNLOADING/POSITIONING
    . The machine arrived nicely crated, roughly 500 pounds gross. I hired a Bobcat and driver to move the crate from the road to the shop and help me unpack and position the machine. There were a few minor scuffs in the paint and sheet metal covers, which is normal for heavy machinery. Otherwise it arrived in good condition.

    . Once the machine was positioned where I wanted it, I used a floor jack and 1/8" felt leveling pads to get it level and stable. (it actually only took one pad. the machine frame was pretty square, my shop floor isn't perfect)

    OVERALL IMPRESSIONS
    . For its size, the machine is by far the heaviest-built I've seen. It uses 640 ounce-inch NEMA 34 motors and the gantry rigidity is quite good. The table appears to be cast aluminum with a T-slotted top, and has pieces of hard foam attached to the top beween the T-slots. (this is a GOOD thing) A quarter-sheet of 3/4" MDF slides right in without any cutting required for the spoilboard. Six spoilboard clamps are provided.

    WIRING/SETUP
    . The initial wiring wasn't difficult at all. Each axis, the spindle and the limit switches each had their own cable. The axis cables were marked X,Y,Z . The other two cables weren't marked, but used unique connectors so that they couldn't be confused. (the original markings were in ballpoint ink, I made new ones with a permanent marker)

    . I initially thought the Z-axis stepper driver was bad, but it turned out that the parallel cable wasn't seated correctly at the computer. I found that out after checking the cable for continuity. (I'll remember to check that first if there's a next time...)

    . My shop has 240V 60hz single-phase power that actually measures about 247V. (my property has its own power transformer so the line voltage is on the high side) The switching power supplies are handling that fine, running nice and cool. The provided power cord is on the light side, (18 AWG conductors) but showed no signs of heating after an hour or so of use.

    . After setting up Mach3, I found the X and Z-axis motors were running reversed. I changed the wiring to correct it, but John tells me that you can reverse the motors in Mach3. Now that I know that, I'll change the software instead of the wiring if it comes up again in the future.

    . Initially, I have the motors tuned for 200 inches/minute maximum and 8 inches/second acceleration. Those numbers may change with experience, since the only cutting I've done so far is to surface the spoilboard.

    SPINDLE COOLING
    . The machine came packed with a plastic tank, tubing and a little fish tank pump for cooling the spindle. The pump was bad out of the box, so we raced to town last night and picked up a fountain pump, some 1/2" tubing and a 1/2" to 1/8" adapter to fit the 1/8" tubing supplied with the spindle. After a half- hour or so of runtime at a light to medium load the spindle body was perhaps 85 degrees F. The 1 gallon of water I put in the tank raised 5 degrees F (measured) over that hour, which is actually very little. I am quite impressed with the efficiency of the spindle and VFD! (A remote speed pot would be a good add-on, but adjusting the VFD from the control cabinet will work for now)

    FIRST USE
    . The first use was, of course, surfacing the 3/4" MDF spoilboard. I used the 7/8" flat bit handily supplied with the machine, since my regular surfacing bit is too big for the ER11 chuck that comes on the spindle. (ER11 supports up to 1/4" bits, basically) I created a 22" x 30" x 1/16" pocket toolpath with VCarvePro, set up the cut and let it go. At 200hz (12000 RPM?) 100 inches/minute and a single-pass 1/16" cut it took about 18 minutes to surface the spoilboard, read my email and have a cup of coffee.

    That's really all I know for now. I plan on making a series of test cuts over this coming weekend, which may generate a few more notes and pictures.

    SUMMARY:
    From what I've seen so far, the KL-6090 is built like a battleship and is a truly great value. After I've run some tests on it we'll find out about accuracy and repeatability, but for now I'm very impressed. Does it work? Yes! Will it make signs and cabinet doors? Yes! Will it mill high-precision prototype parts at high speed? That one we'll find out in future installments.

    SHORT LIST OF RELATED PROJECTS/ACCESSORIES
    . Build a dust foot for the spindle (!!!!)
    . Check into a remote speed control pot for the VFD

    AND LAST:
    For those that may be wondering, I have absolutely no business or other relationship with Keling, their employees, suppliers, pets, etc.

    Regards,
    --jim

    James (Jim) Barber
    Yakima, WA USA
    Thank you Jim



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Comments on Keling KL-6090?

Comments on Keling KL-6090?

Comments on Keling KL-6090?