CHNC Turret with PLC...CONVERSION LOG.

[nate]

Well, after trying various stepper control setups for indexing the turret on my CHNC, I have not been able to achieve the indexing reliability that I need to get the tooling plate to lock down on the dogs every time.

I have tried direct drive to the turret plate (with a large timing pulley ring)

I have also tried running the indexing stepper through the existing indexing gear train (not including the air motor) by attaching a timing pulley directly where the original indexing magnet sensor was.

Both methods achieved indexing, but not accurate enough. I need about 0-1.5degree accuracy (estimate) to reliably lock down on the dogs. I only could get about 0-3 degree accuracy (estimate) with either method.

I guess Hardinge really did know what they were doing after all, and I am going to rebuild their setup...

First I would like to thank everyone who helped me get this far with the turret. several of you helped me get Mach3 firing air solenoids and even wrote VB for my stepper indexing setup. All of your help is very appriciated.

I am now embarking on a quest to make my turret functional through Mach3 with a PLC. It has been done.

See link-
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/vertic...onversion.html

I have reached out to Vince, and although he wants to help, he is extremely busy right now and so it looks like I will have to go at this without his help.

I am going to do this post as a conversion log. I will begin by adding pics tonight and will be doing this step by step so that anyone in the future can very easily replicate the task.

More soon....

Similar Threads:

• Chnc Turret Problem
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• Hardgine CHNC II turret problems
• Hardinge CHNC turret woes

[Karl_T]

I used a different control,Camsoft, but rebuilt a CHNC turret to do my bidding.

One key was the exhaust on the turret to control rotation speed. if set slow the thing would stall. If openned to run fast, it would overshoot the stop pawl. So, i added another air solenoid on the exhaust. With it open, full speed to the turret. Closed and very slow speed. Close this solenoid a second ahead of the stop pawl.

Now, I have extremely fast turret rotation that slows just before the stop pawl comes in.

Karl

P.S. I addded my index logic. Written in a different language, but logic is logic - works the same.

[nate]

Great. I'm so glad you chimed in. I would love to see the turret working on your machine. Do you have a video?

the exhaust solenoid was a stroke of genius.

[Karl_T]

Great. I'm so glad you chimed in. I would love to see the turret working on your machine. Do you have a video?

the exhaust solenoid was a stroke of genius.

you'll have to give Camsoft an email, etc. to login but the machine video labled CHNC is mine. PC Based CNC Control For The Machine Tool CNC Retrofit And CNC Controller OEM Market

Karl

[nate]

Thanks Karl. I got it. Turret looks quite smooth. No doubt I will be picking your brain soon...

[nate]

Alright, lets get some pictures up.

Here is one of my lathe-

As it came to me. Straight from Kentucky. I believe that it was an oil only machine, as the iron was in fantastic shape. I did not bring the control home with the lathe, as I was planning on Mach3/geckodrives.


As it sits now. Retro fitted to Mach3, gecko G203V's, 870 Oz/In pac-sci hybrid steppers, Smooth Stepper, 70VDC antek PS, CNC4PC C11BOB, 3HP 3 phase pump motor powered by a single phase 220V Inverter from Automation Direct.

[nate]

No some pics of my spare turret. I bought a spare saddle recently for the ballscrews and other spares.


Dirty dirty.










Now cleaned up-

[nate]

Over the weekend I ordered this-

Comfile Technology Inc.

In my searching of the CNCZone for info for PLC's I found the following post in this thread(http://www.cnczone.com/forums/genera..._beginner.html)

"There's an in-betweener gizmo you might be interested in called the CUBLOC. Its an Atmel AVR chip with PLC components added around it. The software is free and the programming cable is a plain old serial cable. Best of all, its dirt cheap compared to PLCs and actually quite cheap even for micros.

Programming is done in both/either Basic or Ladder Logic (ladder works like an RTOS, Basic comes after ladder if ladder is used).

Products range from a small stampish sized CB220 up to the CUTouch. all have external interrupts, RS232, ADCs, PWM, I2C and various other whizbang features.

I have the CUTouch, damned nice unit! 5.7" touchscreen (B&W) with two Atmel ATMega 128s - one does the touchscreen and the other runs programs. Scads of IO (Transistor outputs and optically isolated inputs, PWM, External interrupts, ADC, the whole shebang).

You can mix and match different parts - add a graphic LCD or 7 segment display, toss in various "I/O Cells" - pre-built input and output options that are dirt cheap and plug into a nice pre-built board. One of the models even has a socket for plugging in an XPort (webserver/serial-to-ethernet module).

Take a gander over at Comfile Technology Inc.. Prices are right on the website, so no guessing required." -Rhodan

I got the idea for the Cubloc from Vince who used one in his Hardinge CHNC turret conversion.

Having read the above post and knowing that Vince used one in his conversion has me feeling optimistic about the selection...

[nate]

Here is an interesting link-

MODBUS 1

It contains instructions on how to get Mach3, Modbus and Cubloc all in communication (integrated)

I have yet to begin to comprehend most of it, but will begin to study.

Can anyone tell me if I need a Modbus device to have Mach3 talk to a Cubloc? I have a c11bob and a smooth stepper.

[nate]

Well, after reading Henriks discussion of ModBus more throughly, it appears that the Cubloc is the modbus device. It apparently can communicate directly with Mach3 if set up to do so.

Now I am wondering if the Cubloc must remain connected to my Control PC (a laptop) at all times? Or, can the Cubloc just be programmed while connected to the laptop, and then during actual running, be connected to my BOB or Smooth Stepper board and not the laptop?

Anyone?

[nate]

BTW, looks like my Cubloc is on its way from California, and is scheduled to arrive Monday the 13th.

Things sure do take a long time to travel from the West coast to the midwest...especially, when you are waiting for them!

[nate]

I have also just ordered 25 of these-

US5881LUA-ND (digi key part number)

Digi-Key - US5881LUA-ND (Manufacturer - US5881LUA)

The maker has an excellent application guide that can be found here-
http://www.melexis.com/prodfiles/0003715_hallapps.pdf

[samco]

There are quite a few emc converstions of hardinge lathes.

My "new" Hardinge HNC running LinuxCNC's Enhanced Machine Controller
Hardinge CHNC I Lathe
Conversion of Hardinge HNC Lathe to EMC
LinuxCNC.org - Hardinge Superslant retrofit - EMC Support Forum

Most if not all are using emc2's integrated ladder logic. (no external plc needed) you might be able to use it as a reference (if you stay with mach).

sam

[nate]

Thanks so much for adding those links. Are you one of the people who has EMC running on a Hardinge?

I plan to stay with Mach as I know it fairly well. Sadly I have no Linux experience whatsoever.

I have done a tiny (really tiny) bit of fooling around with VB in Mach, but no experience with Ladder Logic, PLC's, Brains and ModBus...I have a long steep learning curve ahead of me.

I want to document EVERYTHING so that a beginner with these things (like me) can muddle through easily in the future.

[nate]

Here is a thread from Karl that discusses accurate indexing and the additional braking solenoid. Well worth reading.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/camsof...rret_woes.html

[nate]

Can the Cubloc run a collet closer at the same time as a turret?

So, I know that I can have Mach3 communicate a Gcode request for tool X through ModBus to the Cubloc, and the Cubloc will get the solenoids to operate the Turret.

Can I have the Collet closer operate in the same manner?

Can the Cubloc run two pieces of code at the same time? or do I have to include the collet closer code into the same piece of code with the turret code?

[nate]

Time for an update...

After some struggling to remember what TINY bit I ever knew about VB, I posted over at the Mach3 forum asking about how to write a two Macro's to activate and deactivate an output in Mach3.

I ended up answering my own question, after reading another's post on that forum, about how the name of the macro needed to be an MXX that was not already reserved. I had originally tried M99 for the name of my macro, and then discovered that M99 was already taken.

If you are looking to write a Macro, make sure not to name it one of these-


I named my Macros-

M998 for closing my air collet closer and M999 for opening the collet closer back up.

M998 reads-

ActivateSignal(OUTPUT1)

M999 reads-

DeActivateSignal(OUTPUT1)

Rediculosly simple, I know. Simple is good though.

I have my Mach3 Configure/Ports&Pins/OutputSignals set to the following-
Output1 (enabled) Port (1) Pin (16) Active low (unchecked)

My BOB has pin 16 wired to the CNC4PC C36 Quad relay boards IN1. See this picture-


The C36 board receives its 5VDC and ground from a 5VDC PS that is in my CNC control box.

The 24VDC PS in my lathes base feeds the V_IN for the R1 (Relay 1) of the C36 board. The 24VDC "Com" is fed to one of the two red wires on the solenoid. The other red wire on the solenoid is fed from the NO (normally open) of R1. The green wire of the solenoid is the Ground and is run directly to the lathes chassis.

All of this can be seen in the following pic-


One of the solenoids in the picture is not currently being used.

Soon... when I set up the PLC to run the tool turret, I will need to add a third solenoid to the solenoid manifold. Two for the turret and one for the Air Collet Closer.

[nate]

Here is a video of the CC working with MDI inputs.

[nate]

Ok, enough with the CC.

Here I am using the same macros but with the solenoid on the Hardinge that is for the turret the turret stop/cushion.

Looks like I have a functional turret stop/cushion solenoid!

[nate]

Ok, here I am testing the indexing motor solenoid.



Anyone know why my turret spins before it pops up? I'm guessing that it has to do with the fact that I dont have that little spring loaded plastic thing that goes under the turret base plate...am I right?