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  1. #61
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    Default Part number for hypertherm CPC plug ????

    Finally got back from Florida and got the PMAX65 unpacked. I installed the CPC port kit and added the raw voltage leads.Pretty simple installation. Next is to move the Candcnc THC sensor card from my old cutter to the PMAX.

    The extra torch (H65s) was missing from the box so I haven't done any mods to see if I can get it running from CPC port. Hypertherm is shipping direct so it should be here any day.

    Last problem is the CPC port. Does anybody have the standard part number for the CPC plug. I found one (AMP 206044-1) but am not sure it is the right one. Also, what are the pins used with the plug ??

    Any help appreciated.

    Willy

    P.S. Tried the machine out in manual mode with regular hand torch. It really rocks. Blew through 1/2" steel like a hot knife through butter, even down to 45 amps. Got to go out and get some 45A nozzles.



  2. #62
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    Default hand torch modified for cpc port control

    The Hypertherm H65s torch arrived and it was very easy to modify it to work from the CPC port. The trigger is disabled when the mod is done so there is no chance of accidentally firing it. Have to make a new mount for the torch and we should be back in business. This is a really economical way to get a dedicated torch for the machine and have a separate hand torch. Hypertherm should offer a machine / hand torch package instead of 2 hand torches and then this stuff wouldn't be necessary.

    Should be cutting in another day or two. Just waiting for the CPC plug.

    Willy

    Last edited by flyinwilly; 05-19-2011 at 08:36 AM.


  3. #63
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    Default new torch mount & Z axis home switch

    Machined a new mount for the Hypertherm H65S torch. The retaining cap on the torch is quite long so I built a clamp to go around it and added a support for the upper section of the torch.

    I've been reading many posts on how important it is to get the pierce height correct in order to preserve the torch consumables. The microswitch I was using had quite a bit of slop and the zero could be off by 30 - 40 thou from one time to another. It didn't matter on my old torch because it was contact start and as soon as it came into contact with the plate, it fired and then I raised it up and let the THC set the height. Worked great. Not good for this new torch.

    I built a new switch that has near perfect repeatability. It is just 2 pieces of nylon with flat contacts. I made the contacts out of pieces of hacksaw blade. Nice spring steel, doesn't bend. One side is fixed on Z axis mount, the other is adjustable on the floating head. I can set the gap for a few thou and adjust the pierce height to account for it. Height repeats within one or two thou every time.

    Ready to go except for CPC plug. Hope it comes today.

    Willy

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails A Different Machine - Downdraft/water table-ht_torch_mount_-1-jpg   A Different Machine - Downdraft/water table-ht_torch_mount_-2-jpg   A Different Machine - Downdraft/water table-home_switch-jpg  


  4. #64
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    Good idea on the switch! Have you made any cuts with the new set-up yet? Would love to see some cuts when you feel set with the new gear.

    WSS

    www.metaltechus.com


  5. #65
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    Just got the CPC plug wired and everything hooked up to the THC. Tried a few cuts on some 16 GA steel and at 65 A, the PMAX just blows it away. Tried 45 A and it works considerably better. I'm getting a positive bevel on the cuts . The manual says the torch is too high but all I have are drag shields. My local guy doesn't have any machine shields so I ordered them on the internet along with some 45A nozzles. They'll probably be in early next week. The LCTHC from CANDCNC is holding with 1 V of the preset so that part is working fine. Had a few problems with the XML that came with the THC but that was my problem. Too many variables in MACH3. Missed a few when I set up the new XML.

    I'm getting very light dross at 225 IPM so I think this speed will be OK although it's lower than the book recommends. At this speed, I'm holding my breath when the gantry reverses direction. It will be interesting to see how the drive belts hold up. So far they are OK.

    I've got to cut a sign as soon as I get the shield and nozzles. Post some pics after.

    Willy



  6. #66
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    Hey, does the 65 utilize "fine cut" parts? I use them on my 1650 when cutting anything under 10ga. They set at 40amp but cut way slower and finer than the standard 40amp nozzle. For instance, the ipm w/standard 40amp on 12ga would be 180ipm and 80 to 100 ipm using fine cut (guessing of course, no book in front of me).

    WSS

    www.metaltechus.com


  7. #67
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    The 65 does have fine cut parts but the speeds are much higher than what you quoted. The book lists the fine cut for 16 ga as 250 IPM and 78 volts at 45 A. The 45A shielded nozzles are listed at 350 IPM and 130 volts at 45 A. I remember a post by Jim Colt that the new 45A shielded are the new design while the fine cut is the older design. The difference in kerf width is between 6 and 10 thou. However, Jim also mentioned that the new 45A nozzles last much longer than the fine cut.

    I know I can't run my table at 350 IPM so I'll see what I can do with the 45's at 225-250 IPM. I've got reasonable cuts with the 65A nozzles so it should better with the 45s and the machine shields.

    Willy



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    Still waiting for the 45A nozzles and machine shields. They were finally shipped and should be here tuesday.

    In the meantime, WSS got me interested in how fast my table would run so I've been playing with the motor tuning, kernal speed, acceleration, etc. I just put a new PC ( EBAY used dual core) on and found that I can run the kernal at 60 KHZ. I cranked up the motor speed and topped out at 570 IPM (measured on the MACH3 screen - torch not running). After that, the motors started chattering and speed went down. I guess the motors were stalling. It's really impressive to see that gantry flying around. At times I thought it was going to fly off, especially when it reversed direction. Don't think I'll try running at anything near that speed. Didn't try any actual cuts above 250 IPM.

    Been playing with various speeds and heights by varying the THC preset voltage. Got some cuts with very thin dross and almost no bevel. I assume this is what is called high speed dross. However, this stuff is almost impossible to get off. Extremelly hard to chip so most of it I had to grind. I think I am going to lower the speed and amps to find a happy place where the dross is easy to remove.

    The PMAX65 is better than everything I've read about it. The only thing I can complain about is the amount of air it uses. My compressor is rated at 18 CFM at 90 PSI (probably an exagerated manufacturer claim) and I occasionally get a low air warning but the machine keeps running. I have a spare pump so I guess I'll get a tank and build another compressor and run 2 at a time.

    More Later.

    Willy



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    Quote Originally Posted by flyinwilly View Post
    The PMAX65 is better than everything I've read about it. The only thing I can complain about is the amount of air it uses. My compressor is rated at 18 CFM at 90 PSI (probably an exagerated manufacturer claim) and I occasionally get a low air warning but the machine keeps running. I have a spare pump so I guess I'll get a tank and build another compressor and run 2 at a time.

    More Later.

    Willy
    Willy,
    What is the 65's rated air consumption? I recently was cursing my IR 18cfm@175psi compressor when it could no longer run the plasma and a die grinder at the same time. I assumed it was "wearing" out but in fact it was a dirty intake filter from a manganese project I had done that was really smokey. Blew it out and it is tops again, I should still have a extra element on hand though, it is on my to do list (miles long)

    WSS

    www.metaltechus.com


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    The book says 6.7 scfm @ 85 PSI. The pressure gauge I have on the inlet only drops to 90 PSI while it's running and the pump is rated (according to the manufacturer) at 18 SCFM at 90 PSI. It should be enough but I get the low pressure alert. One other addition to my air system is a Motor Guard M60 filter on the intake of the air dryer to catch the oil vapor before it hits the desiccant.

    I was planning to build the second compressor anyway for my sandblaster so it's no loss. I may try using a larger hose and fittings to see if that helps.

    I'll say one thing is that the 65 is VERY loud - the air noise is maybe twice as loud as my previous cutter.

    It works so I'll keep making changes till everything is straightened out.

    Willy



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    Default Speed Kills

    All parts are in and the Pmax is running at 45A. The book calls for over 300 IPM for 18 GA which is way too fast so I am running at 225 IPM and the cuts are still very good. However, another problem has cropped up.

    My old cutter ran at 50-75IPM and I got fairly sharp corners. Running at 225 IPM gives corners like the 4th turn at Daytona. I've read all of the Mach3 literature and I think my settings are correct except for the "Stop CV on Angles > __ Degrees". This wasn't checked. I'll try it out later. One thing that did help was increasing the motor acceleration from 20 to 40. That took a lot of the rounding out but there is still more than before.

    If anybody has some suggestions, I would love to hear them.

    Willy



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    Quote Originally Posted by flyinwilly View Post
    All parts are in and the Pmax is running at 45A. The book calls for over 300 IPM for 18 GA which is way too fast so I am running at 225 IPM and the cuts are still very good. However, another problem has cropped up.

    My old cutter ran at 50-75IPM and I got fairly sharp corners. Running at 225 IPM gives corners like the 4th turn at Daytona. I've read all of the Mach3 literature and I think my settings are correct except for the "Stop CV on Angles > __ Degrees". This wasn't checked. I'll try it out later. One thing that did help was increasing the motor acceleration from 20 to 40. That took a lot of the rounding out but there is still more than before.

    If anybody has some suggestions, I would love to hear them.

    Willy
    Willy,

    I try not to go over 200IiPM on my machine no matter what ( just depends on what the part looks like), I would throw in a small tip and try it at 180 IPM, then move your preset volts down 2-3 volts to compensate for the slower speeds, you may see a drastic change for the good... Also do you have Sheetcam?? They have corner loops... If your cutting a square it goes past the corner then comes around and cuts the next edge without rounding or choping corners... check picture this may help... Sheetcam is an awesome program for the money, I would give it a 4.5 star for plasma cutting..

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails A Different Machine - Downdraft/water table-flange-gif  


  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by flyinwilly View Post
    All parts are in and the Pmax is running at 45A. The book calls for over 300 IPM for 18 GA which is way too fast so I am running at 225 IPM and the cuts are still very good. However, another problem has cropped up.

    My old cutter ran at 50-75IPM and I got fairly sharp corners. Running at 225 IPM gives corners like the 4th turn at Daytona. I've read all of the Mach3 literature and I think my settings are correct except for the "Stop CV on Angles > __ Degrees". This wasn't checked. I'll try it out later. One thing that did help was increasing the motor acceleration from 20 to 40. That took a lot of the rounding out but there is still more than before.

    If anybody has some suggestions, I would love to hear them.

    Willy
    If you start messing with CV settings you are in for a lot of frustration. What will work with one job may need to be reset for another. CV is there to smooth out the moves so your motion does not look like a dog crapping peach seeds. To get the smooth motion the software has to look ahead and plan things. It will "compromise" the toolpath (blends) to take a corner or sharp angle without moving outside the physical ability of the axis. Much like you will widen the turn the faster you want to take a sharp turn in a car.

    The key ingredient here is acceleration. That predicts how well your table will follow the toolpath. In a system there is always a trade off of speed VS acceleration. You can get more speed but you sacrifice acceleration. You can do the opposite. Given a choice you go for acceleration.

    The torque of your motors, the final drive gearing and the total weight of your gantry are the factors that define the acceleration. As you know the faster you spin a stepper the less torque it will be able to produce. Acceleration is done over time (which is why it is rated in IPS/sec). It is the ramping of a speed from 0 (or one speed) to the maximum velocity. The higher the target velocity the longer the ramp at a given acceleration curve.

    Your current feedrate does not set the ramp but just makes it happen quicker.

    So if you want sharp corners you can:

    1.Drop to Exact Stop mode in MACH (no CV) when you approach a corner. That has to be something where the system can "see" the corner coming up and change the MODE in MACH. It gets complex but you can do it in SheetCAM with some fancy programming in the POST because the POST language allows you to test for conditions in the toolpath as it builds it.

    2. Tune your system for max acceleration and give up some of the upper Max velocity to get it. The more acceleration you have the better the corners. If you find you can get 575 IPM velocity and 40 IPS/sec then try lowering the velocity to 400 and raising the acceleration in increments.

    3. Lower the cutting feedrate. Cut with the smallest tip and current setting you can for the material you are cutting. Fine Cut tips and a 25 to 30 amp setting can lower required feedrates down out of the stratosphere. and that pulls your motors back into a better torque range and shortens the acceleration time.

    4. Lighten the gantry weight. If you are not already, consider dual gantry motors to double the torque.

    5. Increase the motor torque (running at lower RPM on a stepper does that anyway). Based on your numbers I would guess that you already have belt reduction on the motors. Adding greater reduction buys you more torque at the lower end but forces you to have to spin the stepper faster to get to a given feedrate and that presents the old paradox of losing torque from higher RPM. There is a finite ratio you need to stay in.

    You can mess with the AC feedrate numbers but you have to run with CV Feedrate enabled. You then face times when maybe the artwork is pretty ragged and you have to retune or watch the table shake trying to make all of the moves.

    TOM caudle
    www.CandCNC.com



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    Thanks for the responses.

    I've already done some of the suggestions. My gantry already uses dual motors and 4:1 belt reduction. I've increased the acceleration on the motor tuning already and it helped considerably. I was still running 45A on the 45A nozzle so I guess the next step is to reduce the amperage and speed until I get a satisfactory result.


    Thanks,

    Willy



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    Quote Originally Posted by flyinwilly View Post
    Thanks for the responses.

    I've already done some of the suggestions. My gantry already uses dual motors and 4:1 belt reduction. I've increased the acceleration on the motor tuning already and it helped considerably. I was still running 45A on the 45A nozzle so I guess the next step is to reduce the amperage and speed until I get a satisfactory result.


    Thanks,

    Willy

    Do not just reduce current. When you run a tip rated at 45 A at a lower current it changes the cut characteristics. It spreads the current density. It also changes the amount of gap volts it takes to hold the proper cut gap so you settings on the THC will have to change as well.

    It's a lot more productive to change the nozzle size to one rated at lower current and use the chart numbers to get the correct current, feedrate and cut parameters.

    Cutting thin material is always harder than the medium thickness. Hypertherm makes Fine Cut consumables that are optimized to cut thinner material. They will allow you to drop your feedrate down so you are working in a better part of the torque curve and you should get even better corners.

    Since you got better results with higher acceleration numbers you need to continue that trend.

    TOM caudle
    www.CandCNC.com



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    Default Pmax65 running great

    Been a few weeks since I hooked up the Pmax65 and it has been running great. Doing a lot of testing with various speeds, accelerations, cut heights, etc. I think I have it pretty well dialed in for 16 / 18 GA steel to get the cut quality I want with a reasonable amount of dross. I'm using 100 - 125 IPM with 37A, 129V on 16 GA. I use different speeds depending on what I'm cutting. If it has a lot of sharp corners, I use the lower speed. It is a lot lower than the Hypertherm manual but the cuts are very good. I get zero dross on 1 side of the cut and a small to medium deposit on the other. However, it comes off very easily so it's not a big problem. The LCTHC is holding the voltage rock steady after the first few seconds. Even then, it is only varying by a volt or two. I think getting the initial pierce and cut height very close helps a lot.

    Cuts on thicker material, 1/4 and 3/8, haven't been a problem except for a slight bevel. Got rid of that by changing the torch voltage preset on the LCTHC and the cuts squared up right away.

    Attached a video and some pics of the cuts.

    The first pic is the piece right off the table and the second is after a minute or two on the sander. The next ones are a display I made for a local store. The prices change weekly so he just puts a new one in the main sign.

    Here is the link to the video.

    [nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk-rAt-c4iU&feature=channel_video_title"]YouTube - ‪Downdraft Water Table with Powermax 65‬‏[/nomedia]


    Willy

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails A Different Machine - Downdraft/water table-dsc01747-jpg   A Different Machine - Downdraft/water table-dsc01748-jpg   A Different Machine - Downdraft/water table-treasure_island-jpg   A Different Machine - Downdraft/water table-treasure_island_prices-jpg  



  17. #77
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    Looks nice. I would suggest trying the FineCut consumables for the thinner materials....especially since you are running relatively low travel speeds. You will get a narrower kerf, less heat input on the material (warpage). Looks pretty nice though!

    Thanks for buying a Hypertherm!

    Jim Colt



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    Jim:
    I am using the 45A nozzle with the machine shield. The kerf is around .050 which is what is listed for the fine cut consumables. This is fine for what I am doing. I just have to be sure that I don't make anything too thin when I draw something up. I went this way due to a post of yours that said the 45A nozzle would last longer than the fine cut. I have about 75 minutes of cuts and hundreds of pierces on this set and the nozzle is still good so I am very pleased with the consumable life. I haven't noticed much warpage and what there is has been handled very nicely by the THC.

    I am very happy with the Pmax65 performance. I could have used the 45 for the majority of my stuff but I have a fair amount of 3/8" and 1/2" work and didn't want to push the smaller machine. The other thing which swung the decision to go with Hypertherm was the free 15 deg torch which I converted to a "machine" torch to work through the CPC port. It made a very neat installation.

    Now to see if it can make enough to pay for itself.


    Willy



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    Default great way to clean water table

    Since I got the new cutter, I've been using the table much more and cutting heavier stuff. While this is good news, the water tray really fills up with crap. I've been draining and picking the big stuff out by hand but all the metal particles are a real pain.

    While browsing thru a flea market last week, I picked up a 2' wide magnet on a pole for $3.00. They are used for picking up nails after a roofing job. Now all I have to do is remove the slats and drag the magnet over the bottom. It works better if you leave the fluid in the tray and it picks up all of the metal particles as well as the big chunks and then scrape it off with a plastic putty knife. The one change I made was to add 1/2" rubber strips along the 2 outside edges to keep the magnet off the tray.

    Happy Cleaning!

    Willy



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    Quote Originally Posted by flyinwilly View Post
    Since I got the new cutter, I've been using the table much more and cutting heavier stuff. While this is good news, the water tray really fills up with crap. I've been draining and picking the big stuff out by hand but all the metal particles are a real pain.

    While browsing thru a flea market last week, I picked up a 2' wide magnet on a pole for $3.00. They are used for picking up nails after a roofing job. Now all I have to do is remove the slats and drag the magnet over the bottom. It works better if you leave the fluid in the tray and it picks up all of the metal particles as well as the big chunks and then scrape it off with a plastic putty knife. The one change I made was to add 1/2" rubber strips along the 2 outside edges to keep the magnet off the tray.

    Happy Cleaning!

    Willy


    Wow! You are really making a different work! Would you kindly sent me the drawing of it? I have a waterjet cutter and I'm facing a similar problem. I hope to make up a different table becaues our work is busy and need to do
    drain frequently.



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A Different Machine - Downdraft/water table

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