Z axis settings

[wmgeorge]

My laptop computer is on a stand maybe 6 feet from the machine. I have Velco straps securing the cable to the stand legs as well as the CAT 5 cable for the controller. That cable is also under a mat. I can walk to the machine, run the router spindle right up near the work piece and control all from the pendant. Very handy.

[GME]

I'm sorry I don't trust wireless game controllers with my fingers and more this is what I have>vistaCNC

consumer grade wireless, no thanks.

FWIW, the Shuttle Pro is not wireless. Like the pendant, the Shuttle Pro is also USB. The VistaCNC stuff has a good reputation and appears widely used. However, I've read about some issues with Mach4; reportedly works great with Mach3. It has been awhile, but I seem to recall the Mach4 issues had to do with some of the functions not working, but it may have been something else. But for the Mach4 issues, I would have purchased the VistaCNC pendant instead of the Shuttle Pro. I just looked; VistaCNC hasn't updated its Mach4 drivers. The current versions are all from 2016.

Also FWIW, I used a USB XBox controller when I was running Mach3. IMHO, for the price, you can't beat it. I too was afraid of wireless, i.e., a hiccup at an inopportune time.

Gary

[wmgeorge]

The driver is a USB interface to Mach3 and Mach4, so whats changed in Mach4 in the last 2 years that would affect the Pendent? The Visa looks a little more professional than a video or game controller.

[GME]

The driver is a USB interface to Mach3 and Mach4, so whats changed in Mach4 in the last 2 years that would affect the Pendent? The Visa looks a little more professional than a video or game controller.

I don't think anything has changed in Mach4 that would affect the pendant's compatibility. That's the point. If there was lack of functionality with Mach4 two years ago, there is no reason to believe it's any different now. That's why I didn't buy it.

I sloppily misstated a material fact previously. It was not the driver that was the problem with the pendant. The problem was with VistaCNC's plugin for Mach4. The quality of the plugin is the difference of a thing working well or not. For whatever reason, VistaCNC chose to not update, revise, or otherwise make it's plugin more compatible functionally. The lack of improving it was a major complaint among the Mach4 community members. Requests for improvement obviously fell on deaf ears.

Having said that, the VistaCNC pendants are known to work and play well with Mach3. So, if you run Mach3, it's a solid, albeit pricey, choice. Game controllers can be had for less than 20% of the VistaCNC iMACHIII M1 price. It all depends on what it's worth to you to buy one over the other.

Gary

[wmgeorge]

Seems to be mixed reviews on the Vista and Mach4, almost like its a Mach4 thing and any kind of Pendant? Seems a shame it can't be solved.

Vista CNC P1A-S with Mach4 - Problem

[GME]

Seems to be mixed reviews on the Vista and Mach4, almost like its a Mach4 thing and any kind of Pendant? Seems a shame it can't be solved.

Vista CNC P1A-S with Mach4 - Problem

It's hard to tell whether the problem is with Vista, Mach4 or both. Several months ago when I was reading about it, the majority of contributors blamed Vista.

Maybe a solution hasn't been found, because the Mach4 user base isn't yet large enough to support the expense of developing a good plugin? I have no idea how many people are using Mach4, but I suspect the number is only a small fraction of Mach3 users. Hopefully, the problem will get sorted out over time, as the Mach4 user base grows.

[wmgeorge]

It's hard to tell whether the problem is with Vista, Mach4 or both. Several months ago when I was reading about it, the majority of contributors blamed Vista.

Maybe a solution hasn't been found, because the Mach4 user base isn't yet large enough to support the expense of developing a good plugin? I have no idea how many people are using Mach4, but I suspect the number is only a small fraction of Mach3 users. Hopefully, the problem will get sorted out over time, as the Mach4 user base grows.

But yours is working fine?

Also womdering if the new Acorn controller is going to take away some Mach3/4 customers? I am considering changing over.

[GME]

But yours is working fine?

Also womdering if the new Acorn controller is going to take away some Mach3/4 customers? I am considering changing over.

Mach4 works great. I have Mach3 and the windows patch, but I'll never go back.

Hard to tell about Acorn. My control hardware consists of PMDX 126, PMDX 107 and Smoothstepper ESS. To switch to Acorn, I'd have to scrap the Smoothstepper, since it only works with Mach3 & Mach4. I haven't looked into whether there is a way to make Acorn communicate through a network connection. If there isn't, it would a deal breaker for me - even if I was interested. Anyway, I am satisfied enough with my setup that I wouldn't take the time and effort to rework my control box.

Gary

[difalkner]

Ditto for me, Gary. Mach4 is all I know and have used and so far I've seen no limitations. But I am definitely not 'on the cutting edge' of using any of the software, Fusion 360 or Mach4. However, I've managed to get everything cut and built that I've needed to so mark me down as fully satisfied.

David

[GME]

But yours is working fine?

Also womdering if the new Acorn controller is going to take away some Mach3/4 customers? I am considering changing over.

Mach4 works great. I have Mach3 and the windows patch, but I'll never go back.

Hard to tell about Acorn. My control hardware consists of PMDX 126, PMDX 107 and Smoothstepper ESS. To switch to Acorn, I'd have to scrap the Smoothstepper, since it only works with Mach3 & Mach4. I haven't looked into whether there is a way to make Acorn communicate through a network connection. If there isn't, it would a deal breaker for me - even if I was interested. Anyway, I am satisfied enough with my setup that I wouldn't take the time and effort to rework my control box.

Gary

I went back and looked at your build thread. I see that you have the CNCRP control box, which uses the smoothstepper. Unless I'm missing something, you will have to scrap pretty much your whole control system and migrate over to the Acorn BOB. In my post above, I forgot that Acorn has its own board, which includes an ethernet connection. I went back and took another look and now see that replacement of the software also necessitates replacement of the electronics. For me, Acorn would have to be way better than Mach4 to get me to part with the $$$ and invest the time and effort to change over. Whether, or to what extent, it is better is an open question. You are going to find supporters and detractors when it comes to just about anything, so getting a good, objective read when comparing one system to another can be difficult.

Admittedly, the Acorn package is priced competitively. At $300, you get both the hardware and software, although it's an additional $139 for the Pro version of the software. I suspect most would go with the pro, so the cost would be closer to $440. Considering that Mach4 Hobby is $200, that doesn't sound too bad. My hardware costs (Mach4 Hobby, 2 PMDX boards, Smoothstepper) were much higher in aggregate. The biggest downside for me (aside from scrapping my present control system) is the 4-axis limitation. I'm planing to add a rotary 5th axis for wood lathe type milling, and prefer a dedicated 5th stepper driver to run it. Acorn won't support that.

Gary

[PLJack]

I went back and looked at your build thread. I see that you have the CNCRP control box, which uses the smoothstepper. Unless I'm missing something, you will have to scrap pretty much your whole control system and migrate over to the Acorn BOB. In my post above, I forgot that Acorn has its own board, which includes an ethernet connection. I went back and took another look and now see that replacement of the software also necessitates replacement of the electronics. For me, Acorn would have to be way better than Mach4 to get me to part with the $$$ and invest the time and effort to change over. Whether, or to what extent, it is better is an open question. You are going to find supporters and detractors when it comes to just about anything, so getting a good, objective read when comparing one system to another can be difficult.

Admittedly, the Acorn package is priced competitively. At $300, you get both the hardware and software, although it's an additional $139 for the Pro version of the software. I suspect most would go with the pro, so the cost would be closer to $440. Considering that Mach4 Hobby is $200, that doesn't sound too bad. My hardware costs (Mach4 Hobby, 2 PMDX boards, Smoothstepper) were much higher in aggregate. The biggest downside for me (aside from scrapping my present control system) is the 4-axis limitation. I'm planing to add a rotary 5th axis for wood lathe type milling, and prefer a dedicated 5th stepper driver to run it. Acorn won't support that.

Gary

I believe the Acorn software is tied to the board. So if the board fails you need to buy the software again.
Just an FYI.

[Ntl]

I went back and looked at your build thread. I see that you have the CNCRP control box, which uses the smoothstepper. Unless I'm missing something, you will have to scrap pretty much your whole control system and migrate over to the Acorn BOB. In my post above, I forgot that Acorn has its own board, which includes an ethernet connection. I went back and took another look and now see that replacement of the software also necessitates replacement of the electronics. For me, Acorn would have to be way better than Mach4 to get me to part with the $$$ and invest the time and effort to change over. Whether, or to what extent, it is better is an open question. You are going to find supporters and detractors when it comes to just about anything, so getting a good, objective read when comparing one system to another can be difficult.

Admittedly, the Acorn package is priced competitively. At $300, you get both the hardware and software, although it's an additional $139 for the Pro version of the software. I suspect most would go with the pro, so the cost would be closer to $440. Considering that Mach4 Hobby is $200, that doesn't sound too bad. My hardware costs (Mach4 Hobby, 2 PMDX boards, Smoothstepper) were much higher in aggregate. The biggest downside for me (aside from scrapping my present control system) is the 4-axis limitation. I'm planing to add a rotary 5th axis for wood lathe type milling, and prefer a dedicated 5th stepper driver to run it. Acorn won't support that.

Gary

They have add on breakout board in production that will support if I remember correctly 7 axis. They also are getting close to releasing the router update for the mill pro software that will have auto square along with other router specific items, also they have a plasma add on in the works. They are aggressively developing the software and hardware based off the user input. So far, granted my machine isn’t finished and I have zero experience with another controller I’m extremely happy with the controller. It does everything I need and has been pretty simple to get up and running once I figured out what I needed to do. My biggest problem was just a lack of experience with cnc controllers and just a overall lack of cnc knowledge on my part. One of the great things is how simple the wizard setup is once you understand how everything works. And as far as the CNC12 control software goes it’s fantastic and the same software their high end controllers run considering how expensive my design software is the $440 I have into the controller is a bargain, I spend $60 a month just for my Adobe and I don’t own it. I will have more videos of the software running my router as soon as it’s finished.

Dan

[PLJack]

They have add on breakout board in production that will support if I remember correctly 7 axis. They also are getting close to releasing the router update for the mill pro software that will have auto square along with other router specific items, also they have a plasma add on in the works. They are aggressively developing the software and hardware based off the user input. So far, granted my machine isn’t finished and I have zero experience with another controller I’m extremely happy with the controller. It does everything I need and has been pretty simple to get up and running once I figured out what I needed to do. My biggest problem was just a lack of experience with cnc controllers and just a overall lack of cnc knowledge on my part. One of the great things is how simple the wizard setup is once you understand how everything works. And as far as the CNC12 control software goes it’s fantastic and the same software their high end controllers run considering how expensive my design software is the $440 I have into the controller is a bargain, I spend $60 a month just for my Adobe and I don’t own it. I will have more videos of the software running my router as soon as it’s finished.

Dan

Auto square!. Hmm, Will give it a look when released. Thanks.

Jack.

[wmgeorge]

The Mach3 has some issues, I have had a couple even with the ESS interface. That might be solved with Mach4, but the Acorn is designed and the software done by professionals that have done so for years.

As for me changing over? If it gets updated with features and called Final, then No big deal I pull out the BOB and ESS card and swap it out. Install the new Acorn card and connect the same as before. Still Ethernet, still has the same connections to the stepper drive boards and etc.

The stuff I pull out, there is a resale value.

[Ntl]

I believe the Acorn software is tied to the board. So if the board fails you need to buy the software again.
Just an FYI.

No they send you a new license.

[wmgeorge]

No they send you a new license.

Ditto I was going to add that but you beat me to it!! The software programing is always in a update mode and being done by professionals. I predict within a few years the Acorn or Acorn II will replace Mach3/4.

As far as changeover costs. not a big deal for me anyway and I can handle the electrical without a lot of hand holding. I have picked up some interested clients / customers for long term projects. I just need to get caught up on what I am doing now!

[ger21]

I predict within a few years the Acorn or Acorn II will replace Mach3/4.

Not unless it starts getting supplied with a LOT of ready to run machines.

Mach3 should have been dead 5 years ago.
The reason it's still popular, is because:
1) CNC Router Parts still uses it (I was told due to customer demand)
2) Thousands of chinese machines are setup to use Mach3 (Even though most come with a pirated version).

Unless they make drastic changes, Mach4 will never gain much popularity, as it's too difficult to set up for the average user.

People will gravitate to whatever is most popular. Right now, it's still Mach3, despite all of it's shortcomings.

[Ntl]

Ditto I was going to add that but you beat me to it!! The software programing is always in a update mode and being done by professionals. I predict within a few years the Acorn or Acorn II will replace Mach3/4.

As far as changeover costs. not a big deal for me anyway and I can handle the electrical without a lot of hand holding. I have picked up some interested clients / customers for long term projects. I just need to get caught up on what I am doing now!

I spent a year and a half researching before I pulled the trigger on my Fineline Automation Saturn, I wanted to make sure the controller was the best I could afford since I had a horrible experience with a dtg printer that was twice what my cnc machine cost me and I never could get to run properly before I sold it off. The software/controller for me was the most important part of the build since the mechanical aspect of the machine could be near perfect, but if the software is glitchy or just a pain to operate none of the other stuff matters. So far with just bench testing and playing with the software, the only problems I have had have been user error. I’m very impressed with what a great job Centroid did and I’m honestly amazed that it’s considered hobby grade since the software is almost identical to the software that they put on their high end controllers. I personally think that anyone who is in the market for a new controller that doesn't give it a hard look especially for a simple router like what I’m building is missing out on a great deal. I don’t think there’s anything else even close for the money, and with all the new updates and additional hardware that’s being developed it was definitely the right decision for me personally. I’m not worried about the fact that it’s new since companies that have been around for 30 + years don’t rush products to market. It’s like I wasn’t worried about buying my ESAB Rebel because it was new and not a lot of people had one yet at the time. Just my opinion for what it’s worth.

[PLJack]

No they send you a new license.

Glad to hear that. I may have got that information from an older CNC NutZ episode.
Definitely going to keep my eye on them.

BTW: There is an interview with Keith McCulloch from CentroidCNC about the Acorn back in 2017. That was where I first heard of that board.
Link here: #CNC Router Tips CentroidCNC Acorn DIY CNC Controller - #CNC Router Tips

[Ntl]

Glad to hear that. I may have got that information from an older CNC NutZ episode.
Definitely going to keep my eye on them.

BTW: There is an interview with Keith McCulloch from CentroidCNC about the Acorn back in 2017. That was where I first heard of that board.
Link here: #CNC Router Tips CentroidCNC Acorn DIY CNC Controller - #CNC Router Tips

He’s one of the guys who helps out with forum support. Even though you have to pay for factory support their forum with his help and others is free and has gotten me threw my system setup relatively easily. It’s a different business model than I’m used to, but it works great once you get used to it and I’m sure it helps keep the cost down. I have everything bench tested and functional and now that I got my replacement parts from Fineline I should have everything installed for testing and table calibration very soon.

I don’t have any other controller experience so it’s possible that it’s making things easier for me since I don’t have to unlearn a different software. I know sometimes it can be frustrating when you’re used to having certain options with one software and a they are different with another. From everything I’ve read and know about CNC12 it will do anything you could possibly need it to. For me it will be awhile before I get the full use out of the capabilities since I’m so new to CNC, but it’s easy to pick up even if you have zero experience. I’ll be sure to keep everyone updated on my build thread for anyone that’s interested in using something different than Mach or UCCNC or Linux. I think what a lot of people will like based off some of the complaints I’ve read about Mach, is that the way the Acorn controller is built the computer is actually on the board and you cncpc is just telling it what to do if that makes any sense. It’s technically running on Linux from what I’ve been able to figure out based off the BeagleBoneGreen that’s attached to the Acorn board. It seems that it makes the controller perform like a closed loop system or makes it a closed loop? I’m not smart enough honestly to know exactly how it works and I’m just making a educated guess. And if I’m wrong about anything please correct me, I don’t want to be giving anyone bad information.

I do know for 100 that so far I’m feeling really good about my controller choice and I can’t wait to start cutting parts with my Fineline router.