thinking about buying a fineline Saturn

[jram]

Hello all,
I am in the market for a small CNC and I have been looking at the 4x4 cnc on the site that is listed at 2175. Is there any reason not to go with the older model? I would be using in a small scale art studio doing occasional furniture pieces and urethane sign board. Is this a good way to go? I have also been looking at the CNCRP standard series, I have 5,000 to spend but could go a bit over for the total project including electronics.

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[difalkner]

I can tell you that our 2x4 Saturn is very rigid and accurate, especially now that I just finished doing some intense calibration.

David

[wmgeorge]

The 4x4 listed for that price is just what you see in the picture. No electronics or motors. You need to ask Nate about a complete package price. My guess it would be close to $5000 or so.

[ger21]

Is there any reason not to go with the older model?

Because it's not nearly as good. Many people that started with the CNCRP Standard version, have upgraded them to the Pro version.
If you can afford it, I'd recommend the CNCRP Pro series or the Saturn. You get a much better machine, even though it cost a lot more.

But when you add in the electonics, it may put you over your budget.

It's hard to be the Saturn for bang for the buck. But if support is important to you, I think that CNCRP has better support, but you are paying more for it.

[wmgeorge]

The Saturn 2 4x4 like I purchased is welded heavy duty steel. Very solid and did I say heavy and it really needs the NEMA 34 motor package.

[DDgitfiddle]

The less expensive machines at FineLine (i.e. NOT the Saturn series) do not have the same level of rigidity or accuracy as the Saturns. The bearing system is rollers running on steel plate instead of heavy duty linear guide rails. The frame is not as beefy either. The Saturns are a much better design. If budget is the limit, consider the 4x2 Saturn for only a little more. As mentioned in previous responses, the electronics and motors are not included at that price. To stay within your budget, you may need to assemble the electronics yourself. You may find that you have to go with NEMA 23 steppers to keep the budget down, but you might be able to find some decent NEMA 34 size that are not too expensive. As your motor power goes up, you have to increase other things at the same time. (Power supplies, wire, etc). Good luck!

-Robert

[jram]

The less expensive machines at FineLine (i.e. NOT the Saturn series) do not have the same level of rigidity or accuracy as the Saturns. The bearing system is rollers running on steel plate instead of heavy duty linear guide rails. The frame is not as beefy either. The Saturns are a much better design. If budget is the limit, consider the 4x2 Saturn for only a little more. As mentioned in previous responses, the electronics and motors are not included at that price. To stay within your budget, you may need to assemble the electronics yourself. You may find that you have to go with NEMA 23 steppers to keep the budget down, but you might be able to find some decent NEMA 34 size that are not too expensive. As your motor power goes up, you have to increase other things at the same time. (Power supplies, wire, etc). Good luck!

-Robert

thank you for the response.I'm really starting to lean towards the 2x4 saturn 2 as it does look like a nice machine. I was thinking about just doing the electronics myself to save some money. I built an X carve and a few 3d printers so I'm hoping that it isn't too complex. Should Nema 23s be fine with that machine? I am not a business and don't anticipate ever needing really quick machining done.

[ger21]

Small Nema 34 motors like this should be far more powerful than Nema 23's, for only a few $$ more.
https://www.automationtechnologiesin...-single-shaft/

Get some decent drives, like these:
https://www.automationtechnologiesin...iver-kl-8060e/
or these:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Leadshine-A...4AAMXQOT5Q~Sn9

and a 60V power supply.

You might spend $200-$300 more than a cheap Nema 23 setup, but will get much better performance

[wmgeorge]

100% what Gerry said. Stick with something that is proven and works. I went with pre-wired and with control panel done for me. I have had the fun of building in the past and I just wanted to work when I got done. Nothing sadder and you can read it on CNC Zone, where someone spent a lot of time and money on a build and it just didn't work. Excuses from venders and shoulda did this and that. I make money with my machines, at times anyway. I do not need ruined customer material because of shortcomings.

[BasementEngineer]

I side with wmgeorge. I got the NEMA23's prewired package (I have a Saturn 2x4) and it runs fantastic. I'm not ploughing through an inch of material at a time so speed/power is more than enough.

[jram]

I side with wmgeorge. I got the NEMA23's prewired package (I have a Saturn 2x4) and it runs fantastic. I'm not ploughing through an inch of material at a time so speed/power is more than enough.

good point, I'm thinking I'll do the nema 23 kit. What is everyone doing for cable chain? 199.00 seems to be quite a bit to pay for that. Any other options that are less expensive. Also what are the must haves? I know that I will need the proximity sensors and a mount as I will just be using a Porter cable 690 to start since I don't have 220 int he shop until next summer.

[DDgitfiddle]

good point, I'm thinking I'll do the nema 23 kit. What is everyone doing for cable chain? 199.00 seems to be quite a bit to pay for that. Any other options that are less expensive. Also what are the must haves? I know that I will need the proximity sensors and a mount as I will just be using a Porter cable 690 to start since I don't have 220 int he shop until next summer.

I do tend to agree with Ger21 about the NEMA 32 motors. If you can swing the extra few hundred dollars, you will be happier with the bigger motors. They will have more overhead and will be pushed less in operation. They will be more reliable in the long run. The NEMA 23 Motors will work, but they will be underpowered. My suggestion was strictly to save a little cash.

For cable chain, I’m not sure I understand the question. The Saturn systems come with the cable chains, I think. (Mine did.). With the plug and play electronics, you would have everything you need other than sensors I think. The limit switch sensors that Fineline sells are good quality, and when combined with the cables, the price is really not much more than you can get from other places. You can find less expensive sensors, but the cables add up, even if you decide to solder connectors on yourself.

-Robert

[jram]

Thanks for the tips, I didn’t realize that it came with the chain, that will save me a bit if it does.

[Erik F]

If you decide to go with the Saturn. Ask Nate if he has any of the first versions of the Saturn still around. He gave me a killer deal on mine and it is basicly a v2 minus a few details.

[jram]

If you decide to go with the Saturn. Ask Nate if he has any of the first versions of the Saturn still around. He gave me a killer deal on mine and it is basicly a v2 minus a few details.

Hi Erik,
That’s exactly what I’d like to do if he still has some around. Do you have any completed pics of yours ? Also , are the few things you mentioned easily fixed ?

[wmgeorge]

Go with the welded frame and gantry if you can swing it, or at least the welded frame.

[DDgitfiddle]

Hi Erik,
That’s exactly what I’d like to do if he still has some around. Do you have any completed pics of yours ? Also , are the few things you mentioned easily fixed ?

Check out my build thread or David’s (difalkner) for images of the first generation Saturn 4x2.

https://www.cnczone.com/forums/finel...rum-posts.html

-Robert

[difalkner]

Here's the link to mine if you want to check it out - 2nd Build First

David

[Erik F]

Hi Erik,
That’s exactly what I’d like to do if he still has some around. Do you have any completed pics of yours ? Also , are the few things you mentioned easily fixed ?

The main differences are the connection point between the y sleds and the gantry cross beam. And the mounting points for the end stop sensors. Mine is a steel gantry, came with the tramming plate on the z. I also bought the stand from Nate. It's a lot of beef for the money, but my experience is it's not going to be plug and play with Nate's machines. You will probably find a few things that will leave you scratching your head, but overall I think you could have a nice set up for 5k.

[jram]

Thanks for all of the help/responses. Can anyone chime in on how a completed 4x4 would compare to a kronos robotics 50x50 machine? I would like a fineline saturn if possible,but can only wait so long for him to contact me so I have been looking at other options just in case he doesn't get back to me.