Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase


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Thread: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

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    Default Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    I just bought a Fadal vmc15 XT that runs on 3phase. I don’t want to buy a phase converter so Is there a way to wire the machine up to single phase by bye passing the transformer? If that’s not an option what about installing a single phase transformer? If anyone has a pic or the manual on the ele-0201 T813 single phase transformer for the DC vmc15 message me. If anyone has or knows where I can find the ele-0201 transformer let me know thanks.

    Jeff

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    Member machinehop5's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    ... Similar Threads showed a link that might help ya
    https://www.cnczone.com/forums/showt...ingle%20phase)

    DJ



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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by machinehop5 View Post
    ... Similar Threads showed a link that might help ya
    https://www.cnczone.com/forums/showt...ingle%20phase)

    DJ
    I appreciate the thread but the individual never got the machine running. From all the post I have read on this subject, people say they have done it but have never posted how they did it. The machines are not all the same. Some of the Fadal vmc15’s are AC drives so they would be very easy to set up to get rid of the transformer. I need someone who has actually done this to a VMC15 with DC drives show me their wiring diagram of how they did it with no drive errors.

    Thanks for the help
    Jeff



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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by ballistic42 View Post
    I appreciate the thread but the individual never got the machine running. From all the post I have read on this subject, people say they have done it but have never posted how they did it. The machines are not all the same. Some of the Fadal vmc15’s are AC drives so they would be very easy to set up to get rid of the transformer. I need someone who has actually done this to a VMC15 with DC drives show me their wiring diagram of how they did it with no drive errors.

    Thanks for the help
    Jeff
    It's not only the DC drives you have the spindle VFD drive that needs to be correctly wired, these machines where available as single phase so I don't think they would of made it to difficult to change over

    Here is I think what you need to change it to use single phase

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase-fadal-vmc15-3-jpg  
    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by ballistic42 View Post
    I appreciate the thread but the individual never got the machine running. From all the post I have read on this subject, people say they have done it but have never posted how they did it. The machines are not all the same. Some of the Fadal vmc15’s are AC drives so they would be very easy to set up to get rid of the transformer. I need someone who has actually done this to a VMC15 with DC drives show me their wiring diagram of how they did it with no drive errors.

    Thanks for the help
    Jeff
    Here is a PDF also for Fadal VMC for single phase power connection

    If you have to they do have a Transformer that can be changed

    Attached Files Attached Files
    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by ballistic42 View Post
    I appreciate the thread but the individual never got the machine running. From all the post I have read on this subject, people say they have done it but have never posted how they did it. The machines are not all the same. Some of the Fadal vmc15’s are AC drives so they would be very easy to set up to get rid of the transformer. I need someone who has actually done this to a VMC15 with DC drives show me their wiring diagram of how they did it with no drive errors.

    Thanks for the help
    Jeff
    did you find the transformer?
    i considered switching to a 1-phase option but found it was less costly and easier to buy a phase converter.



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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    fadal maybe inventors?

    Last edited by machinehop5; 11-18-2020 at 04:03 AM. Reason: haas been


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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by everettengr View Post
    did you find the transformer?
    i considered switching to a 1-phase option but found it was less costly and easier to buy a phase converter.
    A rotary phase converter is a bad idea for CNC machines, unless you brought a Phase Perfect which are no cheap, so it is best to use the transformer that some already have, just some simple wiring change you would be up and running

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    A rotary phase converter is a bad idea for CNC machines, unless you brought a Phase Perfect which are no cheap, so it is best to use the transformer that some already have, just some simple wiring change you would be up and running
    why???
    when i looked, the 1-phase transformer was not available.
    also, my rotary phase converter is specifically designed for CNC or other voltage sensitive equipment.
    you only need the 3rd leg for the spindle inverter.
    the axis amp, chassis and DC side should be wired to L1 & L2.
    i've been running my VMC for a few years without issue.
    what problems have you encountered?



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    Community Moderator Jim Dawson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    I've not seen a problem with running a CNC machine on a CNC rated RPC. I've not had any problems with my 10HP CNC lathe (2 years), nor have I seen problems with 3 other installations that I am familiar with going back at least 3 years, including one 20x40 Fadal.

    Jim Dawson
    Sandy, Oregon, USA


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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by everettengr View Post
    why???
    when i looked, the 1-phase transformer was not available.
    also, my rotary phase converter is specifically designed for CNC or other voltage sensitive equipment.
    you only need the 3rd leg for the spindle inverter.
    the axis amp, chassis and DC side should be wired to L1 & L2.
    i've been running my VMC for a few years without issue.
    what problems have you encountered?
    What Hp is your spindle you most likely don't need the 3rd leg L1 and L2 will run VFD Drives if you are not over 7.5 Hp Spindle, over time they will damage the VFD Drive and sometimes other electronics

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Dawson View Post
    I've not seen a problem with running a CNC machine on a CNC rated RPC. I've not had any problems with my 10HP CNC lathe (2 years), nor have I seen problems with 3 other installations that I am familiar with going back at least 3 years, including one 20x40 Fadal.
    They will all fail give them time I have replaced many VFD Drives on CNC machines that where using RPC inefficient junk

    If you are just running a AC motor no VFD Drive then not problem AC 3Ph motors can take a hammering, but VFD Drives can not

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    What Hp is your spindle you most likely don't need the 3rd leg L1 and L2 will run VFD Drives if you are not over 7.5 Hp Spindle, over time they will damage the VFD Drive and sometimes other electronics
    this is not correct. completely different transformers are required for single and 3-phase power. check the transformers section for your VMC.
    a CNC rated RPC matches phase, frequency and voltage and will not cause problems if it is properly set up.
    do you have specific case of a CNC rated RPC causing damage to the VFD. if so, please provide the make of the RPC and details of the problem.



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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    FYI I have two NEW 12.6" TSUDAKOMA MDL. RNCM-301R 4TH AXIS ROTARY TABLES still in crates that have Fadal drive motors if anyone can use. I'm changing one out to a Fanuc drive.

    Skinnykempf



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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by everettengr View Post
    this is not correct. completely different transformers are required for single and 3-phase power. check the transformers section for your VMC.
    a CNC rated RPC matches phase, frequency and voltage and will not cause problems if it is properly set up.
    do you have specific case of a CNC rated RPC causing damage to the VFD. if so, please provide the make of the RPC and details of the problem.
    Why would you need a different Transformer, you are still using your 240v single phase supply to the Transformer you have, the VFD Drive will run on the same 240v Single phase supply

    The only time you need a different Transformer is if you have the 380v to 420v Transformer and if you are using 240v Single phase now then you don't need any change as your Transformer is most likely the 190v to 260v which can be taped for single phase use

    It is correct I repair VFD Drives and always know where they come from, most failure's are from RPC driven VFD Drives

    CNC rated you have to be kidding an extra smoothing cap built in to the starting, and a sticker that says CNC rated, just more dollars for the same piece of inefficient junk

    There are many post here on the Zone of RPC damage to CNC machines

    Last edited by mactec54; 11-19-2020 at 10:31 AM. Reason: added more
    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Alright well I read a bunch of bs from some people who sound like they have never done what they are saying.

    I have a fadal vmc5020 ht that runs off a 30hp rotary converter no problem. Funny enough my 4020 (it’s also much newer) that is in a shop with perfect 3 phase right at 240v blew the spindle drive but the other one is still fine.

    Now I’ve also converted a fadal to single phase and I’ve owned a factory single phase Fadal. I can tell you the single phase transformer is a bunch of bs. And will only work if you incoming voltage is between 230v and 240v

    I blew an inverter in my factory single phase due to incoming power at around 248v.

    What you could see if you look at the wiring diagrams for those transformers is that they wire the VFD direct to line voltage no transformer for the most voltage sensitive item....

    If you want to make your fadal single phase just move whatever is on one of the legs of the transformer and find another tap with similar voltage and move it there then just use 2 legs of the 3 phase transformer.

    And I wouldn’t recommend it but if you want you can even put your VFD direct to line voltage like the single phase transformers do. One note about that. The reason I believe they did that is the VFD will pull more current so it would have had to be a much bigger transformer so instead they just bypassed it:

    And another note not all fadal vfds work on single phase. I had one that this was the case.

    I thought I posted for you to send me a PM at the beginning of this thread and I could help you with the wiring.



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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Hey guys, long time lurker but first post/comment/reply here.

    I have been doing a stupid amount of research trying to find out if my new to me 1995 Fadal 3016 can be run on single phase, and this thread is recent so I figure I'd check with you all. Tried talking to Fadal part suppliers and they all just try to sell you parts without understanding your situation.

    The machine has DC servos so it should need the T-813 transformer for the single phase conversion. However, the spindle drive was replaced around 2006 with a Yaskawa G7, and from what I have seen this spindle drive can ONLY take 3 phase input. So, in order to run on single phase, I would also need a new spindle drive to run it, right? If that's the case I will just get a RPC.

    If anyone can confirm this, that would be incredible. I have probably logged 20 hours of research this week just trying to answer this one question.

    Thanks in advance!



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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by ianagos View Post
    Alright well I read a bunch of bs from some people who sound like they have never done what they are saying.

    I have a fadal vmc5020 ht that runs off a 30hp rotary converter no problem. Funny enough my 4020 (it’s also much newer) that is in a shop with perfect 3 phase right at 240v blew the spindle drive but the other one is still fine.

    Now I’ve also converted a fadal to single phase and I’ve owned a factory single phase Fadal. I can tell you the single phase transformer is a bunch of bs. And will only work if you incoming voltage is between 230v and 240v

    I blew an inverter in my factory single phase due to incoming power at around 248v.

    What you could see if you look at the wiring diagrams for those transformers is that they wire the VFD direct to line voltage no transformer for the most voltage sensitive item....

    If you want to make your fadal single phase just move whatever is on one of the legs of the transformer and find another tap with similar voltage and move it there then just use 2 legs of the 3 phase transformer.

    And I wouldn’t recommend it but if you want you can even put your VFD direct to line voltage like the single phase transformers do. One note about that. The reason I believe they did that is the VFD will pull more current so it would have had to be a much bigger transformer so instead they just bypassed it:

    And another note not all fadal vfds work on single phase. I had one that this was the case.

    I thought I posted for you to send me a PM at the beginning of this thread and I could help you with the wiring.
    The VFD Drive you could not get to run has a phase missing detection this is easy to solve if you want to know how you can send a PM

    The machines we are talking about are the smallest machines Fadal made with a low power requirement

    Mactec54


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    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by hackettindustries View Post
    Hey guys, long time lurker but first post/comment/reply here.

    I have been doing a stupid amount of research trying to find out if my new to me 1995 Fadal 3016 can be run on single phase, and this thread is recent so I figure I'd check with you all. Tried talking to Fadal part suppliers and they all just try to sell you parts without understanding your situation.

    The machine has DC servos so it should need the T-813 transformer for the single phase conversion. However, the spindle drive was replaced around 2006 with a Yaskawa G7, and from what I have seen this spindle drive can ONLY take 3 phase input. So, in order to run on single phase, I would also need a new spindle drive to run it, right? If that's the case I will just get a RPC.

    If anyone can confirm this, that would be incredible. I have probably logged 20 hours of research this week just trying to answer this one question.

    Thanks in advance!
    No your G7 will run just fine with Single Phase R and S terminal connection, if it has phase loss detection then let me know and I can help with that

    Mactec54


  20. #20

    Default Re: Fadal VMC15 XT 3 Phase to single phase

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    No your G7 will run just fine with Single Phase R and S terminal connection, if it has phase loss detection then let me know and I can help with that
    Thanks for the info! I just skimmed the documentation and didn't see anything about it being able to run single phase. Just don't want to break anything haha. So for the transformers, I don't even need to purchase the Fadal "single phase" transformer? I have clean 240v coming into my garage right now. It is right on 240. Do you have any steps to follow to get the machine running on 240v single phase? Do I even need the existing transformer or is it best to bypass it? Thanks again!



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