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Thread: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

  1. #25
    Gold Member amitkumar171's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Quote Originally Posted by TomKerekes View Post
    Hi Amit,

    Please show us your Screen Script and the C Code that writes the temperature to the Screen.

    Regards
    Hi tom,

    That showing temperature to KmotionCNC screen is done.

    Thanks for your support. Now only U axis Jog buttons is not on KmotionCNC screen.

    How to make jog buttons for U axis similar to X, Y, Z, A, B, C axis.

    waiting for your kind reply.


    THANK YOU

    Regards

    Amit Kumar


  2. #26
    Gold Member TomKerekes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Hi Amit,

    How to make jog buttons for U axis similar to X, Y, Z, A, B, C axis.
    You asked this question last year. See:
    https://www.cnczone.com/forums/dynom...ml#post2094854

    Please respond to our suggestions there.

    Regards

    TK
    http://dynomotion.com


  3. #27
    Gold Member amitkumar171's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Quote Originally Posted by TomKerekes View Post
    Hi Amit/Vignesh,

    #3 Set increasing Set Points (0 - 2047) and create a Table of commanded ADC values vs Measured Temperatures. Be careful not to go to too high of a temperature and burn up your nozzle. You must wait for the temperature to stabilize after each change of set point before taking the temperature reading.


    HTH
    Regards

    Hi tom,

    I have a doubt, How to calculate maximum ADC counts to input in your suggestion above mentioned. When i am using 12V power supply, and SEMITEC 104 GT2 Thermistor. ?

    What will be the max ADC counts that i can put in MDI to measure minimum and maximum temperature range.


    Waiting for your kind reply

    Regards

    Amit Kumar


  4. #28
    Gold Member TomKerekes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Hi Amit,

    I don't really understand what you are asking. The ADC min-max range id 0-4097. Increase/decrease ADC setpoint gradually to test the range of temperatures you need.

    I Google searched for your sensor and found this:

    Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup-104gt2-params-png


    I believe this is the appropriate resistance formula

    Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup-formula-png

    From KNozz Manual:
    ADC = 4095 x 10K / (10K + R)

    Plotting
    Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup-104gt2-rev2-png

    What temperature range are you expecting? What temperatures for ADC settings do you observe?

    If my math and plot is correct resolution will be poor over 150C.

    I've attached the Excel spreadsheet.

    Regards

    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by TomKerekes; 06-02-2018 at 04:07 PM. Reason: Fixed error regarding ADC range of 4095 not 2047. Curve fit over smaller range. Corrected Excel Upload
    TK
    http://dynomotion.com


  5. #29
    Gold Member amitkumar171's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Quote Originally Posted by TomKerekes View Post
    Hi Amit,

    What temperature range are you expecting? What temperatures for ADC settings do you observe?

    If my math and plot is correct resolution will be poor over 150C.

    I've attached the Excel spreadsheet.

    Regards
    Hi Tom,

    Thanks for your reply.

    I am expecting temperature range from 0-400 degree C.

    And i am getting temperature from 25 degree C to 287 degree C.

    After that it is not going forward , how to configure Knozz to reach that such temperature range. And how to increase resolution for thermistor calibration. And What voltage and current powersupply should I use to reach such temperature (0-400C). What ADC count is required to reach such temperature range. (0-400C).

    Waiting for your kind reply.

    Thank You

    Regards

    Amit Kumar


  6. #30
    Gold Member TomKerekes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Hi Amit,

    Note: there was a bug in my last post with ADC range of the plot being 2047 instead of 4095 counts. It should be now corrected.

    I am expecting temperature range from 0-400 degree C.
    That seems excessive. That sensor is only rated to 300C max. Do you really want or need this?

    And i am getting temperature from 25 degree C to 287 degree C.

    After that it is not going forward , how to configure Knozz to reach that such temperature range.
    I don't understand what you are saying. Are you measuring actual temperature with a thermometer? If you set the setpoint to 4096 ADC counts then the heater should stay on 100% and there should be no limit to the Temperature by KNozz.

    And What voltage and current powersupply should I use to reach such temperature (0-400C).
    That has to do with your system and the Nozzle heater.

    What ADC count is required to reach such temperature range. (0-400C)
    4096 would apply power 100% of the time.

    And how to increase resolution for thermistor calibration
    To get better resolution at such high temperature you could switch to higher resistance sensor such as the 105GT2. Or you could reduce the 10K reference resistor on KNozz by placing a 1K ohm resistor in parallel with the on-board 10K ohm resistor (connect from the Thermistor to GND). That should result in a plot like this:

    Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup-104gt2-parallel-1k-png

    The resolution at 300C is ~ 1/4 degree C. See also the attached spreadsheet. Note the curve fit is now made over more of the high range and provides a better fit of the high range.

    Regards

    Attached Files Attached Files
    TK
    http://dynomotion.com


  7. #31
    Gold Member amitkumar171's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Hi Tom,


    That seems excessive. That sensor is only rated to 300C max. Do you really want or need this?
    Yes i need this.

    I don't understand what you are saying. Are you measuring actual temperature with a thermometer?
    Yes i am measuring the actual temperature with thermometer

    Regards[/QUOTE]

    I tried the curve fitting method also but the curve i want to fit is 6th order polynomial so in KnozzMcodeTemp file what changes are required. When i am inputing 6th order polynomial in mcode file i am getting negative counts and negative temperature. How to correct this ? or implement 6th order inverse polynomial to solve ADCtoTemp() function inside that mcode file for 6th order polynomial equation.

    Waiting for your kind reply

    Thank You

    Regards

    Amit Kumar


  8. #32
    Gold Member TomKerekes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Hi Amit,

    I tried the curve fitting method also but the curve i want to fit is 6th order polynomial so in KnozzMcodeTemp file what changes are required.
    Change:


    Code:
    // function to convert Temp C to ADC counts
    float TempToADC(float T)
    {
        return  ((-0.000837 * T + 0.170202) * T + 4.565045) * T + 78.452228;  // 3rd order polynomial
    }

    To:

    Code:
    // function to convert Temp C to ADC counts
    float TempToADC(float T)
    {
        #define c6 0.0000 // 6th order coefficients
        #define c5 0.0000
        #define c4 0.0000
        #define c3 -0.000837
        #define c2 0.170202
        #define c1 4.565045
        #define c0 78.452228
        return  (((((c6*T+c5)*T+c4)*T+c3)*T+c2)*T+c1)*T+c0;  // 6rd order polynomial
    }
    When i am inputing 6th order polynomial in mcode file i am getting negative counts and negative temperature. How to correct this ?
    You would need to show us what you did.


    or implement 6th order inverse polynomial to solve ADCtoTemp() function inside that mcode file for 6th order polynomial equation.
    The numerical inverse solution should still work with a 6th order equation if it is well behaved. You might need to change the initial guesses to be over your range. change:

    float A, T, T0 = 0.0, T1 = 100.0; // initial guess 0 and 1

    to

    float A, T, T0 =50.0, T1 = 400.0; // initial guess 0 and 1


    In cases like this I always remember John von Neumann famously said:

    With four parameters I can fit an elephant, and with five I can make him wiggle his trunk.


    HTH
    Regards

    TK
    http://dynomotion.com


  9. #33
    Gold Member amitkumar171's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Quote Originally Posted by TomKerekes View Post
    Hi Amit,

    Change:


    Code:
    // function to convert Temp C to ADC counts
    float TempToADC(float T)
    {
        return  ((-0.000837 * T + 0.170202) * T + 4.565045) * T + 78.452228;  // 3rd order polynomial
    }

    To:

    Code:
    // function to convert Temp C to ADC counts
    float TempToADC(float T)
    {
        #define c6 0.0000 // 6th order coefficients
        #define c5 0.0000
        #define c4 0.0000
        #define c3 -0.000837
        #define c2 0.170202
        #define c1 4.565045
        #define c0 78.452228
        return  (((((c6*T+c5)*T+c4)*T+c3)*T+c2)*T+c1)*T+c0;  // 6rd order polynomial
    }
    You would need to show us what you did.


    The numerical inverse solution should still work with a 6th order equation if it is well behaved. You might need to change the initial guesses to be over your range. change:

    float A, T, T0 = 0.0, T1 = 100.0; // initial guess 0 and 1

    to

    float A, T, T0 =50.0, T1 = 400.0; // initial guess 0 and 1


    In cases like this I always remember John von Neumann famously said:
    With four parameters I can fit an elephant, and with five I can make him wiggle his trunk.


    HTH
    Regards
    Hi tom,

    I am using Knozz board connected with kflop board.

    I have connected thermistor Semitec 104GT2 100K ohm thermistor.

    When is set the temperature of 200 degrees using m code i am not getting exact temperature. as you said it is 1degree accurate.

    How to make it temperature and ADC count graph value accurate. ?

    Or i have studied PID temperature control used by arduino board. Proportional Integrative Derivative (PID) Based temperature control is accurate but it is not available with current Knozz Board.

    https://www.eurotherm.com/pid-control-made-easy

    Above link explains PID based temperature control.

    How to implement PID settings into Knozz Board.

    Waiting for positive response.


    Thank you

    AMIT KUMAR

    Regards

    Amit Kumar


  10. #34
    Gold Member TomKerekes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Hi Amit,

    When is set the temperature of 200 degrees using m code i am not getting exact temperature. as you said it is 1degree accurate.

    How to make it temperature and ADC count graph value accurate. ?
    In my previous email I asked:

    To get better resolution at such high temperature you could switch to higher resistance sensor such as the 105GT2. Or you could reduce the 10K reference resistor on KNozz by placing a 1K ohm resistor in parallel with the on-board 10K ohm resistor (connect from the Thermistor to GND).

    You never responded. Have you done this?

    Regards

    TK
    http://dynomotion.com


  11. #35
    Gold Member amitkumar171's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Quote Originally Posted by TomKerekes View Post
    Hi Amit,

    In my previous email I asked:

    To get better resolution at such high temperature you could switch to higher resistance sensor such as the 105GT2. Or you could reduce the 10K reference resistor on KNozz by placing a 1K ohm resistor in parallel with the on-board 10K ohm resistor (connect from the Thermistor to GND).

    You never responded. Have you done this?

    Regards
    Hi tom ,

    I tried above method still same problem is happening.

    How to solve my problem discussed earlier.


    Waiting for your positive response.

    Regards

    Amit Kumar


  12. #36
    Gold Member TomKerekes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

    Hi Amit,

    What did you do? What happens?

    Regards

    TK
    http://dynomotion.com


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Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup

Instruction on Knozz wiring and setup