Newbie Electronics Enclosure


Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: Electronics Enclosure

  1. #1
    Member Project_Hopeless's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Location
    Sterling Heights Michigan
    Posts
    114
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Question Electronics Enclosure

    With some artful wiring I can pack thing really tight, but that would not be practical, or good for air flow.

    For a medium size DIY build, 4 axis stepper, 500W PSU, Mesa card, what is a good size cabinet?

    Electronics Enclosure-my_cnc-enclosure-jpg

    Similar Threads:


  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    411
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    There is nothing wrong with packed tight so long as you allow for air flow. Just do a trial layout, like you are doing in the picture, with the equipment that goes in the box. You may also add a little extra room for the unexpected. Don't forget to design in the relays, terminal blocks, breakers, disconnects, fans and wire ducts.

    The price of the cabinet will be proportional to it's size. I like the Yuco IP66 enclosures. A 16x12x8 will probably be the one I use on my next project and it is $118 on Amazon.

    Remember, vendors spec the outer dimensions of the box, not the panel inside.



  3. #3
    ericks
    Guest

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    16 x 12 x 8 is a good size....



  4. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    411
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    Take a look at this thread. Some of these panels are HUGE, but may give you a better idea of what you want to do.

    https://www.cnczone.com/forums/mecha...816-cnc-2.html



  5. #5
    Member machinehop5's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    1567
    Downloads
    5
    Uploads
    2

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    Depends where you can mount the cabinet on the machine.....go big as you can. More elbow room working inside.

    Good luck on your Adventure



  6. #6

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    I repurposed a computer tower enclosure. Drill out everything that doesn't need to be there.



  7. #7
    Member rcheli's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    222
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    I used this one and tiny Gecko G203V drives and still ran out of space.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/YuCo-24-24-...UAAOSw46BZsUXn



  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    3920
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    Quote Originally Posted by Project_Hopeless View Post
    With some artful wiring I can pack thing really tight, but that would not be practical, or good for air flow.

    For a medium size DIY build, 4 axis stepper, 500W PSU, Mesa card, what is a good size cabinet?

    Electronics Enclosure-my_cnc-enclosure-jpg
    Panel building is a bit art and a bit science (well mostly science). However before your evne get started most manufactures of panel mounted electronics have recommendations for free area around their devices. In the case of a servo drive or stepper drive that might be 20 mm on the sides and 50 top and bottom. The values are generally there to assure air flow but you can at times close up these dimensions with forced air flow. So always start with these dimensions which are often found in the first few pages of the installation instructions.

    Sadly a lot of other parts with have no installation guidance at all. With these your best bet is to have the item on hand and consider how you would access the terminals for wiring and installation/removal. DIN rail mounted items are often released with a clip and that needs to be easy to get to.

    Terminal blocks need to be installed in such a way that you can easily see the terminal and get your fingers in place to slide the wires into the terminals. I would suggest at least two inches between the terminal and the wire way. By the way excessively large wire ways can be just as much of an issue as over packed wire ways.

    On some machinery the panel boxes actually have layers. That is there will be hinged sub panels mounted some distance above the main panel. Thsi can add significantly to the available space, especially if you layout the panel box with the tall items on one half of the box. With this arraingement your lower profile devices can sit behind the sub panel, just avoid putting stuff behind the sub panel you need to access regularly.

    Power relays, VFD's and other high current devices can benefit from extra access on one side of the device. This for debug and maintenance work such as monitoring current draw on a large motor or a set of resistance heaters. For things like heater bands a small half loop that allows easy snapping on of a current probe are ideal at the load side of the relay. This is of course extra space that you might not want to waste on all loads.

    Don't forget all the incoming cabling which can at times take up a lot of space (sometimes all of the bottom of a panel box). So you have a big bundle of wires that need to terminate to a terminal strip of some sort. In some cases (if permitted locally) you will want to run the shield cables for servos and VFD connected drives directly tot he VFD or the servo controller. Having enough space to layout the electronics so it is easy to get to, with these unbroken cables, is a huge advantage.

    When allocating terminal block points, don't forget that you will have a number of buses that will likely terminate at more that one terminal block. That is you will need multiple connections for machine ground, Neutral, AC phases, DC supplies and the like. How much depends upon what you are building and what you have access to but count on needing lots of I/O terminal strip points. Using multi level terminal blocks can help a lot here.

    We haven't even mentioned fuses or circuit breakers yet. How many and what type depends upon many factors.



  9. #9
    Member Project_Hopeless's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Location
    Sterling Heights Michigan
    Posts
    114
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    Quote Originally Posted by maxspongebob View Post
    There is nothing wrong with packed tight so long as you allow for air flow. Just do a trial layout, like you are doing in the picture, with the equipment that goes in the box. You may also add a little extra room for the unexpected. Don't forget to design in the relays, terminal blocks, breakers, disconnects, fans and wire ducts.

    The price of the cabinet will be proportional to it's size. I like the Yuco IP66 enclosures. A 16x12x8 will probably be the one I use on my next project and it is $118 on Amazon.

    Remember, vendors spec the outer dimensions of the box, not the panel inside.
    After thinking about it for a while I might go 16x16 with the Yuco. I'm thinking possibly the 6" deep version. How far off the panel does the back plain sit?


    Quote Originally Posted by wizard View Post
    When allocating terminal block points, don't forget that you will have a number of buses that will likely terminate at more that one terminal block. That is you will need multiple connections for machine ground, Neutral, AC phases, DC supplies and the like. How much depends upon what you are building and what you have access to but count on needing lots of I/O terminal strip points.
    I'm trying to keeps things relatively cheap being a hobby build. My thought was to wire the steppers and control board directly to the drives, limits to the control board. Then have a minimum number of terminals to distribute power. Are there any concerns with this approach?

    Last edited by Project_Hopeless; 04-09-2019 at 05:25 PM.


  10. #10
    ericks
    Guest

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    The ones from different suppliers i have used, the back plate is usually around 10 - 12mm from the back. You could just ask your supplier



  11. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    411
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    This was helpful for me to distribute power In my boxes. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

    These make it easy to distribute AC/DC power and ground to all the devices in your system. Don't put more than 1 wire in each side. BTW, you can get smaller jumpers to gang the blocks together or just cut the long ones. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1



  12. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    1740
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    A 6 inch deep with the back plate, which you need is not really deep enough for a VFD. Tight is fine, until you need to remove a wire or change out a part. Get all your parts together and lay out on the bench, before you buy the box. Remember your more than likely going to forget or want to add something later on. I got the 8 inch deep one from Amazon and was very happy with the construction.

    1000x750 Workbee CNC - Mach4 - PMDX USB - Windows 10 Pro


  13. #13
    Member Project_Hopeless's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Location
    Sterling Heights Michigan
    Posts
    114
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    Lastly I assume the cabinet should be vented? This build is a wood/plastic router so dust will fly.

    Any recommendations on how to vent, add makeup air to the cabinet to keep things reasonably cool? Should I order the cabinet with the bottom "gland"?



  14. #14
    Member davida1234's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    733
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    I put the fan in the top portion of the box, blowing out. Had air inlet openings at the bottom about 1.5 times the area of the fan and taped a HVAC register filter over the openings. Change it like once a year.



  15. #15
    Member Project_Hopeless's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Location
    Sterling Heights Michigan
    Posts
    114
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Question Re: Electronics Enclosure

    Well I picked up a 20x20x8 cabinet. My plan is to carry over this cabinet over from this build to a future build if I go that far. So I'm leaving space for a potential VFD.

    For these two 34V PSU with fan, is there any considerations when installing them, orientation? Any lessons learned? Any general advice on cabinet layout?

    Electronics Enclosure-controlcabinet01-jpg



  16. #16
    Member Ntl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    621
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    Quote Originally Posted by Project_Hopeless View Post
    Well I picked up a 20x20x8 cabinet. My plan is to carry over this cabinet over from this build to a future build if I go that far. So I'm leaving space for a potential VFD.

    For these two 34V PSU with fan, is there any considerations when installing them, orientation? Any lessons learned? Any general advice on cabinet layout?

    Electronics Enclosure-controlcabinet01-jpg
    Fans on the bottom pulling fresh air into the enclosure vent on the top just put filters in front of the fans and use a filter for the vent. Also you want more air coming in than exiting, the enclosure should become pressurized. You also want all the items that put out alot of heat mounted at the top. And keep ac power away from dc power and the electronics also keep the VFD away from the drivers and control board.



  17. #17
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    3920
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    Quote Originally Posted by Project_Hopeless View Post
    After thinking about it for a while I might go 16x16 with the Yuco. I'm thinking possibly the 6" deep version. How far off the panel does the back plain sit?


    I'm trying to keeps things relatively cheap being a hobby build. My thought was to wire the steppers and control board directly to the drives, limits to the control board. Then have a minimum number of terminals to distribute power. Are there any concerns with this approach?
    Point to point wiring isn’t a bad thing but it isn’t always ideal. For something like power supply to drives you really want individual wire sets from the supply to each drive. In other word don’t daisy chain power supply connections to high current loads. For other things like commons for a bank of relay coils it is fairly common to daisy chain the grounded conductor. If you expect to have DC supplies for things like limit switches and such then it is advisable to have a bus of power supply connections.

    I know this is for a hobby based machine but you want it to be safe. In this regard you need to be mindful of the load on the various wires in a machine. Even for AC this needs careful consideration, things like Neutrals should be numbered and only used for the fused sub circuit they are derived for. I’ve actually have seen terminal blocks melted out of a machine because an engineer didn’t pay attention to the loads place on a neutral wire. The likely hood of this happening on a home built router is low but still one needs to be midful of what is happening g current wise in a wire.



  18. #18
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    3920
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Electronics Enclosure

    These are all pretty good suggestions. I might suggest though that having the fan blow directly over the drives is an advantage. Also most panel boxes end up having lots of cables laying on the bottom of the panel box. To that end a side mounted lower fan might be a better move.

    Other things to consider is a disconnect / lock out switch. In a home setting this might be very important if there are lots of very young kids around. Space should be allocated for either circuit breakers or fuses for the major components. Being that I do a lot of industrial maintenance make sure you have room for test gear. Sooner or later something will need debugging and an overly cramped panel box is a big problem with maintenance.

    By the way maintenance issues especially apply to anything DIN rail mounted. I’ve seen it happen literally thousands of times where DIN rail clip on products end up to tightly mounted to the point that you can’t get to the release clamp. It is like the expect that a item will never fail. This of course is the classic struggle of fitting 10 pounds of stuff into a 5 pound bag.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ntl View Post
    Fans on the bottom pulling fresh air into the enclosure vent on the top just put filters in front of the fans and use a filter for the vent. Also you want more air coming in than exiting, the enclosure should become pressurized. You also want all the items that put out alot of heat mounted at the top. And keep ac power away from dc power and the electronics also keep the VFD away from the drivers and control board.




Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


About CNCzone.com

    We are the largest and most active discussion forum for manufacturing industry. The site is 100% free to join and use, so join today!

Follow us on


Our Brands

Electronics Enclosure

Electronics Enclosure