What parts do I need for an ATC air system
I have my ATC and am getting ready to install it. The last thing I need to get is the parts for the air system. I need everything.
It has 2 air hose connections. One to open one to close (There is a spring in the spindle that closes the clamp slowly).
What parts do I need to connect this to my system. I am using a smooth stepper for the control board. I assume I need some sort of solenoid to open and close the valves and a regulator for the air system. I would like to use industry standard stuff that would be usable in a home system. I'm not ever sure what the correct type of hose I need is called.
I am not sure what the names of the parts I need are called and where the best supplier is. Can anyone point me in the right direction?
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Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
I think you will find everything you need here: https://www.automationdirect.com/adc...tic_Components
Reasonable prices and good documentation where needed.
For a solenoid valve, you will need a 2 position, 5 port I think. Operating voltage compatible with your system.
Jim Dawson
Sandy, Oregon, USA
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
Agree with the above. You probably want a spring return version (single solenoid.) https://www.automationdirect.com/adc...ng%20Return%22
Probably want to hook 'A' to the close, 'B' to open, 'P' to the input pressure, 'R' and 'S' to exhaust silencers (vent to atmosphere) like these in the appropriate fitting https://www.automationdirect.com/adc...rt=price%20asc
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
Awesome thanks. It looks like they have everything I need. Looking at the site I think I will get a filter regulator as well.
I am planning to run the hose through the cable chains. Do is there a special style hose that I need or will any of them do.
The fittings on the spindle are 1/4" if that makes a difference.
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
Filter regulator is a good choice.
The poly hoses should work fine. Buy more fittings than you think you need, especially elbow unions. It really sucks to be one short. If I have small orders for Automation Direct, I infill with air fittings to bring up the order to the $50 minimum to get free shipping. You can never have too many air fitting around.
Jim Dawson
Sandy, Oregon, USA
On a home built system it might not be worthwhile but do consider a complete filter regulator system that also has a moisture trap and an airline lubricator. Lubrication can save a lot of grief in air systems.Originally Posted by TTalma
Of course in the home shop you could just squirt some oil in the lines every month.
I prefer thicker wall urathane hose for high flex applications. Thin wall poly can get kinked. Urathane seems to hold up better to the rubbing in drag chains.I am planning to run the hose through the cable chains. Do is there a special style hose that I need or will any of them do.
The most obvious thing here is to buy the right fittings for the hose and the plumbing parts. Note that many smaller valve bodies and cylinders use 1/8" NPT which might look like 1/4" to the untrained eye. If you are careful you can order all of your parts to use the same size pipe fittings.The fittings on the spindle are 1/4" if that makes a difference.
In any event back to that regulator / filter bank this usage doesnt require much in physical size and volume capacity. However it might pay to upgrade the regulator assembly to one that provides excess capacity beyound what the ATC needs. This to allow for air nozzles, lubricators, clamps or whatever else you find you might need. You might also need to provide for a rotary tool carousel or a cover for chip control wherever your holders get stored.
Some manufactures to look for:
SMC
Festo
Parker
Legris
Norgen
Mac
Bimba
Schrader
There are likely hundreds of more companies making this stuff. Ive had good impressions at work of valves made by Mac and Parker and to a lesser extent SMC. One area where we see issues is with the cheap plastic quick disconnects, make a point to buy better quality units. In someplaces you might want to use ferrul and nut connectors.
Speaking of airline connectors, air cylinders and some other devices need flow controls to manage velocities. You can find these built into connectors designed to be mounted directly on a cylinder or valve body. There are two types, meter in and meter out. Generally you want meter out. You can also get inline metering units which can be very useful as they can be positioned to allow for easy access. Also you do enjoy certain advantages when the valve is located near the part it is driving
In any event ideas off the top of my head. For one off installations i really like the Mac style valves. Beyond that you can get as fancy as the wallet allows.
Another thing to consider is that most vslve coil voltages are either 12VDC or 24 VDC with 24 common in industrial solutions. It probably woildnt hurt to keep this I/O isolated from any low voltage stuff you have happening as valves can be electrically noisie.
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
I'd size the regulator for the spindle's needs. Your other needs for air may need different pressures. Decent regulators for the amount of air most of this stuff needs are not too expensive. I plan on having 4 or 5 regulators on my router (my spindle itself takes 2 or 3 different pressures.)
Check for what filtration and dryness of the air your spindle wants. To keep the thing in good shape the longest you may need a dessicant dryer after your normal water trap, and then a filter after that. You may want to avoid adding a lubricator, mine at least advises against having oil in the air (permanently greased I guess?)
Edit: Depending upon how big your air system is you may want to look into a refrigerated dryer. These are much lower maintenance than dessicant driers (dessicant needs to be changed or dried by baking it,) though you may still want a dessicant dryer near more expensive parts that call out a specific dew point lower than a refrigerated dryer can do rather than just "clean dry air"
There are also self-refreshing dessicant filters, but they make refrigerated driers look cheap.
You have some good points here!
There are many issues with regulator arraingments in a machine but do consider the need for a master regulator to bring plant air down to the device operating pressure. One thing often missed with plastic hose and the associated quick disconnects is that they are only rated for 80 or 90 PSI. This means you may need brass/cooper or steel air lines before the regulators.
Of course in a home or even a small plant one likely has more control over the incoming "plant air pressure". For the guys new to air systems though it is important that components such as hoses and fittings be selected be capable of running at the correct pressures.
Usually it is a good idea to follow manufactures recommendations. Even where permitted to much lube is a problem. I highlight lubrication because at work absolutely nothing is permitted in the airlines thus we have machines running on very dry air or in some cases N2 (nitrogen) and frankly this raises hell with seal life.Check for what filtration and dryness of the air your spindle wants. To keep the thing in good shape the longest you may need a dessicant dryer after your normal water trap, and then a filter after that. You may want to avoid adding a lubricator, mine at least advises against having oil in the air (permanently greased I guess?)
Local environmental conditions are also a big factor. Im reminded around this time of year when humidity is high just how bad airline moisture can get. One foundry i use to work in literally had water running constantly out of the end of the air line runs. (there was a small quarter turn valve at the end of the run cracked open). This is pretty much the opposite of what i deal with today. In any event it highlights the importance of understanding local conditions. Also it highlights that little things can be done to reduce the impact of moisture and condensation in your air lines. Examples include pitching air lines towards a moisture/water drain of some type. Another is tapping a large air line from the top to prevent condensed water from flowing towards your machine.Edit: Depending upon how big your air system is you may want to look into a refrigerated dryer. These are much lower maintenance than dessicant driers (dessicant needs to be changed or dried by baking it,) though you may still want a dessicant dryer near more expensive parts that call out a specific dew point lower than a refrigerated dryer can do rather than just "clean dry air"
There are also self-refreshing dessicant filters, but they make refrigerated driers look cheap.
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
All the vinyl or rubber air hoses I've seen have been rated at least 200 PSI. Even the cheap yellow coiled plastic hoses are usually 185-200 PSI. Even push to connect fittings are usually rated over 200 PSI.
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
Thanks, Colombo states it should be set for 90 psi but will operate at 70 to 110psi.
I also see where some machines have nozzles to blow dust of the tool holder as the spindle lowers to chuck the tool holder. Is this something I should have? I plan on putting the tool holders along the edge of my machine. They won't have any covers on them. There will be a dust collector running and a dust shoe around the the end of the spindle.
I will be running this off my Craftsman air compressor. I am far from a commercial shop and my machine will probably get less than 5 hours a week of runtime on average. That's the luxury I have of this being a hobby is I try to make it pay for itself, but it doesn't have to. I have all sorts of logical reasons for putting an ATC on my machine, but in the end it really came down to I wanted to.
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
What type of interface does the spindle have to the holders? If it's HSK or a dual-contact type, you probably want both the air blast and the holders to be covered. I think most HSK spindles have 'cone clean' air channels built in. If it's a standard steep taper like BT or ISO, it's less necessary, but really should have at least the tools covered or an air blast, as a chip stuck to the taper can actually damage the spindle and holder, and of course add a ton of runout until it's removed.
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
An air blast is a good idea.
From my experience, with an HSK toolholder, the spindle won't grab the tool with a chip of about .01" caught between the toolholder and spindle. A chip of about .005" will cause the spindle to vibrate so bad it sounds like a helicopter.
Gerry
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Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
It's a iso 30 taper.
These are the tool holders I purchased.
An air blast would just be a valve, hoses and nozzles right? there is nothing fancy about them is there?
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
I believe so. Spindles that have it built in are fancier of course, but mostly something to get chips off those little saw teeth at the bottom of the taper.
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
There is a wide range of hose types that are commonly used in automation. Some of the urethane hoses only have a working pressure in the 100 to 125 PSI range depending upon whom you buy the hose from but I've seen ratings as low as 80 pounds. Reinforced hose obviously has a higher pressure rating. The quick disconnect fittings commonly used with urethane hose have pressure ratings that are all over the place depending upon manufacture and the manufactures series. If you are to run at 100 PSI or greater I'd probably suggest Nylon or other hose with a higher pressure rating.
In any event the reason i was looking an urethane hose is that it has very good characteristics in high wear / flex applications. WE have had good results With hose from Clippard for example. In any event the point I was trying to make is that if someone is about to buy a bunch of materials for a pneumatics project they should make a point to understand what they are buying to make sure it will operate the way it needs to operate.
Re: What parts do I need for an ATC air system
Actually you can get as fancy as your pocketbook can afford. You for example can state with simple nozzles like is found here: https://www.spray.com/spray_nozzles/compressed_air.aspx or get far more complex. We happen to use air nozzles at work that are built around a deionizer head for things that can't afford to have dust on them. A deionizing solution ups your cost a bit and may not be needed if the dust doesn't cling to your parts.
One thing to watch out for is strange effects that can happen with high velocity air. That is something that this guy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernoulli%27s_principle, put down as a science. In any event blowing arir around can result in unexpected behaviour of the parts that the air is blowing over. It should not be an issue with heavy tool holders but somethign to keep in mind.
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