New home made MadVac CNC router


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    Registered oneyaker's Avatar
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    Default New home made MadVac CNC router

    Here is my new home made 4'x8' CNC router and some pictures from the construction, controller ect...
    http://oneoceankayaks.com/madvac/madvac_index.htm

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    Wow.

    I am as impressed with your documentation as I am with your craftsmanship and ingenuity. 'Ya gotta love Moglice!

    Very nice work. Very nice design. Very nice of you to share. Thanks!

    Scott

    Consistency is a good thing....unless you're consistently an idiot.


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    Moderator CNCRob's Avatar
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    That looks great. It looks professionally built. Now you got me wanting a 4x8 machine, lol.



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    Great site and router! Thanks for sharing.
    Trent



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    very nice router. i have bookmarked your site for reading. looks like you were planning a dual z axis. how would this work in software?



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    Thank you.
    The W axis would be treated like a z axis in Visual Mill since they assume the fourth axis to be rotary. You take the g code for the psudo Z axis (W), substitute, W for Z in the code (so that Mach2 treats is as the 4th axis), paste the code into the main program, enter an G54-59 offset before running the W axis (cancel offset when you want to run the real Z axis) . This offset is a known distance between the centers of the Z and W axis in both x and y directions. The spindle command will be taken from either mist or flood external output. I have it running vacuum and one spindle so there is one more slot for the second spindle. If I need more outputs, I will install a second parallel port.
    This will be done for production purposes so that once the code is optimized you do not need to mess with it ever. I hope it makes sense.



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    yes that helps. I was also looking at the kayaks, I would love to make a cape ann one day.



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    What a diy machine!!!

    I read your documentation and I was a little confused as to which parts of the frame were welded. As I understand it, small components (brackets, angle, flanges and plates) were tacked welded to the major components and then bolted together. Is this correct? How effective is the "home-made" moglice at dampening vibration?

    Adrian



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    I like it! Now......my curiosity is very much aroused over the joinery technique of the steel structure. Also, the steel-cutting circular saw........that works pretty well, eh? I'm impressed with the precision of your structural elements. It takes a lot of will and a good mind set to maintain that type of precision work from start to end. A lot of people make a few precise cuts and then progressively start allowing a little slop here, a little slop there.....etc. I really would like to find out more about the epoxy/metal powder joints and exactly how you set up to "glue" them up. Again, outstanding job.

    Curtis



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    Community Moderator ger21's Avatar
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    Did you weld all the flanges on that you used for bolting?

    Gerry

    UCCNC 2022 Screenset
    http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2022.html

    Mach3 2010 Screenset
    http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2010.html

    JointCAM - CNC Dovetails & Box Joints
    http://www.g-forcecnc.com/jointcam.html

    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)


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    The most impressive homebuilt machine I have seen. Your committment to accuracy,precision and workmanship is inspiring me to produce such a machine. I am somewhat curious about the ability of the metal saw to create such clean cuts which are cool to the touch after cutting.

    Jason



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    do you have any updates on your machine?



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    I would be interested to hear any updates also.
    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo
    do you have any updates on your machine?




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    To answer some of the questions:
    1) The flanges are TIG welded to the square and rectangular tubing. First, they are aligned, spot welded and then welded fully all the way around.
    The flanges have the bolt holes and are in contact with the epoxy filler. Some "flanges" are also welded internally into the ends of the tubes such as for the adjustable legs or the corners of the table. The internal flanges are 1/4" x 3/4" flat bar or thicker and wider for the legs and tapped with M8 for the bolts. I have Lincoln Invertec 160 TIG for the welding. Great "tiny" machine!

    2) The epoxy is dammed using oil based play dough, clear packing tape, self adhesive aluminum foil (holds its shape). It is either sandwiched in directly and bolted down carefully to achieve appropriate alignement with a square or a jig OR the the pieces are bolted toghether with fine thread "counter" screws maintaining a gap in the joint which is adjustable. For the Y axis, you will need at least 3 adjusting screws so you can control the alignment of the members in the degrees of freedom you want to play with. (up down, tilt forward and back, shift forward and back - particularly for the Y gantry crosspieces). Then the gap is taped over and the slurry injected and vented through holes in the corners.

    3) It is vital that you start and maintain accuracy all the way. If you begin losing your accurate frames of reference you will be going blind soon! You can be sloppy in a few places but not too many. Without perfect squarness and parallelism in all 3 axis, CNC machine is pretty worthless in my opinion bacause you cannot trust it.

    4) The matal cutting saw is the best thing. I would spend months of extra time using some other methods. 1/16" thick 4.5" cut off grinder disks are great for smaller jobs but the dust is bad for you and the CNC components especially.

    5) I have updated the machine X and Y axis with gecko 340's and two servos and a servo stall shut off circuit (when a servo stalls, entire system shuts off - no more finding out ruined parts at the end of cycle). Now there is never any doubt about lost steps. The Y servo has 1000ppr encoder and direct drives the axis and the X axis has 2.75 speed reduction gears (2.75 torque increase) and 500ppr encoder. After tuning it up, the machine is now in full production and no lost steps or stalling ever (whisper quiet motors!). When more $$ comes, AC spindle is next.

    There is very little extra time I have to document the machine additions. I am glad at least to give others ideas and show what actually works (eg. epoxy joints).

    Vaclav
    MadVac CNC
    One Ocean Kayaks



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    Your machine looks awsome. On your web site you have a price of $16,000
    is that what you figure you have into it now? I would love to attempt to build something similar but that is a little out of my price range.

    Pete



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    Quote Originally Posted by oneyaker View Post
    To answer some of the questions:
    1) The flanges are TIG welded to the square and rectangular tubing. First, they are aligned, spot welded and then welded fully all the way around.
    The flanges have the bolt holes and are in contact with the epoxy filler. Some "flanges" are also welded internally into the ends of the tubes such as for the adjustable legs or the corners of the table. The internal flanges are 1/4" x 3/4" flat bar or thicker and wider for the legs and tapped with M8 for the bolts. I have Lincoln Invertec 160 TIG for the welding. Great "tiny" machine!

    2) The epoxy is dammed using oil based play dough, clear packing tape, self adhesive aluminum foil (holds its shape). It is either sandwiched in directly and bolted down carefully to achieve appropriate alignement with a square or a jig OR the the pieces are bolted toghether with fine thread "counter" screws maintaining a gap in the joint which is adjustable. For the Y axis, you will need at least 3 adjusting screws so you can control the alignment of the members in the degrees of freedom you want to play with. (up down, tilt forward and back, shift forward and back - particularly for the Y gantry crosspieces). Then the gap is taped over and the slurry injected and vented through holes in the corners.

    3) It is vital that you start and maintain accuracy all the way. If you begin losing your accurate frames of reference you will be going blind soon! You can be sloppy in a few places but not too many. Without perfect squarness and parallelism in all 3 axis, CNC machine is pretty worthless in my opinion bacause you cannot trust it.

    4) The matal cutting saw is the best thing. I would spend months of extra time using some other methods. 1/16" thick 4.5" cut off grinder disks are great for smaller jobs but the dust is bad for you and the CNC components especially.

    5) I have updated the machine X and Y axis with gecko 340's and two servos and a servo stall shut off circuit (when a servo stalls, entire system shuts off - no more finding out ruined parts at the end of cycle). Now there is never any doubt about lost steps. The Y servo has 1000ppr encoder and direct drives the axis and the X axis has 2.75 speed reduction gears (2.75 torque increase) and 500ppr encoder. After tuning it up, the machine is now in full production and no lost steps or stalling ever (whisper quiet motors!). When more $$ comes, AC spindle is next.

    There is very little extra time I have to document the machine additions. I am glad at least to give others ideas and show what actually works (eg. epoxy joints).

    Vaclav
    MadVac CNC
    One Ocean Kayaks


    I was wondering what the minimum gap needs to be between the flanges and the members and still have a fully filled joint of epoxy.

    Another qustion i have is how do you get the two linear ways for the x-axis perfectly parallel to each other.



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    Community Moderator ger21's Avatar
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    If you mix the epoxy to a very thick consistency that won't run or sag, and inject it into the joint with a syringe, you should be able to fill a very large gap. But you'd want it as tight as possible.

    Once you have one rail mounted straight, you set up the gantry with the other rail loose. Then move the gantry along the rail and tighten as you go. This should get them both aligned very close to perfect.

    Gerry

    UCCNC 2022 Screenset
    http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2022.html

    Mach3 2010 Screenset
    http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2010.html

    JointCAM - CNC Dovetails & Box Joints
    http://www.g-forcecnc.com/jointcam.html

    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)


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    Another question I have is about the ballscrew. The ballscrew for the x-axis is the longest one. Since it is so beefy he had sag in the middle of the ballscrew. How can one get around this problem?
    Where is all the precision if the ballscrew just sags in the middle (4-5 mm).



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    Impressive work my friend.



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    Vaclav, I am thoroughly impressed with your work and thank you for sharing such detail.

    My latest hot flash is to build a CNC router to produce molds for fiberglass panels.

    As a question for CNC router builders and enthusiasts, Do any of you use Mastercam to design projects for and drive your routers?

    Thanks,

    Doug

    Last edited by Dugg; 01-06-2009 at 06:51 PM.


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