Micro/Nano/Pico Format PC For CNC......


Results 1 to 5 of 5

Thread: Micro/Nano/Pico Format PC For CNC......

  1. #1
    Registered
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    US
    Posts
    217
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Micro/Nano/Pico Format PC For CNC......

    I should start with the fact that I use K-Motion's K-Flops to supply the pulse trains to my drivers...for those not familiar with them, they are use a USB interface from a PC to a DSP based controller that eliminates latency issues common with modern Operating Systems....

    I am looking at updating some POS stations in my retail business with Foxconn T-iBT18's ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...20141113033721 ). These seem like they would be ideal for CNC use as well, and are pretty darn cheap....(less than $200 with a 64GB SSD & 4GB RAM)....and I am just curious if anyone else has used similar micro/nano/pico format systems for their dedicated CNC PCs? I realize I can (and many people DO) re-purpose an older desktop/Laptop, and I certainly don't need the processing speed of these machines, but a full-size desktop is awfully bulky and awkward in comparison...and while energy efficiency is not really a viable concern when running a 2.2kW spindle and 4 stepper motors....with a total PC system power consumption of < 15W it would at least provide the warm fuzzy feeling of some aspect of the system being "green", lol.

    I am likely going to add an extra one to my cart (earmarked for my latest build) when I order for my store ...just wanted to hear any pros/cons from people who might have already tried something like these....

    Thanks in Advance!

    Fish

    Similar Threads:


  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    2134
    Downloads
    1
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Micro/Nano/Pico Format PC For CNC......

    They;'re small but not much grunt really. Dual Core Celeron is pretty ordinary, and may not keep up with any demanding work. For simple geometric 2D cutting, it would be great, but as soon as you start doing any 2.5D/3D stuff, I strongly suspect it would bog down pretty quick.

    I could be wrong though, my wife always tells me I am.

    cheers, Ian

    It's a state of mind!


  3. #3
    Registered
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    US
    Posts
    217
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Micro/Nano/Pico Format PC For CNC......

    @aarggh....

    First....Thanks for the response!

    Second....
    It's rumoured that everytime someone buys a TB6560 based board, an engineer cries!
    LMFAO! WOW, I ordered one of those a year or two back to "give it a try"....It was HORRIBLE! Two identical NEMA17's running from the same power supply **theoretically** using the exact same "settings" (16uSteps/Step, 1.2A etc, etc) connected to the same power supply.... being fed by identical pulse streams....and the performance difference was so radically different that I actually switched the motors to make 100% certain it wasn't a bad motor....The TB6560 based driver sounded like a coffee grinder @ low speed, @ intermediate speeds it had a "ringing" that had me looking for ear protection and @ "high speed" it was spasmodic at best....The fastest I could get the TB6560 to spin reliably was ~1000rpm....with a REAL driver the same motor would spin 3000rpm....@ nowhere in the RPM curve did either of the motors using the TB6560 have any real torque...but with the REAL driver they both had very impressive torque all the way up to ~2500rpm! The little drivers used by the Reprap crowd are actually amazingly good for what they cost (one is based on the DRV8825 and the other is based on the A4998, with the DRV8825 being a bit more robust) I have been very impressed with what can be done with good NEAM17's and these little drivers....I am not saying these little drivers are better that drivers built from discreet mosfets, but they are pretty darn good for no more than they cost....

    Finally.....

    I am not sure what the PC's processing speed/power has to do with 2d/2.5d/3d cutting with respect to transmitting g-code commands via USB to a DSP based controller board....Assuming USB 2.0 protocols this implies a data stream with a maximum bandwidth of 480Mbps ==> ~ 48MB/s...@ 48MB/s even if each gcode line required 12 bytes of transmission.this would still be 4 million gcode lines per second....In the absolute extreme case of each gcode line addressing 8 steppers individually in 1 uStep increments this would still afford 500k uSteps per second/stepper...assuming a 1.8 degree stepper with a driver in 64uStep/Step mode (12,800uSteps/Rev) this would result in all eight steppers being driven @ >2300rpm....Arguably the USB protocol has some latency issues and overhead that preclude a constant stream of data @ 48MB/s (Actual transfer speeds are closer to 4MB/s), but typical gcode lines convey considerably more than 1uStep per line and I cannot imagine a rational machine that requires simultaneous control of 8 steppers via 64uStep/Step drivers at > 2300rpm....and even an old 90Mhz 16-bit core first gen Pentium should be able to choke a 4MB/s serial buffer w/o breaking a sweat.....As the boxes in question are primarily designed with HTPC type applications in mind, they are obviously powerful enough to stream HD graphics to a screen....and while a great deal of that work is done in the graphics sub-processor, it would appear the USB ports manage to provide a coherent stream of data via the CPU to the Graphics sub-processor to render them useable....Certainly the processor can handle a considerably less demanding outgoing stream....I would think, lol.

    Perhaps you mean that a dual core Celeron would not be a great choice for graphics intensive 3D rendering? I would agree with you 100% on that, but by the time you get to the machine controller the rendering has already been done and converted to a text file full of gcode statements....my new medium format machine is Fast, but I can't see any way to build a machine fast enough to be choked by USB protocols and I can't imagine a scenario where any modern PC with USB 3.0 capability could fail to provide at least USB 2.0 functionality....But I too (as MY Wife points out) am frequently wrong, lol.

    Not trying to beat a dead horse, but the RepRap crowd use an ATMEGA2560 (an 8-Bit uProcessor with 8K of RAM) operating @ 16Mhz to autonomously read an SD card, translate the G-Code, and control 4 or more Steppers + Temperature control + a display in what what would have to be described as true 3D CNC (counter-intuitively the 3rd Axis in this case is NOT the Z-Axis, but rather the Print Head....X & Y & E must be controller simultaneously).

    Anyway, my concern is NOT if a dual core 2Ghz Celeron is up to the task of reading a text file and sending it to a DSP based Controller....I was really more curious if anyone had found any compatibility issues or other caveats with these tiny format PCs WRT (With Respect To) things like Windows Installs or Environmental concerns. In theory they are essentially a legacy Laptop w/o a keyboard/mouse/monitor....If there are any common driver issues or other problems people have had I would love to hear about them....

    Thanks!

    Fish



  4. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    1041
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Micro/Nano/Pico Format PC For CNC......

    I am using a zotac mini pc with my k-flop/snapamp setup. It has no built in cad or cam software it is just for minor tasks and running the k-motion/k-motioncnc software. It is a dual-core Intel atom 1.8 gig running Windows 7 64bit. It also has 4gigs of ram and a 500gig data hd. When I run the machine I open k-motion and inside I open 4 tabs including the analog io and axis screens. That's so I can monitor voltage, current, temp, and encoders in real time while the machine runs. Then I open k-motion cnc on top of that but it's sized smaller so I can see the analog and axis screens as well. Then I open the webcam that I monitor the machine with from my office. They all run at the same time and I can toggle between screens while running the machine at the same time. I can adjust the webcam while the machine is running as well. I have never had k-flop pause, fault or crash or had any errors with the parts being run. I love the mini pc simply because it takes up so little room. The pc is also networked to my cad-cam pc.

    Ben



  5. #5
    Registered
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    US
    Posts
    217
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Micro/Nano/Pico Format PC For CNC......

    @bhurts

    THANKS! That is exactly what I was hoping to hear:-) As I stated in my OP I am buying several of these for POS terminals in my retail business....I just thought it would make a perfect CNC controller....I doubt I would even consider it if I weren't using the K-Flop....but with a K-Flop I can't imagine why it wouldn't be a perfect fit...I went ahead and added an "extra" one to my cart when I placed the order, lol, so it is already on its way....

    Again, THANKS!

    Fish



  6. #6
    Maskaj's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Posts
    2
    Downloads
    0
    Uploads
    0

    Default Re: Micro/Nano/Pico Format PC For CNC......

    Apart from famous router makers, you also have several other manufacturers using this IP address as the default one for their devices. These include the likes of AboCom, OvisLink, MSI, LoopComm, and CC&C. They use it as default IP address in their broadband 192.168 1 1 life routers and modems.



Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


About CNCzone.com

    We are the largest and most active discussion forum for manufacturing industry. The site is 100% free to join and use, so join today!

Follow us on


Our Brands

Micro/Nano/Pico Format PC For CNC......

Micro/Nano/Pico Format PC For CNC......