2005 Daewoo Puma 240L: Stops mid program-no alarm no indication why.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

Mystery fail.
There’s no alarm.
It stops in mid program just before the G97 line, (Retraction of turret before next tool)
It occurs after ten to twelve hours of continuous use.

Has anyone seen this??
I have found with and without spindle rotation, the coolant is flowing and the tool has reached its safe X and Z out of the material.
There are NO alarm messages no indication that it has a problem.
It’s just sitting there on the X and Z line, before G97.
And it happens nearly 11 hours after it was first started and began running parts.

I suspect a proximity sensor is failing with time as it heats up and losing a accurate field of view. Possible relay, failure.

Other issues that may not be related:
The quick setter arm... when used had errors as much as 20 thousandth inaccuracies.
Currently the quick setter no longer provides a change in tool length.

Any thoughts are welcome.

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[drdos]

When it is in this state go to SYSTEM Diagnostic and see if any bits are on.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

When it is in this state go to SYSTEM Diagnostic and see if any bits are on.

I have left it sitting Powered ON, and not in use.
Looking for something to throw a code or alarm message.
But nothing in 24hrs.
Trying to determine if it’s electrical or mechanical.
I’m leaning towards mechanical as there’s been no diagnostic indication of error during the runs, it decided to stop.
*Because it consistently stops just before the G97 line (spindle speed related). I think... I has much to do with the spindle not braking well enough in time, to proceed to the next line of the program.
I suspect this, only because of a Doosan nearby that’s a 2008, and the spindle stops very quickly in comparison.
So... mechanical and spindle and a component outside of the computer diagnostic purview.

[drdos]

When it is at that state, press the System hardkey, then press the diagnostic soft key. This is where Fanuc puts the status of the machine. If any bits are on then it will tell us why.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

When it is at that state, press the System hardkey, then press the diagnostic soft key. This is where Fanuc puts the status of the machine. If any bits are on then it will tell us why.

I’ll do that on Monday afternoon (I am 2nd Shift supervisor)
I am guessing “when it’s in that state” means the moment it has stopped.
It takes nearly 11 hours of run time before I start to see the issue.
Our concern now... is the 1st Shift operator.
Not sure how they would respond.
But... I am leaning towards trying it.
Just to see what it shows within diagnostics.

I just contacted the 1st Shift Supervisor and instructed him how to proceed and capture the diagnostic data “within the failed state”.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

This is spindle temp after running for two hours (67c)
Likely a failing bearing, but there’s no noise that goes with a bad bearing.
Just temperature concerns.
There’s no chiller involved.
Took one of the enclosures off and turned a fan on.
This isn’t going to help, as the heat source is internal to the spindle.
But... seeing the fan helped return some peace to the operator.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

Drdos

As spindle temp approaches 72 Celsius the machine stops itself by design.
However within general diagnostics there is a “bit” in “motion” that shouldn’t be there. The machine is stopped and there’s no motion.
Just a hot spindle.

[drdos]

Typically the Alpha-I spindle motors overheat at 105 C (221 F) This is the temp you are seeing NOT the spindle unless you have a built in spindle motor. Does the spindle stop when it reaches this temp? What was on the first page of the diagnostic? I would like to see that page at the stop state

[Kelsang-Lungta]

The spindle is belt driven. Motor resides under spindle.
The pulse coder or module that monitors spindle speed, is belt driven and sits above spindle.
I really hope the photos have attached themselves to this reply.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

Background: There’s a 22 second run at 3,500rpm that really pops the temps. I can make 55 parts per hour and each 48” bar = 20 parts.
Within a single 48” bar, the spindle temps within diagnostics go from 45C, to 58C at the end of the bar. Not much happening with this part.
First tool: 30 degree facing. Second tool: 15 degree facing. Third tool: a bar pull. Fourth tool: Parting.
*We’ve only recently started a 2nd Shift.
So this is the first time in perhaps 7 years these machines have been run longer than 8 hours within 24. So we are seeing a variety of maintenance concerns, alarms, more concerns and then a Daewoo that stops for no obvious reason.
Question...
Within the current program, I see a line go by in parentheses (TEMP CODE). Could this be a programmed limiting factor??
These programs were written nearly 15 years ago.
Each year is a cyclical routine of production and rarely any variation of what we will be doing.
No one can currently answer the question of what that (TEMP CODE) means. I see it after the bar pull, and before the parting tool.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

Typically the Alpha-I spindle motors overheat at 105 C (221 F) This is the temp you are seeing NOT the spindle unless you have a built in spindle motor. Does the spindle stop when it reaches this temp? What was on the first page of the diagnostic? I would like to see that page at the stop state

Attached is the cover sticker for the spindle motor.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

I’m thinking bad encoder for the stator “speed sensor” likely a bad winding.
I don’t know if this motor has a centrifugal switch...?
I know it’s three phase.
But typically the speed sensor and if it has a centrifugal switch... those will fail or act up long before you’ll see a resistance issue big enough within the windings to warrant motor replacement.
I know windings resistance is never to spec.
You’ve got to be way out of the window... not just a little out of it.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

https://www.west-l.ru/uploads/tdpdf/...ervo-motor.pdf

The above link is a Fanuc servo motor manual link.

There’s a protection circuit that stops the servo (spindle motor) at 140 Celsius.
It could be the thermal sensor giving bad data, and failing windings within the motor creating the heat and shutdown I’ve experienced.

Either way.... A choice of overhauling the spindle motor, or replacement.

That’s why my machine stops for no reason and no alarm.
Bad thermal sensor doesn’t raise a alarm.
All the symptoms are mechanical and rooted in spindle servo motor.

If I am wrong in my thinking... please say so kindly.

I’ve yet to get into it and look at the windings with a meter.
Let the fun begin.

[drdos]

If the spindle is still running then I doubt that the system is stopping your cycle due to spindle overheating otherwise it would definitely stop the spindle I would also like to see the distance to go page which can be viewed on the position page. Is the controller locked up at this state? Can you change pages? How do you recover when this happens? Can you press RESET and restart the program? Looking at Diagnostic everything looks OK. MTN at the bottom of your screen means you have motion. (An axis has been commanded)

[Kelsang-Lungta]

Spindle wasn’t running.
I confused the machine and coolant noise for rotation.
I can change pages.
I can recover in two ways.
A. Do nothing and resume when spindle temp is 45 Celsius.
B. Shut it down and wait 30 minutes. Then do a normal startup.
Then I’ll get maybe three or four hours.

I need the name and number is a reliable knowledgeable do everything repair service for Daewoo and Doosan CNC relatively close to Annapolis Maryland.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

Question:
This is to resolve a Q-Setter issue.

What does the following process actually do?
1. Turn off computer, E-stop, shut off master switch and wait 1 minute.
2. Turn on master pwr switch, reset E-Stop.
3. Press and hold “P” and “CAN” buttons while at the same time turning the computer back on. ((DO NOT RELEASE “P and CAN” until computer fully boots up.
4. Perform a Reference Return.

Does this return X and Z to the same HOME the Q-Setter knows??

[dhardt]

Question:
This is to resolve a Q-Setter issue.

What does the following process actually do?
1. Turn off computer, E-stop, shut off master switch and wait 1 minute.
2. Turn on master pwr switch, reset E-Stop.
3. Press and hold “P” and “CAN” buttons while at the same time turning the computer back on. ((DO NOT RELEASE “P and CAN” until computer fully boots up.
4. Perform a Reference Return.

Does this return X and Z to the same HOME the Q-Setter knows??

P-Can is used to "Cancel the Preset" information as to where the home location is expected to be found

1) it will not resolve Hard Overtravel issues
2) It is designed to be used on a machine with Home Dogs (but seems to SOMETIMES have an effect on a Dogless version)
3) This is usually used when getting a "SOFT OVERTAVEL" when in the middle of travel area
4) It effects the proper function of the homing process, but has no direct effect on the Q-setter

The Q-setter understands its position based on the Reference Return Position (being correctly set to a distance away from 0, and named correctly and appropriately) and parameters that designate where in 3D space that the Q-setter is, in correlation to the 3D location of the aforementioned Reference Position.

https://www.cnczone.com/forums/daewo...bulletins.html
From the Tec Doc Thread there is a Post "How to maintain and calibrate the Q-Setter on an Lynx 220:: dated: 04-03-2019, 09:45 AM
See that for the calibration parameters.

[Kelsang-Lungta]

We’ve got bigger issues showing now.
Alarm 2020
And... within the attached photo...
The SMAX value changed on its own from 3500 to the 32767 you see in the photo.

[dhardt]

It would be much more efficient to try to resolve this through our normal contact points, instead of buffering it through a third party website...
We can update the website afterward.

What is the English description of the 2020 alarm?
Is it the same as the attached file? " Coolant and Lub. Pump Overload"

[dhardt]

And... within the attached photo...
The SMAX value changed on its own from 3500 to the 32767 you see in the photo.

SMAX shows the maximum allowable spindle speed.
Depending on the way that it is driven (i.e. belt ratio, gear ratio, top speed limit) the parameter that sets that value is in the 3700-ish range. The issue you are claiming is due to one or more of the parameters being set at a value of 32767
(When the number 0 through 32767 are totaled...they account for 32768 digits. 32768 is 2 to the 15th power, which is 16 places out in a binary "rack")
On older machines 32767 is the maximum understandable data.
...and likely to have been entered incorrectly, or it is a glitch or noise glitch.