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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Hey guys,

    I just came across this thread and wanted to clarify something to avoid confusion. There are several different models of ClearPath motors. While every model is a servo, if you want a step and direction input model that has a torque/speed curve similar to a stepper (as suggested by ger21), go with an SDSK (SK - Stepper Killer). If you want a step and direction model with the broader torque/speed curve common to servos (some reaching upwards of 6,000 RPM), an SDHP (HP - High Power) may be more appropriate.

    In a machine (like this one - the Pro6060) where you're replacing steppers and are concerned if the mechanics can handle high power, go with the SDSK. That's one of the main reasons we created this model. Compared with the same size stepper, you'll still get about 3x the power, but most mechanics can handle this increase.

    If you have any specific questions regarding these models, please feel free to contact us directly through support@teknic.com.

    Best regards,
    Erik M. - Teknic Servo Systems Engineer



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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by wmgeorge View Post
    Gerry forgot to tell you but I will, he is one heck of a good programmer and he knows his stuff!
    Oh, I know. I've been lurking on CNC boards for a little bit and, as with any other special interest internet forums, those that know are quickly revealed. Gerry knows.



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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Teknic_Servo View Post
    Hey guys,

    I just came across this thread and wanted to clarify something to avoid confusion. There are several different models of ClearPath motors. While every model is a servo, if you want a step and direction input model that has a torque/speed curve similar to a stepper (as suggested by ger21), go with an SDSK (SK - Stepper Killer). If you want a step and direction model with the broader torque/speed curve common to servos (some reaching upwards of 6,000 RPM), an SDHP (HP - High Power) may be more appropriate.

    In a machine (like this one - the Pro6060) where you're replacing steppers and are concerned if the mechanics can handle high power, go with the SDSK. That's one of the main reasons we created this model. Compared with the same size stepper, you'll still get about 3x the power, but most mechanics can handle this increase.

    If you have any specific questions regarding these models, please feel free to contact us directly through support@teknic.com.

    Best regards,
    Erik M. - Teknic Servo Systems Engineer
    Thanks for stepping in. I have spent a fair amount of time on your website, and knew about the SDSK series, which is what I'd use if I go with the Clearpath servos. My hope is that I'll settle on a plan, and then verify that my selections all work well together, with CNCRP probably being the first stop as their mechanics are the basis for the whole thing.



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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Quick update. Snowed in here, so I spent most of the day yesterday looking at UCCNC and its implementation in the UC300ETH board. It took me a while to track down where to find some of the hardware, but ultimately it looked like the best add-on for me would be the UB1 to avoid having to break out ribbon cable connections.

    In the process of looking over the various UCCNC hardware options, and in looking at the various UCCNC and UB1 wiring, installation and setup materials, I realized that the documentation for the Centroid Acorn was head and shoulders above what I could find for UCCNC and the UC300ETH. From the Centroid motor specific wiring schematics, to the motor parameters built-in to CNC12, to the detailed instructions on how to hardware or software pair two motors for one axis, Centroid has really done their homework and provided a lot of tech information that is particularly helpful to the CNC newbie. My principal reason for looking at UCCNC would be to have a 5th software axis for a 4th axis drive when and if I went that route. Centroid can handle that if I hardware pair the two Y axis drives (with a loss of auto-squaring the gantry), perhaps not as elegantly as UCCNC, but I think I'll be many, many hours ahead and avoid a lot of frustration going with the Centroid system.

    If this were my second build, I might think otherwise; but I’m not looking for degree of difficulty points right now.

    So, Centroid Acorn, with the basic version of their software for now, pending seeing what they do with routers in future releases of CNC12 Pro. I think I might be interested in digitized probing down the road, and there’s no upgrade path from the CNC12 Pro to the Digitizing software, so no CNC12 Pro for now. (Centroid did say that the upgrade from CNC12 Mill Pro to CNC12 Router Pro would be free.)

    Sent an email to CNCRP with my questions about the Pro6060, too soon to expect a response.

    Assuming the CNCRP responses are positive, my thought is to order and build electronics and once that’s all bench tested and ready to go, order the CNCRP Pro6060. Any pitfalls in doing it that way?



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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by mkelcy View Post
    Quick update. Snowed in here, so I spent most of the day yesterday looking at UCCNC and its implementation in the UC300ETH board. It took me a while to track down where to find some of the hardware, but ultimately it looked like the best add-on for me would be the UB1 to avoid having to break out ribbon cable connections.

    In the process of looking over the various UCCNC hardware options, and in looking at the various UCCNC and UB1 wiring, installation and setup materials, I realized that the documentation for the Centroid Acorn was head and shoulders above what I could find for UCCNC and the UC300ETH. From the Centroid motor specific wiring schematics, to the motor parameters built-in to CNC12, to the detailed instructions on how to hardware or software pair two motors for one axis, Centroid has really done their homework and provided a lot of tech information that is particularly helpful to the CNC newbie. My principal reason for looking at UCCNC would be to have a 5th software axis for a 4th axis drive when and if I went that route. Centroid can handle that if I hardware pair the two Y axis drives (with a loss of auto-squaring the gantry), perhaps not as elegantly as UCCNC, but I think I'll be many, many hours ahead and avoid a lot of frustration going with the Centroid system.

    If this were my second build, I might think otherwise; but I’m not looking for degree of difficulty points right now.

    So, Centroid Acorn, with the basic version of their software for now, pending seeing what they do with routers in future releases of CNC12 Pro. I think I might be interested in digitized probing down the road, and there’s no upgrade path from the CNC12 Pro to the Digitizing software, so no CNC12 Pro for now. (Centroid did say that the upgrade from CNC12 Mill Pro to CNC12 Router Pro would be free.)

    Sent an email to CNCRP with my questions about the Pro6060, too soon to expect a response.

    Assuming the CNCRP responses are positive, my thought is to order and build electronics and once that’s all bench tested and ready to go, order the CNCRP Pro6060. Any pitfalls in doing it that way?
    You can also take a look at the new UCCNC motion controller the AXBB-E.
    It is a controller for 4-axis but seems to be working upto 6-axis but you need to add a LPT port breakout board on it's extension port for the extra axis.
    There is a complete example wiring diagram and example wiring part diagrams in the manual: http://cncdrive.com/downloads/AXBB_E_manual.pdf
    I don't think that Centroid has any better documentation than this or that you need any better.
    You can even get a free UCCNC software license key with the new controller now: AXBB-E ethernet motion controller and breakout board combo + free UCCNC license - CNCdrive - webshop



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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by mkelcy View Post

    Assuming the CNCRP responses are positive, my thought is to order and build electronics and once that’s all bench tested and ready to go, order the CNCRP Pro6060. Any pitfalls in doing it that way?


    I built my electronics before ordering the machine kit. Doing so didn't cause me any issues/problems. Actually, it worked out fine. As soon as I got my machine built, I was able to start cutting.

    At the end of the day, it really didn't matter whether I had the kit while I was building the electronics. The machine parts would have been setting around until I finished the electronics. Multitasking by building the machine and electronics simultaneously wouldn't have worked out well. Interrupting one task or the other would have broken continuity, which in turn, would have extended the total amount of time necessary for completing the overall project. (Now, where was I????). I don't believe it makes any real difference whether you do the mechanical first, or electronics first. I just wouldn't try dividing my time between the two.

    Gary




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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by OlfCNC View Post
    You can also take a look at the new UCCNC motion controller the AXBB-E.
    It is a controller for 4-axis but seems to be working upto 6-axis but you need to add a LPT port breakout board on it's extension port for the extra axis.
    There is a complete example wiring diagram and example wiring part diagrams in the manual: http://cncdrive.com/downloads/AXBB_E_manual.pdf
    I don't think that Centroid has any better documentation than this or that you need any better.
    You can even get a free UCCNC software license key with the new controller now: AXBB-E ethernet motion controller and breakout board combo + free UCCNC license - CNCdrive - webshop
    I actually saw the AXBB-E and looked at the installation instructions. That said, while you may not need any better documentation, I’ll take all the help I can get. I’m still trying to wrap my head around the terminology, software, hardware and electronics. Centroid, for example, has specific wiring diagrams (pin to pin) for about 30 drivers. The CNC12 software can initially populate all of the driver/motor details (for select drivers) simply by clicking on a radio button in the software. They have a 20 page detailed description of the various ways you can pair two axes for a dual drive axis and a description of the benefits of each method. The documentation is simply deep and extensive and clearly intended to answer questions before you have them. I’m in no way knocking UCCNC, I’m simply saying that for my needs more, and more detailed, directions are a good thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by GME View Post

    I built my electronics before ordering the machine kit. Doing so didn't cause me any issues/problems. Actually, it worked out fine. As soon as I got my machine built, I was able to start cutting.

    At the end of the day, it really didn't matter whether I had the kit while I was building the electronics. The machine parts would have been setting around until I finished the electronics. Multitasking by building the machine and electronics simultaneously wouldn't have worked out well. Interrupting one task or the other would have broken continuity, which in turn, would have extended the total amount of time necessary for completing the overall project. (Now, where was I????). I don't believe it makes any real difference whether you do the mechanical first, or electronics first. I just wouldn't try dividing my time between the two.

    Gary
    Thanks for that. It made sense to me, but nice to have it confirmed.



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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Well. wiring instructions for 30 drives?! All drives have optoisolator inputs, there is not even 30 possible variations of connections.
    So documenting connection for 30 drives is a big redundancy in documentation which probably makes the documentation long with lots of parts useless for the avarage user and then too long to find things in it.
    The documentation of the UCCNC is really more technical. it gives general diagrams which makes the documentation short but useful because all required information is still there to connect any type and kind of drives.
    Exact connection information is probably the best for dummies, but with an avarage IQ which is required to build a machine or a controller or any technical things like a CNC machine I think anybody can put these things together from general info to exact info.
    Yes you have to think a bit, but it does not hurt does it?

    Dual drive: 2 pages for what? You just select the slave axis for the master axis in the UCCNC and that's all you need to do, you have dual/slaved axis. Maybe it is just overcomplicated in the Centroid if it needs 2 pages of documentation.
    In the UCCNC everything is freely configurable you can put any axis or any signals to any pins so exact wiring is not the best, because the possible connection variations is about infinite.

    What I wrote is only my 2 cents, please do not get offended by it. I know everybody is different and think different. This is how I see it. others might see it different.



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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by OlfCNC View Post
    Well. wiring instructions for 30 drives?! All drives have optoisolator inputs, there is not even 30 possible variations of connections.
    So documenting connection for 30 drives is a big redundancy in documentation which probably makes the documentation long with lots of parts useless for the avarage user and then too long to find things in it.
    The documentation of the UCCNC is really more technical. it gives general diagrams which makes the documentation short but useful because all required information is still there to connect any type and kind of drives.
    Exact connection information is probably the best for dummies, but with an avarage IQ which is required to build a machine or a controller or any technical things like a CNC machine I think anybody can put these things together from general info to exact info.
    Yes you have to think a bit, but it does not hurt does it?

    Dual drive: 2 pages for what? You just select the slave axis for the master axis in the UCCNC and that's all you need to do, you have dual/slaved axis. Maybe it is just overcomplicated in the Centroid if it needs 2 pages of documentation.
    In the UCCNC everything is freely configurable you can put any axis or any signals to any pins so exact wiring is not the best, because the possible connection variations is about infinite.

    What I wrote is only my 2 cents, please do not get offended by it. I know everybody is different and think different. This is how I see it. others might see it different.
    Documenting 30 drives may be redundant (and that figure was my quick scan of the files in the .zip I downloaded, could be I misunderstood what was there) but redundant downloaded .pdf files sound like a no harm, no foul kind of issue. I simply go down the list of files in the .zip file, pick out the make and model of my drivers, open the .pdf and have the specific schematic for my application which clearly sets out pin to pin connections.

    And it was actually 20 pages for the dual axis documentation, but it was twenty really detailed pages that went through every possible iteration for achieving the result, including software and hardware slaving, and discussed how to do each, in detail, and described what you did and didn't get with each approach.

    An infinite array of possible pin out combinations in UCCNC may be great for an experienced user, but if I don't see a use for me, can do what I think I want to do with the Acorn and I'm not particularly paying more for it, I don't see the issue. I'll happily cop to wanting the "CNC for Dummies" controller and documentation version. But it goes beyond even that. The Centroid approach looks like a successful company who has so far supplied industrial customers attempting to bring that same level of professionalism and customer service to the DIY market. I'm drawn to that and that's why I ordered the Acorn this evening.



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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Flicked through all of this..

    I run UCCNC, ETH300/UB1, DMM 750w servos on a CNCRP60120.. Xbox for remote control, fusion360 for CAD/CAM. 3.5kw Chinese spindle.

    It’s a solid system and am still getting it dialed in for bigger jobs but so far it’s been accurate to fractions of a mm, having the servos has been more complicated and a learning curve but I’m there now.

    Would do it again.. but I don’t run it at 1200ipm. Don’t really need to.

    Let me know if you have some more detailed questions as a picture can be worth a long email!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by mkelcy View Post
    Documenting 30 drives may be redundant (and that figure was my quick scan of the files in the .zip I downloaded, could be I misunderstood what was there) but redundant downloaded .pdf files sound like a no harm, no foul kind of issue. I simply go down the list of files in the .zip file, pick out the make and model of my drivers, open the .pdf and have the specific schematic for my application which clearly sets out pin to pin connections.

    And it was actually 20 pages for the dual axis documentation, but it was twenty really detailed pages that went through every possible iteration for achieving the result, including software and hardware slaving, and discussed how to do each, in detail, and described what you did and didn't get with each approach.

    An infinite array of possible pin out combinations in UCCNC may be great for an experienced user, but if I don't see a use for me, can do what I think I want to do with the Acorn and I'm not particularly paying more for it, I don't see the issue. I'll happily cop to wanting the "CNC for Dummies" controller and documentation version. But it goes beyond even that. The Centroid approach looks like a successful company who has so far supplied industrial customers attempting to bring that same level of professionalism and customer service to the DIY market. I'm drawn to that and that's why I ordered the Acorn this evening.
    You have made your selection, sounds good that this forum thread helped you to do that.

    I myself like technical documentations which tells you what you want to know more than dummy docummentation with lots of useless infos where you have to search a lot to find things, but as always it is maybe just me.

    Customer service: UCCNC has their own forums and always replied me within 24 hours for any questions, I do not need better than that.



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    Default Re: Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by andrewwong2000 View Post
    Flicked through all of this..

    I run UCCNC, ETH300/UB1, DMM 750w servos on a CNCRP60120.. Xbox for remote control, fusion360 for CAD/CAM. 3.5kw Chinese spindle.

    It’s a solid system and am still getting it dialed in for bigger jobs but so far it’s been accurate to fractions of a mm, having the servos has been more complicated and a learning curve but I’m there now.

    Would do it again.. but I don’t run it at 1200ipm. Don’t really need to.

    Let me know if you have some more detailed questions as a picture can be worth a long email!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I'm running UCCNC with up to 800 IPM on my plasma, it runs without any issues. Can't run faster due to limitations of the machine mechanics.



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Planning New Machine Build - Many Questions

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