Ordering Pro 4824

[LeeWay]

Man. I hate it! I have been down with the flu that turned into Acute Bronchitis. Eww. I am glad they finally diagnosed it right. I feel much better now slowly though. All I have been able to do is walk by all those gorgeous CNCRP boxes on my way to catch up on production I was way behind on.
I promise to post more when I get a chance to start opening them. Glad to be up to something again though.

[LeeWay]

Well, I did manage to get a few of the boxes open this afternoon. I opened the plug and play control panel and the spindle and VFD box. Really nice work those guys do. I am impressed. Can't wait to have the time to get started with it.

Today I was wanting to use the plasma cutter. The G540 on it has been having trouble because the connectors on it get too hot. This is the second one it happened to. I had a new MX4660 digital drive on hand that I bought because I was aware this was happening. The machine was running good with it for engraving the parts. Really smooth. Nice.
When it came time for the torch to fire, it would not. I had it setup with pin outs identical to the G540 and gave CNCRP's a call. They assured me that they are the same. Makes sense because it engraved fine. It was plasma cutting fine too. Just no torch fire. I have the CandCNC MP3000 DTHCII on it. Something must have happened to it. I did not change anything on it. I asked a few questions over there on their forum, but haven't seen a reply yet. I looked around inside the boxes, but does anyone know if there might be a fuse or two that could go bad in the THC?

[LeeWay]

I used a backup Mach 3 XML file and it's all good now.
Don't know why I didn't jump to Mach 3 being the cause as most seem to do. In this case, that would have been correct.

[LeeWay]

Everything appears to be here so far.
I haven't opened the drop shipped 80/20 parts or the tube with the rails yet. Probably get to that over the weekend. This will be one helluva nice little machine.

[LeeWay]

I started assembling some of the sub assemblies today. Very easy to do. There was not a single thing that I had questions about that was not immediately visible on the tips and tricks section at the CRP website. This is going to be one stout little machine. Considering it has the gantry of an 8' machine. Still making room in the shop for it. The Tormach lathe took the space my old home made router was in. I have to move a tool cabinet into the space where my old lathe is. Then modify a couple work benches. Not too much more really. Being way behind on promised ship dates is what will really take the time. Had a pretty good week last week catching up. Hired a new person to learn some of my job and packing and shipping. Just part time, but that will help.

[LeeWay]

Well, Guys, as bad as I hate the stuff, it looks like MDF may be the best material to use for a vacuum system. Here is the plan.
I will have a base table made out of some sort of plastic. Seaboard (HDPE) or possibly PVC. It will get the grid pattern and have the 4 ports for the 4 vacuum zones. I ordered some foam backer rod to try in the grid.
I may need to go with a softer rubber rod. Not sure yet. With 4 ball valves, that should work fine for the base. I also ordered material to put another brace across the center of the machine. Should make for a good solid base.

Then the plan is to surface both sides of a sacrificial MDF sheet. Seal the edges with sanding sealer, then poly. Then cut into that sheet a little where my parts will get cut out. The profile cuts. I will use a little bigger bit than I would use on the parts. That will make a wider groove. Then seal those grooves. What is left should be able to hold a good vacuum and not lose any pressure when I cut through the parts. That is the plan anyway. Any thoughts on this? Has anyone done similar?

[gfacer]

Use MDF for the table, deal with thinned epoxy. Forget the plastic. I have a plastic fab shop and I went MDF and no regrets 15 years later. Only phenolic would be better for dimensional stability, for my shop's climate anyways. Use ultralite MDF for the top, surfaced both sides.

As for the top grooving an sealing...try without first, you don't loose a ton of pressure through the ldf, depends on vac source of course and piece size, material etc... What is the work expected?

I'm planning a table now and using 3/4 MDF with a grid cut halfway, boxes for vac chamber below the table, all parts below top surface and grid sealed with epoxy. Top sheet of ldf surfaced and screwed to that base with inset brass screws.

Will document if I ever get the machine its for. Seller is dragging feet!

[LeeWay]

I will be using HDPE for the base on this. Not sure yet what thickness. It is either 3/4" or 1". Either should do well for the vacuum grid.
I will have to surface it all first. It comes textured both sides. It needs to be leveled out anyway.
I have a nice 1.5" surfacing bit that should make short work of it. I want to get the dust collection going first before I surface anything.
I have designed my own dust shoe. I may even offer these for sale at some point. I have been considering it for awhile. Since I built my first one back in 04. It kinda fits right in with our blade guards and dust collection.
It is a much different design than Kent's. Much simpler. I'll see how it works out though.

I hope to start major assembly next week in the evenings.

[gfacer]

I don't know if this will work, I have tried to reply before.......

Don't use HDPE. Use MDF and seal with epoxy. It will warp less (plastic has internal stress that your leveling and machining will interact with) and move less with temperature over time.

Anyways, try what you'd like but make sure you have at least a stress relieved HDPE to have a chance.....and like I said, even that I think will pose challenges.

[gfacer]

Rereading your earlier posts...if you really want to use plastic and are just running the same parts repeatedly, Use foamed PVC, ie sintra or similar. It is closed cell, so no air leaks, easy to work with and cheap enough to just try out.

[LeeWay]

Thanks for the suggestions. The plastic is already on it's way. I did discuss the phenolic with my Plastics supplier. I decided that would be an upgrade later. As for MDF, I did try it on my first home made router. It did not work all that well. Humidity is the real issue down here. I live about 20 minutes from the Gulf of Mexico in south Alabama. Apparently I did not seal the original well enough and not at all on the bottom side. It did swell. I then went to HDPE on it and that held up really well. The key with it was making sure it was bolted down with plenty of fasteners. In fact that is still on the old router many years later. It is machined flat though and no grid pattern.
I will take your advice on the light weight MDF. That should provide very good suction. I also have some of that foamed PVC here. We use it for templates when we hand route shop projects and prototypes. It is nice stuff. Does it come in 1" thick material? All we have is 1/2".
At any rate, we will try the HDPE as it will be here tomorrow. I ordered a 40" x 48" piece. Again, not sure what will arrive. We discussed everything from 3/4" and 1" white and black seaboard to phenolic. I'll use whatever he shipped.

Our material that we will be using will be 16" x 48" .22" thick polycarbonate. We make guards for 10, 12 and 14" saws. That sheet size allows us to optimize the cuts for all three size guards as well as optimizing the blanks per 4' x 8' sheet. I will try it out first without sealing the grooves. It may be that I can stand some vacuum loss. I did order the stuff for the vacuum too. I bought 1/2" stuff. I was wanting to have 4 zones on the whole table. Now I will put all 4 zones under the sheet size. That will give me 8 suction points under that sheet. That should maximize air flow under our production parts. That is what counts anyway.
I will add another two zones later at some point if I see the need when doing 2' x 4' sheets. The grid pattern itself will be the full 2' x 4'. The seals will be under the 16" x 48" part.

[gfacer]

What type of bit are you planning to use? I typically use an up cut single flute onsrud for everything, but its not the best for lexan parts that are too small. You might still use some bit like that if you onionskin and then do a final through cut....a good idea also as that pump you got might be a little on the small side, but it will work fine with a really light final pass too.

I'm sure you'll figure it out, maybe a down shear bit works well for example, hope not too much dialing in needed!

[LeeWay]

I typically use an Onsrud 2 straight flute carbide routerbit. I have a surplus of these end mills though.
5 1 8" Four Flute Carbide Endmills Kyocera Tycom 1800 1250 500 | eBay



Since I need an 1/8" end mill for part of the dado in our guard sides, I will see if I can get away just using the 1/8" for everything. Fingers crossed.

[dgage]

Can you send a picture of the dust shield you designed for the CNC as I was thinking of ordering the Kent but am intrigued by yours? Thanks.

[LeeWay]

I have been tweaking the prototype files a bit. I will have a finished prototype this weekend and I will do the 3D model of it as well.
I'll post here when I get that far.

[LeeWay]

Here is an initial image of the dust boot.
There were some things I could not get quite right in Fusion. Still learning. This image is of a 4" port version with 3" skirt. The skirts will overlap a little at the joint for the spindle. That space will not be as wide as rendered either. Maybe 1/8" at most. These will be 1/2" clear polycarbonate. Dust ports are polycarbonate as well and are welded in place. They are 4" OD and 3.75" ID. There will also be an option for a 12 VDC waterproof white LED Ring light. I haven't decide yet to put it inside or on top of the spindle hole. It will be recessed flush either way. I will offer them in a couple different spindle sizes and different dust port sizes. This is the largest one. Then I would have a 3" dust port. A 2.5" dust port. Maybe even a 1.25" dust port for those guys using a Fein or Festool vacuum. This biggest one with all options would probably sell from $99 to $110.00 ball park. Pricing would be a little less the smaller they got. Oh and hose clamps are optional too.
I would provide this type.

[dgage]

Looks good but what about different height skirts? Would that just be a matter of changing the whole thing? I like your thinking so far though.

[LeeWay]

Still doing the R&D on that part. I think the one piece unit with the light in it will give the best visibility when wanted. You would be able to see through both the dust port and the boot itself. I am thinking that most guys generally use about the same stick out with all the router bits they use. I know we did on my first router.
There was not very much variation.
What I have been considering is just doing a few set screws around the perimeter of the boot. They would hold the strip brush in place. That way the correct length strip brush could be replaced quickly and cheaply.

[LeeWay]

Here are a few pictures of the prototype. It came out okay. I had some drips on the dust port welding job, but I am sorely out of practice at that job. I haven't welded a dust port since 2009.
There are some minor changes I will make to the production models. I won't fully round the edges over like I did on this one. I will just break the edges. I didn't have the threaded inserts yet, so I just tapped the rear tab for the adjustable handle. It takes about 3/4 turn to install or remove this, so that works great. It is solid too. I went ahead and did the relief inside for the led light ring. I have a few different types of those on the way too. The wire will run out in the slot. It doesn't close very much and should be about the right spot to run the wire up beside the spindle wiring. I cut this out on my plasma cutter with a HF die grinder as the spindle. I am sure the new router will do a much nicer job.
It did okay for a prototype.
Oh and there is no glue or anything needed to swap out the brushes. They just press fit right into the grooves. Easy to swap out different lengths. There is also no gap at the joint, so no overlap needed. This is a 2" skirt on it now.
You will really be able to see what is going on inside of this one.
A couple of things to like about this design. When you remove it, you have better access to the router bit. Lay this on it's side when you do remove it and you have a nice light to change the bit by.

[LeeWay]

I did get started putting the base together today as well. I'll do a little more tomorrow and snap a few pictures.Every single nut and bolt has been there. No a single washer or nut extra so far. Those guys are good.