v26 plunge point lead in location...how to change?

[airbrush]

Ok thx for your help...will check out your file.

So it's not possible in any operation to pick where you want your cut to begin??

It doesn`t appear to be possible to do what you want as the Ramp function will always ramp into the material and then when it reaches the DOC point it turns back on itself and then turns again to go in the original direction of the ramp for the remainder of the pocket cutting.
The "Finish Profile" will ramp down and then continue in the same direction.

Anyway, thats the best I have for now, hopefully someone more knowledgable than I (Nick,Burr,James??) will jump in and finish it off as I am now probably not "seeing the wood for the trees"

See attached file for a "nearly" solution

Regards
Rob

[The Engine Guy]

So it's not possible in any operation to pick where you want your cut to begin??

Yes, it is, all the files I have uploaded I set where the cut started, depends on what you mean by the "start of the cut", do you mean where the cutter first contacts the stock at the beginning of the ramp/spiral or where it actually starts to cut at the set DOC, it is the users choice for that, you have to play around with the "Chain start point", "Plunge Point", type of pocket strategy etc, etc, etc, etc

Without seeing your file I can`t come up with anything else, sorry

Regards
Rob

[jrmach]

Go to Points,,,select SKETCH,,,put the point where you want it,BUT,at least 1/2 the diameter of the tool away from your geometry
It cannot be on your geometry,,do I need to explain why,,I think you just figured it out ?

Cut Chips,make money


Just a note,I was responding to the original post "plunge point" "pocketing" not ramp or anything else

[jrmach]

Where a plunge point is most desirable for pocketing is if you have a hole somewhere in the pocket,you can have the EM enter where you drilled or bored or threaded a hole already,,that way the EM goes to depth unobstructed and your feed rapid can be quite high.

[airbrush]

Here is a file sample...its very basic...you can see that the lead in and start of cut is at a corner...this is where the bobcad put it when i selected geo for the routine...I changed my default start point to the middle of the geo as i want it to start there...and also selected a point behind this for my plunge point....both of which do not change...

any ideas? how to change where the cut starts...and a plunge point?

thx
Jeff

[jrmach]

Are you confusing what 2 different thing are ?
PLUNGE accoording to Merriam Dictionary

transitive verb
1 : to cause to penetrate or enter quickly and forcibly into something

plunged the dagger

2 : to cause to enter a state or course of action usually suddenly, unexpectedly, or violently

plunged the nation into economic depression

intransitive verb
1 : to thrust or cast oneself into or as if into water
2 a : to become pitched or thrown headlong or violently forward and downward; also : to move oneself in such a manner

plunged off the embankment

b : to act with reckless haste : enter suddenly or unexpectedly

plunges into project after project

c : to bet or gamble heavily and recklessly
3 : to descend or dip suddenly

the stock's value plunged

It would go to reason if you are PLUNGING,,there is no way to LEAD into the PLUNGE

[airbrush]

I am assuming that plunge point in bobcad would also apply as your lead in start point for ramp in, spiral in as well...
It wouldn't surprise me in least if it is that literal in bobcad...this should be something easy to modify...but seems it's not...

"I'm doing a cut in...I want the start cutting location to be in the middle of that spline and I want to ramp in, in the direction of cut...."

Are you confusing what 2 different thing are ?
PLUNGE accoording to Merriam Dictionary

transitive verb
1 : to cause to penetrate or enter quickly and forcibly into something

plunged the dagger

2 : to cause to enter a state or course of action usually suddenly, unexpectedly, or violently

plunged the nation into economic depression

intransitive verb
1 : to thrust or cast oneself into or as if into water
2 a : to become pitched or thrown headlong or violently forward and downward; also : to move oneself in such a manner

plunged off the embankment

b : to act with reckless haste : enter suddenly or unexpectedly

plunges into project after project

c : to bet or gamble heavily and recklessly
3 : to descend or dip suddenly

the stock's value plunged

It would go to reason if you are PLUNGING,,there is no way to LEAD into the PLUNGE

[jrmach]

You cannot PLUNGE in on a point on your geometry as the tool would violate the borders of the pocket
Plunge=vertical lead in

[jrmach]

You start off with one question and it seems you are asking an entirely different question than your 1st 2 posts

[jrmach]

I am assuming that plunge point in bobcad would also apply as your lead in start point for ramp in, spiral in as well...

tool cannot start on the middle of geometry (1/2 the diameter of tool away)or your next post would read WTF,,,Tool gouged my part

[The Engine Guy]

I am assuming that plunge point in bobcad would also apply as your lead in start point for ramp in, spiral in as well...
It wouldn't surprise me in least if it is that literal in bobcad...this should be something easy to modify...but seems it's not...

"I'm doing a cut in...I want the start cutting location to be in the middle of that spline and I want to ramp in, in the direction of cut...."

OK, here is your file modified to change the Plunge Point, in this exercise the point is where the tool ENDS it`s ramp into the stock and reaches the DOC and starts the feed cut, the ramp in speed you can set under "Plunge Feed rate" under the Tool setup screen.

It does work, all I have done is use the "Line > Parallel" facility to create another line that is exactly half the diameter of your tool and placed a point at the middle of the line, selected that point as the "Plunge Point" in the Tree and it moved from the corner to where I selected.

Regards
Rob

[jrmach]

OK, here is your file modified to change the Plunge Point, in this exercise the point is where the tool ENDS it`s ramp into the stock and reaches the DOC and starts the feed cut, the ramp in speed you can set under "Plunge Feed rate" under the Tool setup screen.

It does work, all I have done is use the "Line > Parallel" facility to create another line that is exactly half the diameter of your tool and placed a point at the middle of the line, selected that point as the "Plunge Point" in the Tree and it moved from the corner to where I selected.

Regards
Rob

Exactly,,,if the question indeed has changed from the beginning of this thread,which it appears to have,,there is different things going on,,shuut,crupp,I have not a video in over a year,,but maybe it is time ???
Think about hand programming this,u have to take in consideration the TOOL and where it is compared to the POCKET GEOMETRY

[jrmach]

as u can c the video suks,,,but however I am trying to show how u cannot hav a point on the geometry.At the very end I do an arc snap to represent the tool,,do u see what happens ???,it violates the pocket,which the software will not allow,,,,,,,so it defaults to its own solution

[billb95]

I have looked at your Leadintest file and if you want to have the lead in the same direction as the cut then make your ramp length/radius a minus figure eg: -0.5000

[The Engine Guy]

I have looked at your Leadintest file and if you want to have the lead in the same direction as the cut then make your ramp length/radius a minus figure eg: -0.5000

I agree, however his direction of cut would have to be changed from "Conventional Mill" to "Climb Mill" and as he had gone for the former so that was how the example was done

Regards
Rob

[airbrush]

i tried that intitially but all it did was create a zigzag and not change the direction

[airbrush]

Yes, its seems the question is all mixed up now.....

This is what i want to do...ignore the reference to plunge point...yes i understand you can't plunge at a point on geo...

I just want to know how to do what i've described below....

"I'm doing a cut in...I want the start cutting location to be in the middle of that spline and I want to ramp in, in the direction of cut and carry on in direction of cut...not backtrack...."

-so first issue i'm having is changing where the actual cut begins
-next I want to do a ramp in, in the direction of cut

[airbrush]

thx everyone for their help first off....

ok...so i'm not sure this is correct still...when i simulate your file...it ramps in...in direction of cut...but then goes back in the other direction to the end of that spline and then reverses again to go in the other direction...

So..I want to ramp in...in direction of cut...and carry on in the direction of cut when it reaches its DOC...not backtrack....

Also this in another case where i would expect the software to compensate for your cutter...which it obviously doesn't....you have to manually set your plunge to compensate for it....

will have to play around with again at lunch hour...

thx everyone...we're getting there..kinda...but not really...

[The Engine Guy]

So..I want to ramp in...in direction of cut...and carry on in the direction of cut when it reaches its DOC...not backtrack....

thx everyone...we're getting there..kinda...but not really...

OK, so now try the attached file, I have altered it to use "bill95" suggestion where he said to make the ramp length a negative value, in the example I have set it to -1.0 inch and changed the angle to 22.5 degrees so it will only do one ramp move and not the zig zag you got, it now ramps in and continues in the same direction just as you requested so that is sorted

So, the secret here is juggling with the ramp length ( + or -) and the angle to get the best ramp in for your tool/rpm/feed

Also this in another case where i would expect the software to compensate for your cutter...which it obviously doesn't....you have to manually set your plunge to compensate for it....

Now as for the software compensating for where you place your point well, it does, I have moved the selected point further into the pocket away from the pocket boundary and if you look closely when you run the simulation that the tool ramps in to DOC and then cuts at an angle till it reaches the pocket boundary and then follows the boundary, if you were to add a Profile finish in to the Feature then it would automatically go to the correct distance from the pocket boundary and leave your finish amount

Works perfectly, all you need to do is write it all down so you can use the method on any future pocket you want to cut in the same manner

Enjoy

Regards
Rob

[airbrush]

My head hurts!...

so the plunge point also determine where the start of cut begins?

thx for all the help...