Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP - Page 2


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Thread: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP

  1. #13
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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    Gracias Ninefingerz ! will see what I can rig up - may end up going and getting a HF press - should come in handy for a great many things - I still want that damn spacer out of there LOL I think a good soak in 91 Octane should get the cosmolene or whatever is holding it there frozem ...



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    Default Re: Im no sparky - so electrical guys/gals help a brother out - Which MOTOR for Upgra

    Update 12/2/17 ...


    So this week has been a bit rough on the spirits - but I finally had a lil bit o' success late last night gettting some stufff to work ...


    Ist up ... the case I ordered off Amazon to house the cnc controls/drivers and other componenets - shows up banged up to hell and back ... thats a refund / return ...


    2nd - like a dumbass newb - ordered the wrong size aviation connectors. Arrrgghhh so frustrating.


    3rd - ordered even more IP68 style aviation connectors for the stepper motor ends - wrong size as well !!!


    4th - ordered a motor from Surplus - and holy moses - its a bohemeth - clearly too large for the X2 - FAIL. Yest another return


    5th - One of the expensive $100+ treadmill motors I ordered off ebay shows up LIKE THIS - c'mon maaaahhnnnn !


    Successes:


    Won another similar treadmill motor off the bay for $65 shipped - brand new! This one with a fan!


    The ebay treadmill motor that arrived with the spindle hanging out of the box ... seems aight - but dont trust the runnout to be super true - need to test with dial indicator somehow. I hooked it up to the KBMM-125 [ getting the schematic figured out for that was a SUCCESS - I was baffled for a while [ such a newb ]


    - tested the voltage outputs - without motor attached 116.x approx volts [ with motor and running 134.6v huh? ]????
    - RPM at max pot adjustment ... 8,000 plus !!!
    - RPM at 90v [ according to this POS Harbor Freight voltmeter with motor on and running ] 6,000 +/- - SHWEET

    Decided to build my own industril-esque enclosure for electronics using cool stuff called MakerBeam !!! MakerBeam XL to be exact - 15x15mm extruded frame. Got all the stuff I need for the enclosure for about $175-180 off Amazon. Caparable REAL industrial enclosures I priced were $250+ to $400 !!! Imma build a 3D Printer too [ PRUSA i3 MK2S clone ] so fussing around with a DIY enclosure from these materials will provide a priner for that project .... Makerbeam XL goodies should start flowing onto my porch starting this afternoon #AmazonPrime-ftw

    More pics and notes to follow ...




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    Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171201_190235-jpg   Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171201_214331-jpg  


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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    117v with the Max power "POT" turned up to ... well ... MAX ... Weird thing to me - as a non informed on electrical type stuff newb ... is that these readings in voltage increase to 134.XX v +/- when the motor is connected and running ??? Can some one explain? Crappy HF volt meter?

    Also - seemed to get pretty warm rather easy - especially under NO load. With the Max POT all the way up and at full RPM - once i covered the spindle with black tape completely and put a reflective strip on the spindle - it was hitting 8,000 RPM.... [ voltmeter read 134v ] took it down to 7000 RPM via the potentiometer dial [ didnt check voltages at 7k rpms meh ... it was still getting warm. Dialed it back to 6,000 RPM approx - it was at 90-91v readings there and temps seemed to level off but it was warm. Concerned as I dont know how warm these things should get after 10 mins - no load running 6,000 rpm [ No Fan either ... ] Exergen says outside of unit was 110* F approx. give or take 5-8 degrees.

    Here she goes at about 6020 rpm's

    https://www.facebook.com/steve.aylor...3187320444205/

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171201_214336-jpg   Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171201_225719-jpg  


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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    My control for my 80/20 mill went through a few iterations. I finally ended up with this. It's all crammed inside of a 4u server chassi enclosure I got off ebay. I also included a picture of the final setup, in case you need ideas of a bench.

    The treadmill motor will go to 130vdc MAX, but it should only be used for a few seconds. I'd max the voltage out to 115. Above that, it will get too hot and draw a lot of current.


    -Shaun

    Edit: I don't know why the pic is sideways... :/

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20170522_182615-jpg   Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20170522_172632-jpg   Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20170522_191949-jpg  
    Shaun
    my x2 conversion ------> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36403


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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    Can you tell me what made you decide on the stepper motor size(570 Oz/in, some people go as low as 270 oz/in.) and controller (KL versus Gecko) kit?
    Are the steppers the right size and what do you think about the controllers?

    What did you do for ballscrews?

    Last edited by cncuser1; 12-17-2017 at 04:24 PM.


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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    Hello there and thanks for stopping by my thread ...

    Good question. Ive come to realize that most everything in this DIY CNC building adventure is a compromise / trade off. In this instance ... time and money vs. trying to get exact matching components to the machine. I was having a bit of challenge at the time I was looking to buy the drivers and stepper motors for the right matched drivers and motors in the 380 oz range - which was the lowest I read I should go. When I went to Keling's site after I gave up on ebay - because I felt like the ebay ads were fraught with misinformation and low budget and mismatched items - I decided to stick with Keling / Automation Tech ... [ whatever ] - at least they were in USA had a great rep and I could email and call and expect a reply - so I was limited to their current inventory... time / $$$ ... compromise.

    Looked at their offerings and noted that the KITS or indiv parts - were priced such that the 570 oz and properly matched drivers were just mere dollars apart from the 380 oz, and so, looking to the future - I pretty much know - that after i get this rig up and running and cutting parts ... the next step for me is a G0704 or a similar maybe little larger machine. Im going to school on this one.

    I selected these 4 wire motors ... https://www.automationtechnologiesin...3h2100-50-4bm/

    That decision was partially based on reading so much of Hoss' sites - like this page ...G0704 Electronics


    I figured for same or a few extra bones Id be near setup to handle a G0704 and if these kicked butt on that - the X2 would be just peachy - I may end up proven wrong - Im not there yet.


    I called Keling / Automation Tech ... to get an understanding of what was different about the 5056 vs. the 5056D as both product descriptions were essentially advising they are now both Digital based DSP drivers ... there is now a 5056E which is the latest iteration of the 5056D. I was advised that the 5056 and the 5056D were the same driver - the 5056 - was their most popular and most sold drive - they are made by two different companies and that their pricing for the 5056 due to volume was better - but its the same drive otherwise ... Im not at the point in this build where i can test or know ... Sorry barring a more convincing argument from the guy I talked to there [ John? ] I put the 5056's in my cart and hoped I didnt make a mistake ... If I did, I calculated it was a $150 error and I just got back and get the 5056E's and sell off the 5056's and recoup a few bux if possible or leave them on the x2 and use the better units on the next machine - whatever. Not the end of the world.

    I got these - in a kit ... with power supplies and the steppers and a C10 BoB ... https://www.automationtechnologiesin...rivers/kl5056/

    Which I prolly wouldnt do again in Kit form as Im already looking for a new powersupply and I got a C11Gr for $68 too - looking ot add smooth stepper ESS for ethernet as well ... meh ...


    Additionally I decided against the geckos because my initial reading / research lead me to the understanding that they had a max 3.5 amps - so I saw that as a limitation ... Subsequent reading and broader understanding now is - paired to the correct motors [ the 380 oz units you reference perhaps ] - that may very well outperform my bigger / torque'y stepper from the standpoint of faster rapids ... again - I truly do not know for sure, but the 5.6 amp drivers matched to 5 amp steppers are supposed to be pretty snazzy.

    EDIT: whoops - forgot the ballscrews answer. I had been putting those off determinant upon which CNC kit / conversion system I end up with ... I was thinking of using a hybrid Z axis custom thing - but have in the last week or so decided to K.I.S.S. and go with a design that already has the 3 axis ... GOOD ENOUGH to start making chips ... DJBird3's setup looks pretty fine. Free to download on this forum is where i got em. His plans come with the drawings to send off when ordering the ballscrews that will fit the CNC conversions design. I liked that. I keep reading recent posts from folks very unhappy with the CNC Fusion kits in one way or another - so Im not going in that direction - besides that theyre spendy :-)


    Ive made quite a few missteps already - prolly about 200-300 of either incorrect or redundant items ... impatience and lack of knowledge - its a process. Hope this helps you

    All the best,

    Steve


    Quote Originally Posted by cncuser1 View Post
    Can you tell me what made you decide on the stepper motor size(570 Oz/in, some people go as low as 270 oz/in.) and controller (KL versus Gecko) kit?
    Are the steppers the right size and what do you think about the controllers?

    What did you do for ballscrews?




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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    Man this control box / enclosure is kickin my arse ! :-) Muddling thru ... my lack of skills as a sparky is evident - but progress is being made ... Every 2 hrs its a new gizmo or gadget switch cord wire connector - always something ... but here's the latest on this build as of today ... actually working on this thing atm ...



    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171209_010452-jpg   Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171209_012649-jpg   Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171217_141704-jpg   Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171217_141719-jpg  

    Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171217_141729-jpg  


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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    Excellent thread !

    You get a 10/10 for honesty, enthusiasm, speed building and pretty good comments on what You bought and why.
    And great pics.

    Don´t worry about costs/value/mistakes.
    Your errors are much less than most of us who started earlier and your results much better much faster (by 2-3-10x, depending... vbg ).



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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    OK, thanks.
    Top notch job!



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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    It may be a little late now but I thought you could mount the KBMM-125 so that the heatsink is on the outside of the box while the electronics was still inside. The wall of the box would be common to both.



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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    Thanks for the words of encouragement my friend ... However; I feel like Im cheating - lol ... Its like taking a Take Home Open Book test ... and I get to use Youtube University for all the answers ... Only way Id ever be up to ANY speed here ... but man have I learned a lot. Who knew contactors were so awesome and used so widely ... Ice Cube Relays? Stackable and Normally Closed or Normally OPEN E Stop switches? Hahahaha - all this stuff I never even had a clue ever existed ... now I be knowin ...

    and holy moses ... where was this video I just stumbled across ... about 180 hours ago ..



    I love old retro stuff like this ...

    Quote Originally Posted by hanermo View Post
    Excellent thread !

    You get a 10/10 for honesty, enthusiasm, speed building and pretty good comments on what You bought and why.
    And great pics.

    Don´t worry about costs/value/mistakes.
    Your errors are much less than most of us who started earlier and your results much better much faster (by 2-3-10x, depending... vbg ).




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    Default Re: Yet Another Sieg X2 [D] CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HEL

    Yeah .. basically I did give that [ or an iteration of that ] a good solid think .. almost went that way with the KBMM-125 - outside the main enclosure in its own 3D printed box ... but then thought it would kinda look like a wart or a large mole hanging off this thing ... so then I went all stupid and made my own enclosure to deal with my space requirements ... Additionally, this box is Lexan / Acrylic and an alum frame .. .the whole point of the heatsink that large is to dissipate heat ... if this board gets that hot to need that big ass heatsink - it would likely destroy the interior wall of the box ... tho I could do it thru the galv sheet metal ... hrmmmm Well, hindsight being 20/20 ... shoulda just spent the extra $100 approx than I wanted to for a large enough real industrial enclosure. I spent it anyways on just misc stuff. $25 here / $30 there ... $15 here and outrageous shipping on all of it added on for all the after thought and gizmos needed. Words of advice - if you are on a limited budget like I am now - that Ive blown a ton o cash on stupid buying decisions ... do your components research very well or know WTF it is youre doing in advance of hitting the Buy It Now button ... Ive bought a lot of unusable junk. Connectors - motors - custom length wiring and on and on ...

    AND another word of caution my friends ... building a control box that, in even a slight manner ... mimics a true industrial control is not "simple" [ in my mind anyways ] and NOT done "on the cheap" ... the methods Im using via youtuber CNC4XR7's control box added an easy $300+ to my estimated control box build. I started using his tutorials and components list as his were the most detail oriented vids on these subjects I could find - as I was soooo green I needed the wire by wire - component by component explanations - which has been great.

    The lack of proper wire raceway and cable management is making me want to vomit now ... mad at myself for not just buying it but it irked me that stuff was $30-40 bux + shipping for a strip of extruded plastic that costs maybe $.08 to make - meh ...

    P.S. - Spent 7x $3.98 approx per bag for the POS clips i have in there now - lol - see what I mean ... DUMB.

    Small Update : 12/19/17






    Quote Originally Posted by cncuser1 View Post
    It may be a little late now but I thought you could mount the KBMM-125 so that the heatsink is on the outside of the box while the electronics was still inside. The wall of the box would be common to both.


    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171219_091244-jpg   Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171219_091257-jpg   Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171219_092754-jpg   Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP-20171219_092425-jpg  



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Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP

Yet Another Sieg X2 [D]  CNC Conversion and Upgrade Thread - Total Newb Needs HELP