compact 5 cnc

[bmill]

hello everyone , never posted here before so bare with me. recently aquired an emco compact 5 cnc , red and grey in colour so i belive its a later model, took the back cover off and someone at some point in time has installed a wellturn card into it. i disconnected it because they are no longer supported but i think the rest of the boards are still intact.i have searched high and low for some pics to see what it should look like but none out there, however i believe there might have been a vcb board on here at one time but its gone . the cables seem to be there though.so what im looking to do is either try to bring this somehow back to life or maybe a total refit with new steppers as well. has anyone done any of this and what might be the most economical route??

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[Fastest1]

Welcome aboard.
Pictures ALWAYS help. Even if only done with a phone. Take many. There should be a conversion or 2 around here. I have seen plenty of mention of the Compact's over they years.

[ninefinger]

I'm in the midst of a conversion of a Compact5 CNC to new stepper motors and drivers, including the turret tool changer. I've got the Mechanical bits sorted out mostly, its actually very easy as the original motors use the nema 23 mounting pattern. The wiring of the drivers is also standard stuff. I'm struggling a bit with my choice of controller though - I'm trying to use a Beaglebone Black with Machinekit (Fork of Linuxcnc). I've actually got the X and Z axis working, but getting the tool changer to behave is a bit of a challenge. Hopefully will be sorted out soon and I can use it in anger. I plan on reusing the original DC spindle motor and speed control as they still work, just need to interface to the speed control pot (next challenge after I figure out the tool changer).
A few pics of my machine.



I still have the working original stepper driver boards, steppers and processor unit, but it was just too antiquated to use for anything, plus the new stepper motors are much faster / stronger (mine are too strong but I had them already).

As far as economics - the stepper drivers can be had really cheap these days if you don't want name brand ($10 each), and the motors are cheap too ($25 each), and so is a BOB to a parallel port, power supply for steppers ($40) so all that is left is a control PC (LinuxCNC/Machinekit -probotix sell one for $350 or Mach3) or one of the other integrated motion control devices out there (Planet CNC USB controller, Eding CNC, etc)

You could possibly bring it back to life with used boards for less but if you want to really use it then updating it is the way to go IMHO.

Mike

[bmill]

thanks for the info guys, i will get some pics as soon as i can get it out in the open things are a little clogged up right now.I was originally hoping to restore to original but but finding a program that i dont have to reinvent seems a bit trying , so i will probably update steppers and bob and drives. my thoughts were to install new motors,bob ,drives, touch screen,motion controller. hoping to use either mach 3 or 4, and as far as the turret and the spindle i thought maybe prox for threading on the spindle and position on the turret and a plc to integrate all together . Any thoughts ?

[bmill]

thanks for the reply, i will take some pics as soon as i can get it in the open

[DSpeck]

The spindle already has an index wheel, and an encoder wheel (100/rev, if it's like mine). You can re-use the spindle encoder stuff. It's optical, no need for prox. You can use a C3 board(from CNC4PC) for connecting the spindle index to Mach3. Mach3 only takes a single pulse/rev for threading. If you are using LinuxCNC/Machinekit, I think you have to connect all the encoders. I don't know if you have to add two more C3 boards, or if there is a more economical solution for connecting them. The answer to this is of strong interest to me, as I have several small CNC lathes waiting for control upgrades.

[AR1911]

I am in the middle of a (stalled) refit just like yours. I don't think it's worth the trouble to make the original controls work, as it requires the use of the original teaching software, which is limited. I was able to sell my entire (working) control unit for $400, which more than covers the cost of the retrofit parts including Mach3/4. Once that's gone, it's straighforward stuff as Ninefinger details. I built a metal shelf to cover the top of the base where the control cabinet mounts.

[109jb]

The spindle already has an index wheel, and an encoder wheel (100/rev, if it's like mine). You can re-use the spindle encoder stuff. It's optical, no need for prox. You can use a C3 board(from CNC4PC) for connecting the spindle index to Mach3. Mach3 only takes a single pulse/rev for threading. If you are using LinuxCNC/Machinekit, I think you have to connect all the encoders. I don't know if you have to add two more C3 boards, or if there is a more economical solution for connecting them. The answer to this is of strong interest to me, as I have several small CNC lathes waiting for control upgrades.

LinuxCNC will work happily with just the index pulse.

[bmill]

alot of info to digest here , i think i will use mach 3 as ive used it before , does anyone have a suggestion where the best place is to buy a complete kit for this lathe? steppers,drives, bob and so on.planning on using original spindle motor as well

[Fastest1]

I have always had good luck with Arturo at CNC4PC, Steve at PMDX or Automation Technologies Inc AKA Keling.

[ninefinger]

By the way, I did say the motor mounts are direct fit for a Nema 23 size motor, the only thing is to reuse the original pulleys and belts you need to drill a cross hole on the stepper motor shaft.
I think I ended up drilling and use adhesive (Loctite) but you probably could get away with just Loctite...
And while your at it, get a hold of some longer M4 screws to mount the motors, the ones that are there won't work on the new motors (thicker flange on the new ones) - plus the external hex is a royal pain - you'll want socket head cap screws.

[bmill]

looks like automation tech might have what im looking for thanks

[bmill]

are these pulleys metric bore havent got mine off yet

[ninefinger]

Sorry, Don't remember that - but I think they are standard 1/4" shafts (6.35mm). Best that you check though - my memory never was any good and its only getting worse.

[AR1911]

Those little belts are precious, so be careful. I have not found a source for new replacements at a decent price.
I have not seen any upgrades that went to direct drive for the spindles, but that might be worth considering.

[javanree]

New belts are readily available. I got a set of them from http://www.bearingshopuk.co.uk/mxl-480/
Either the 12 or the 13mm will do
Pulley's indeed have a 1/4" bore

[AR1911]

New belts are readily available. I got a set of them from MXL- 480 - MXL Pitch - Bearing Shop UK
Either the 12 or the 13mm will do
Pulley's indeed have a 1/4" bore

Thanks! They ship to the US too.

I don't suppose they have the correct pulley also? I don't have one to measure.

[bmill]

well its been a while since my last post , so here is what i have so far. cnc4pc controller box , new steppers , mpg , complete redo of all the bearings and total cleanup and kind of a new look to close in all holes in panel. using mach 4 (by the way its alot different than mach 3) Having a few issues with the mpg doesnt seem to work quite right yet ( arturo is working on a solution ) I have some pics finally in them you will notice the computer on the stand i also use this to run my excello which by the way was another refit a few years back Mach Motion did this a really good setup and excellent support .pics (3).zip As for the tool changer at this time im going to put a small stepper and use the mpg to rotate by hand until im ready for more. all the boards and everything i took out is going up for sale as soon as i figure out where on here u post items???

[_Dieter_]

.....but getting the tool changer to behave is a bit of a challenge. Hopefully will be sorted out soon and I can use it in anger. I plan on reusing the original DC spindle motor and speed control as they still work, just need to interface to the speed control pot (next challenge after I figure out the tool changer).
Mike

It's not very complicated,all you need is to send pulses (+5V) between pin 6 and GND. The number of pulses sets the number of "swivels" for the turret, but not the absolute tool-number.
I changed my DNC-board and the original CPU to absolute indexing. A simple encoder made from a 6-position rotary switch with a "fork coupling" does the job which engages in the holes
of the nut. On the DNC a added a small PCB to send the START-pulse for the CPU when the final position is reached.
Attachment 348500Attachment 348502Attachment 348504Attachment 348506Attachment 348508

For the speed control be warned! Mains is present on the board and you must not connect any interfaces without galvanic isolation. 0 - 7.8 V on IC2A (LM324) is needed to control the whole
speed range.

Dieter

[ninefinger]

I got the toolchanger sorted out using a small stepper motor and some help from the Machinekit forum. So all I have left to convert on mine is home switches, spindle on/off, speed and index pulses. Waiting on a few lost parcels from China to do that....
Dieter -thanks for the info on voltage input range - it confirms my measurements.

Mike