my 1handed o704 build

[endlasuresh]

hey ///

im sure others could answer better s this is my first build... but just to get the mill axis moving ..

mill
cnc conversion kit
control box
P/C to run the control box
if i remember correctly the above three things only will get you into the 3500.00 range ... that may be a bit low.. and does not include any software or tooling of any kind..
with all the xtra junk ive been adding ... i really think im over the 5000.00 mark... im just going off the top of my head ... and ive been penny pinching everywhere i can...

pretty cheap when you consider the next thing up for me would be a tormach pcnc setup and that will get into the 15k range in a hearbeat... im happy with everything so far except the Y axis travel... its not enough for me...but im working on a plan for that... adding the 4th axis will be next though... i really need to learn and be able to make my own gears...

please dont forget..that even though the lower price makes it attractive.... it is tons and tons of research.....work...trial and error sometimes... more work and research...then more work... but the guys here have all the experience in the world... i really recommend looking a Hossmachine website... he is just plain and simple a mad scientist when it comes to this stuff ... he has dvds that outline everty single aspect of doing a g0704 conversion step by step...or in stages... with part numbers...drawings..dimensions... places to purchase... etc etc... it doesnt get much easier than that...

yes it can machine aluminum easily.... steel as well with the proper feeds and speeds....ive even seen the g0704 machining titanium with the stock DC motor.... you just have to stay within the rigidity limits of the machine.
if your needing to machine alot of steel part.... i think the RF45 mill might be a better match for you..thats your call though..

hope that helps

Thanks a lot for your reply, but still I won't get which one have to build. I was been suggested to get like RF 45 type mill, but do you know is their any open source drawings such type CNC milling?
Can you tell what is the meaning of range as you are saying 3500, 5000. Do you mean does it travel range? I am looking out to build that can engrave too on metal plates.

[1hander]

Thanks a lot for your reply, but still I won't get which one have to build. I was been suggested to get like RF 45 type mill, but do you know is their any open source drawings such type CNC milling?
Can you tell what is the meaning of range as you are saying 3500, 5000. Do you mean does it travel range? I am looking out to build that can engrave too on metal plates.

sorry i dont know of open source drawings...

i meant cost of between $3500.00 to $5000.00

and im sorry buy but i do not know anything about engraving yet...

[1hander]

ahhh frustration.... so i spent some time grinding the spindle outer surfaces between centers,,, pretty uneventful... a bit boring but worth the trouble...
it did not however fix the problem... it helped as i can now get to about 6krpm before the onset of vibration...

heres some vids, warning they are boring but i can watch this stuff all day long.... after reassembling the spindle i checked the runout and was pleasantly surprised that i actually had trouble seeing the runout on a .0001 indicator... it was moving just a hair off of the zero... so im guessing about .00002 .. i could really not see the needle moving much but it was just moving a hair...

[1hander]

after running ot for a while it felt like the vibes were worse at the top of the head than at the base by the spindle nose.... so i looked and it looks like i didnt bore the gear precise enough...and it has a wobble side to side...
so its one or both of the following


1. the gear is causing it... looks like a good little wobble
2. the top of spindle is wobbling inside of the gear sleeve thingy... does anyone know where i can but one of those 3d printed rings that goes down in there to stop the noise it makes...might help...

[1hander]

heres a couple vids of a part im making for someone..

funny thing ... when cutting the brass pieces i would get estops....at 3krpm
when drilling the wood, i got no estops..at1300rpm ....do i need to ground the mill ... i mean it should be grounded....the motor casing is bolted to the aluminum and to the mill...and the motor casing is ground to earth ground


- - - Updated - - -

[Fastest1]

How much debounce have you set? Try 500 or so first see if it doesnt end the false triggers.

A star ground is the way to go for the best outcome.

[bill south]

Hey 1!
Where did you source your tool post grinder? I'd very much like to build one and yours looks like it works just fine!
If you mentioned this before, accept my apologies. Been out of town and trying to get caught up on my zone posts.
Thanks for sharing.
Bill

[1hander]

Hey 1!
Where did you source your tool post grinder? I'd very much like to build one and yours looks like it works just fine!
If you mentioned this before, accept my apologies. Been out of town and trying to get caught up on my zone posts.
Thanks for sharing.
Bill

hey bill
i found mine on ebay ...it needed rebuilding/switch/new cord/ brushes... but it was complete... the hard part is finding it complete...but they are there if you keep an eye out... the seller gigigirl111 seems to have the majority of them dont be afraid to offer a bit on the low side... he went back and forth with me and i paid if i remember 200.00 fore mine ... complete with all pulleys and box..

[1hander]

How much debounce have you set? Try 500 or so first see if it doesnt end the false triggers.

A star ground is the way to go for the best outcome.

thanks for the reply
i had the debounce at 2500 ...so i had a real problem with noise... pretty sure its vfd noise ...either one or both of its power cables... so i just routed the powercable to the vfd up the wall and then across to the vfd about 4 feet away from the control computer and any other cables... as well as raising the motor feed cable up and away from other stuff..

so i cut a part yesterday after moving the vfd wires and got no estops ,,,

just now i ran two programs just cutting air and got no estops with the debounce at 200 and got no estops....i even did spindle override from 280rpm all the way to 10k and back down intermittently to see if i could cause and estop...this would always cause and estop before ... but all seems well right now... ill have to put some aluminum in there to cut some metal and see if the results are the same...

i know this is pretty dumb stuff i got going on here ... i really appreciate you guys not stating the obvious....which is im a dumbass LOL/// im learning though... thank you all for your time

so now that im getting a hang of things i have to change it...decided to use mach standard mill..seems like a good setup...i like the tool measuring stuff ...makes things much easier for a guy with one hand..i cant wait to put the spacer in the head and do the power drawbar..

[Fastest1]

A debounce level of 200 is very acceptable. Good job easy fix, maybe. Sometimes you think they are gone and they reappear. On the other hand VFD's are known for noise.

Btw, you arent doing anything wrong or like a dumbass. You got started. Learning takes experience. Experience comes from making mistakes. Doing great in my book. Keep sharing.

[1hander]

thanks boss...i just wish i had tons of money to keep buying aluminum to pratice on and turn into swarf...LOL..
your right about it coming back..its happenned 5 or 6 times to me when i thought i had it figured out..but on payday i need to get a longer cable to power the vfd up and over and have it mounted up high and i need to spin the mototr 180 degrees to get the power cable too it down to about 14 inches or so

will it hurt to go to zero on the debounce... i was going to get a 3 phase emi filter for motor but they only go to 60 hertz...so it would be useless if it stops filterig at 60 hertz...
hoping the moving of the cables does the trick... i know i have absolutely no ground loops..all chassis and shielded wires are grounded theres nothing left...i think the vfd is just to noisy..its a cheap chinese job too so i dont expect much out of it.. just wanted to use it for the mach3 plugin that was made for it...works great and just uses a usb cable for signals

when i moved my balancer frame got lost...its just gone.. so im in the process if CADing another setup...and would be happy to share ...it will be just big enough to balance the spindle and round objects of about 5 inches but thats it... i need it small enough to balance my turbine shafts and wheels as well

learning standard mill will take time as well...

thanks

[1hander]

this is my replacement cradle/rocker

[Fastest1]

There is nothing wrong with running 0 debounce if you can. However the debounce is the time the noise has to be present before Mach recognizes it as a fault. 500 or less is so short in the measurement of time very little additional movement will have occurred.

The best solution will be practicing good grounding techniques and the separation of the low and high voltage wires as you have done.

[1hander]

will do...thank you

[1hander]

im not sure if any of you guys are using this... but if you guys could check this... i think i can use it im not sure if it has to be a NO or NC circuit to work ... or maybe it doesnt matter if i can just flip the signal in mach3 or will that not work in this case...

CNC Tool Length Sensor, Tool Offset Setting Sensor.

the touch probe is NC

also since the c35 board uses the ethernet connectors, i dont have anywhere for another input... i already have a touch probe card ... but i dont think i can hook up another input to it... so does that mean ill have to run a wire directly to the board for this touch off plate..

[Wiggles84]

im not sure if any of you guys are using this... but if you guys could check this... i think i can use it im not sure if it has to be a NO or NC circuit to work ... or maybe it doesnt matter if i can just flip the signal in mach3 or will that not work in this case...

CNC Tool Length Sensor, Tool Offset Setting Sensor.

the touch probe is NC

also since the c35 board uses the ethernet connectors, i dont have anywhere for another input... i already have a touch probe card ... but i dont think i can hook up another input to it... so does that mean ill have to run a wire directly to the board for this touch off plate..

If I understand the MSM screen set right....... you can have a touch probe ( for picking up part or fixture ) , mounted touch plate ( tool length sensor ) and a mobile touch plate all setup to on one pin as probes. Since you should only be using one at a time. Just like home \ limit switches can all be on the same pin (input). But I think they all need to be the same, NO or NC.

As far as setting in mach3 go for NO or NC, it should be just changing the active high \ low setting under ports and pins.

I don't have the tool length sensor you linked, but mine is NO and it works fine with MSM and mach.
Universal CNC Wireless Tool Setting Gauge Mach3 Ucstudio Sinumerik Mitsubishi | eBay


Andrew

[1hander]

thanks for the response andrew.

i was going to try to set the touch probe and the tool setter on the same input... wire them in series...to avoid using another input that i need for a later addon... but as you said if i do that they need to both be NC ... like the probe is... i found this one that is NC and would work in series with my probe...

do you know if msm has like 2 speeds you can set the z axis when measuring the tool.... like to go down at 25ipm for a certain distance then slow to 5ipm... instead of going down at 5ipm ..it would take a while you know...

if i go with this ..New Open CNC Z Axis Automatic Tool Presetter Locator w Stroke Protection 0 001mm | eBay .... i really like the airblast feature which is easy enough to add to any other but this tool setter has a good bit of overtravel protection... can you possibly look at that link and scroll down to the wiring schematic they have posted a pic of... there are two wires that it looks like i could use as NC .... or does it not work like that...

i have found one that is NC Werkzeuglängensensor TLS 02 Werkzeuglängentaster Tool Length Probe | eBay .. but not much overtravel protection...

i saw the one your using... i was going to try that one but im really scared that it will pick up EMI from the VFD or motor..

your time is appreciated

[Wiggles84]

thanks for the response andrew.

i was going to try to set the touch probe and the tool setter on the same input... wire them in series...to avoid using another input that i need for a later addon... but as you said if i do that they need to both be NC ... like the probe is... i found this one that is NC and would work in series with my probe...

do you know if msm has like 2 speeds you can set the z axis when measuring the tool.... like to go down at 25ipm for a certain distance then slow to 5ipm... instead of going down at 5ipm ..it would take a while you know...

if i go with this ..New Open CNC Z Axis Automatic Tool Presetter Locator w Stroke Protection 0 001mm | eBay .... i really like the airblast feature which is easy enough to add to any other but this tool setter has a good bit of overtravel protection... can you possibly look at that link and scroll down to the wiring schematic they have posted a pic of... there are two wires that it looks like i could use as NC .... or does it not work like that...

i have found one that is NC Werkzeuglängensensor TLS 02 Werkzeuglängentaster Tool Length Probe | eBay .. but not much overtravel protection...

i saw the one your using... i was going to try that one but im really scared that it will pick up EMI from the VFD or motor..

your time is appreciated

MSM does have settings for "two pass" probing. I believe mine is set for 25 IPM the first pass, then it backs off .100" and and does the second at 4 IPM. Since I only have the tool length offseter, I'm not sure if these settings are shared with probing to pick up your part \ fixture.

The first one you linked looks nice, but it says that it is a NO in the description. I see the image where it shows something about NC. To tell you the truth, wiring diagrams made me go cross eyed most of the time. Maybe if you message the seller they can clarify if it can be wired as NC.

The second one comes up in German and I can't get chrome to translate it to English. so I can't really say much on that one.


I remember reading some where that running a higher voltage on limit switches \ probes can help with false signals. but if you need to step it down for your BOB, I'm need really sure how that is done. I'm running a MX3660 that uses 12V on the E-stop and inputs.

Would you still have issues from the VFD if the motor is not spinning? I'm not running one at the moment so I haven't had that bag of issues to work with yet.


Glad to share my $.02,
Andrew

[1hander]

i decided to go with the german one... looks well built and is NC setup just the kinematic touch probe... this will make my setup very easy... i will be adding an airblast to it to remove chips before measuring tools..
now i just have to wait for it to show up and ill need to add a longer lead to it..comes with 5 ft lead.... not long enough

i only had problems when the motor was running.. specifically speeding up or slowing down... going to higher voltage would definately fix the problem... but i didnt want to go through the trouble of doing that then having to downstep voltage back to 5v for the BOB... instead i thought id try to solve the problem at its root cause...

havent been able to work on the mill... the damn truck needed tension strut bushings before it would pass inspection...buyt i had to go buy a press to remove and install the bushings .. then i though it would be cool to pass a kidney stone while i worked on that and couldnt go to the hospital till i got the truck fixed inspected and registered .. then i went to the ER..

what an insane day...

[Fastest1]

So today is going to be better. That should be an easy accomplishment, considering ;-)