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  1. #133
    Activation process peteeng's Avatar
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    But Weight there's More! I've done some more detailing of P1 and corrected some of the component weights. The assembly as shown weighs 302kg or 667lb whichever side of the pond your on. Is this heavy for such a machine? Has a 4kg spindle (80mm 2kW), corrected the car masses and the rest should be spot on. Any comments on actual gantry weights would be appreciated to see where this ones going... Better get to the laser ...Peter

    EDIT _ I've been through the model and found a couple of things set to the wrong density. Its 102kg, that's much betterer. I was worried on how strong the bench would have to be!! The main issue was in hidden parts. I had suppress the bench but not all of it.

    Now I also did some quick calcs on the ballscrew (see attached) . Using a 4Nm NEMA34 (76mm long) we can get about 400kgf force from it. This motor would cost about $49AUD if we used an 8Nm motor (114mm long) we'd get 900kgf from it at stall. So if we get about half of these I'm happy. A good drill press will push 150kgf and I think 100kgf for plunging is fine (unless anyone says they need more?) The screw buckles at 1.2 tonne so were good to go. The Z axis itself weighs about 18kg so no trouble for the screw to raise it.

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Designing new Router called Maximus-302kg-667lbs-jpg   Designing new Router called Maximus-ballscrew-calcs-jpg  
    Last edited by peteeng; 05-18-2019 at 07:18 AM.


  2. #134
    Member Sterob's Avatar
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    Just the X and Z assemble weighs 302 kg?
    Ummm...Seems crazy heavy to me, but I'm not expert.....



  3. #135
    Activation process peteeng's Avatar
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    Hi Sterob - see edited post. Its 102kg checked through and found some errors in density. Whew...I was a bit worried... Peter



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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    Maximus P1 Round 1 Summary
    We're designing a router that will have a 10N/0.001mm static stiffness. It's a high rail design intended as a mechanical kit machine (see image attached) . The 10N/um has been selected from research on mills so this will be a very stiff router. So far it has 15mm rails, Z Axis screw is a 1605, it has a bed to take a full 8'x4' sheet with 100mm around it. Z axis travel will be 250mm and there will be a table apron to do edge work. The bench is currently ply but a metal bench can be built by the Maker if wanted.

    The main objective is to create a mechanical structure that does not need any updating. Its stiffness DNA will allow the Maker to start simple yet develop the machine to whatever needs arise. The main features are as low as cost as possible, laser cut and bent main parts, minimal threading and stainless steel or aluminium materials (to avoid painting)

    Things to do in Round 2:
    1) Use 20mm bearings to create a little more space around the bearing plate. Plus as the $$$ delta is low may as well use the stronger bearings
    2 )The bearing plate will probably be two pieces not the large single piece as drawn
    3) The machine will use NEMA34 motors
    4) The Z axis will use a 16mm ball screw for motion
    5) The X&Y axis will use belts and perhaps an R&P version will be developed
    6) Axis speeds and accelerations have not been specified yet
    7) I'd like to develop a carbon fibre part and a 3D printed part but nothing has shown up yet suitable for these
    8) As the Maker buys the rails they can make a half sheet or full sheet machine

    Its turned out a bit bigger than I imagined but at the start I did not have a stiffness target. This machine is Maximus heavy or Maximus-H. A light version will be developed once the H is resolved. This will be achieved by making the Light version from thinner material that reduces cost to a reasonable level balanced against stiffness. Peter

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Designing new Router called Maximus-maximus-p1-18-05-19-jpg  
    Last edited by peteeng; 05-18-2019 at 04:08 PM.


  5. #137
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    Hi All - I have remodelled an MSA20mm car so it has the right compliance. I have taken away bits of geometry so that when Simsolid does its auto connect it does not connect the plastic bits or the middle strip in its bolting land. My target stiffness is 1000N/um. Turns out if I make the body of the car aluminium vs steel I get near to the correct stiffness. So that's easy to do. So onward to making P2. Will decide on the sub assembly logic and start rebuilding from the Z axis backward.

    Sub assm logic is important for when I generate Bills of Material or BOM's and a drawing stack. Especially a bolts list. I'm going to try two different ways to do this in this project. I've never created an accurate, full fastener BOM yet! Peter

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Designing new Router called Maximus-car-sriffness-jpg  
    Last edited by peteeng; 05-19-2019 at 07:48 AM.


  6. #138
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    Hi All - Here's the sub assembly breakdown:
    1) Tool Tube - includes spindle, rails and cars. I try to stop at cars as this is a logical structural loop for simulation and it keeps the rails and cars in the one assembly
    2) Bearing Plate - maybe two pieces or one. Will find out soon enough
    3 ) Gantry - including rails and cars
    4) Bench - including rails and cars
    5) Stand
    6) Bolts assembly - this is tricky but I think I can do all the bolts in an assembly then the bolts BOM is easy. But then the bolts won't be in the assembly for simulation only for the global simulation. I can put them in the sub assm but then I'll have to suppress them and rebuild them in the general arrangement Don't like doing things twice!! especially bolts they are a fiddle...Peter



  7. #139
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    Hi All - I have beavered away and started on the Max-H-P2. Here's the tool plate. I have decided to use the same philosophy as the gantry. Currently it deflects 0.3mm under 10,000N load. The target is 1mm at 10,000N so we are good. Next step is to add all the bolts/nuts and bolt holes and run that. From prior work half the deflection was the tool plate cantilever and half the rest so having this under 0.5mm is a good thing so far. Have to work on the spindle mounts so they work in this situation. Looks clean and adding the bolts will be exciting!! Peter

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Designing new Router called Maximus-maximus-p2-tool-plate-jpg   Designing new Router called Maximus-simsolid-jpg  
    Last edited by peteeng; 05-20-2019 at 03:41 AM.


  8. #140
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    Hi All - First round of screws are in. Next I have to figure out how to screw the spindle clamps in but still allow it to be trammed. A few more screws then I wanted but I had to allow the front plate to be removed without upsetting the rails. So one row of screws is from the back plate to the rails, the alternate screws hold the front plate to the back plate. Once the clamp is resolved I can put this onto the gantry. Peter

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Designing new Router called Maximus-max-h-2-jpg   Designing new Router called Maximus-max-h-jpg  


  9. #141
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    Hi All- I've been researching timing belts and their profiles for linear drives. The Optibelt Design Manual is full of good info. For instance they make an ATL profile which has less clearance and a negative length tolerance. Linear drives need more preload than power drives so the belt is stretched more. The negative tolerance takes this into account. Go to their site and download the manual if you want... Peter

    https://www.optibelt.com/en/products...t-alpha-power/

    Edit - I have a solution for the spindle clamp. Not detailed yet but i think it will work, see image. Good enough to be able to move onto assembly of the gantry. Have to adjust some of the widths yet so it trams... Peter

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Designing new Router called Maximus-max-h-jpg   Designing new Router called Maximus-atl-profile-jpg  
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by peteeng; 05-21-2019 at 07:23 AM.


  10. #142
    Community Moderator ger21's Avatar
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    It seems to me that after all of the analysis to get the stiffest machine possible, using belt drive negates everything, as they are probably the least stiff method of providing motion.

    Gerry

    UCCNC 2017 Screenset
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    JointCAM - CNC Dovetails & Box Joints
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    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)


  11. #143
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    Quote Originally Posted by peteeng View Post
    Hi All- I've been researching timing belts and their profiles for linear drives. The Optibelt Design Manual is full of good info. For instance they make an ATL profile which has less clearance and a negative length tolerance. Linear drives need more preload than power drives so the belt is stretched more. The negative tolerance takes this into account. Go to their site and download the manual if you want... Peter

    https://www.optibelt.com/en/products...t-alpha-power/

    Edit - I have a solution for the spindle clamp. Not detailed yet but i think it will work, see image. Good enough to be able to move onto assembly of the gantry. Have to adjust some of the widths yet so it trams... Peter
    The GT series Timing belts has the least amount of backlash of all other Timing Belts, using a Timing Belt as a linear drives no matter what type you use, is going to compromise your machine accuracy

    Mactec54


  12. #144
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    Default Re: Designing new Router called Maximus

    A timing belt may be fine for a laser machine but not for a router.

    Retired Master Electrician, HVAC/R Commercial. FLA Saturn 2 4x4 CNC Router Mach4 Kimber 1911 45ACP


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