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Hack
01-02-2005, 05:17 PM
Well folks - Santa was pretty good to me this year and brought me this neat little thing called a digital camera. Yes!!!!

Now I can finally share some pics with you folks of what I am building. This is my router with a cut size of about 32 x 48 x 6" . I wanted to be able to do 1/3 sheet of plywood. This is just a prototype and I already have plans to do a second / better one, but wanted to see how this performs as I may sneak a mill in before the next router.


I will use a PC Laminate trimmer for the spindle. Primare cutting will be done on solid wood and mdf. I haven't mounted the router yet obviously, but it is sitting in the garage waiting.

I just received some couplings from HobbyCNC last week (great service by the way) and will mount the steepers next (276 oz/in from Automation Direct)

Hack
01-02-2005, 05:20 PM
Z axis complete with drawer slide linear guides (read freebeee!!)

Hack
01-02-2005, 05:24 PM
Simply some aluminum angle with Abec bearings - seem to work very nice.

Hack
01-02-2005, 05:26 PM
1/4 - 20 threaded rod (this will be the first thing to be replaced cause it will make it very sloowwwww) for the lead screw with some more angle and 1/2" HDPE drilled and tapped.

Hack
01-02-2005, 05:28 PM
Stepper motors from Automation Direct - 276 oz/in Nema 23 Bipolar

Hack
01-07-2005, 09:06 PM
I have pretty much decided on the xylotex for my machine but need a power supply that can work with that board and my motors. Can anyone point me to one that they have had success with?

TIA

Hack
01-07-2005, 09:09 PM
Those motors are 2.8A per phase approx 30 Volts

ger21
01-07-2005, 09:24 PM
http://www.mpja.com/productview.asp?product=12424+PS
http://www.mpja.com/productview.asp?product=15366+PS

A lot of Xylotex users use the power supplies from MPJA. You want to get at least 24V, and no more than 28V. And probably 6a or more.

You can get something cheaper from Ebay, if your patient. I got a 24V 12a for $5. I took a quick look, though, and didn't really see anything right now.

Btw, those aren't 30V motors. Automation Direct doesn't provide that info, but it's most likely 3-5V.

BobLWeiss
01-07-2005, 09:30 PM
I like your design! Nice work.

Did you use angle aluminum on both the top and the bottom for the Y axis? How many bearings do you have on the X and Y axis each? I never thought of using angled aluminum that way...I might have to make another machine!!!

Take some more pictures..

Bob

Hack
01-07-2005, 10:45 PM
I used angle for both the top and bottom on both the x and y axis. 8 bearings per axis - locks it in good. Was gonna do the same for the z but clearance was a problem. A pretty cheap method for longer axis if you don't need a lot of accuracy.

Automation Direct sells a 32 voly power supply that they reccommend for the above motors

http://web3.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Stepper_Systems/Drives_-z-_Power/STP-PWR-3204

That is why I assumed that they are around 30 volts. Am I wrong?

Dan

ger21
01-08-2005, 12:43 PM
Automation Direct sells a 32 voly power supply that they reccommend for the above motors

http://web3.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Stepper_Systems/Drives_-z-_Power/STP-PWR-3204

That is why I assumed that they are around 30 volts. Am I wrong?

Dan

Yes, your wrong. :)
The reason their supply is 32V is because that is what works best with their drives. To get any speed out of steppers, you usually need to supply at least 5x-to 10x their rated voltage. So most likely they are rated at a lower voltage. I *think* you can determine the voltage be measuring the coils resistance.V = amps x resistance.

But, like I said, to keep your Xylotex safe, use 28V as a MAX.

jgro
01-09-2005, 08:52 AM
This is the power supply that I'm using. Works great. http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?category=480&item=PS-2465&type=store

jgro

Hack
01-09-2005, 09:53 AM
I was under the impression that 24 volts would be decent enough but was thinking that the ampw would need to be higher. My motors are 2.8 amps per phase meaning 5.6 amps per motor x 3 motors = 16.8 amps needed to run these properly.

Is my math wrong?

TIA

Dan

ger21
01-09-2005, 04:14 PM
If you use a Xylotex (or Geckos), because of the chopper design, you'll only need 2/3 of 2.8a for each motor (actually 2.5a, Xylotex max), or about 5.6a for 3 motors. They'll probably use even less. I've heard that for a Xylotex, 4.5a would probably even work. I'd get at least 6a. You really don't need anything more. The 24V will be fine.

Hack
01-10-2005, 08:07 PM
Well tonight I ordered the xylotex 3 axis board and the power supply recommended by JGRO (Thank you). I exchand email with the folks at xylotex and confirmed that this would be a good pairing.

Thanks to all of you for your help.

Dan

Hack
01-16-2005, 02:07 PM
I received my xylotex board in the mail a couple of days ago. Still waiting on the power supply. I managed to get the steppers mounted today. Will probably work on the table next. Just wondering, what are you guys using for enclosures for your boards? Need to protect them somehow.

Pics of mounted steppers below.

Hack
02-04-2005, 07:43 PM
Well I got the xylotex board, the steppers, and the power supply, now how do I wire this stuff?

The power supply has 3 screws for hookups labeled as follows:

L & N (AC) hookups and then a symbol that I believe is a ground? I assume that these are AC poer in? Can I just strip the female end of a 3 wire extension cord and wire it to this?

The power supply also has a -V, -V, +V, +V. Uhhhhhh Help?

The zylotex is something you are all familiar with so I will not go into detail here.

The steppers are bipolar 4 wire - see page 1 below for example wiring

http://web3.automationdirect.com/static/specs/surestepmotors.pdf

How does all this go together?

Also, What is and how is the 5v dc on the xylotex board used?

Thanks all.

ger21
02-04-2005, 10:32 PM
L should be the black wire, N should be white. The third should be ground, but I can't tell you for sure. I just looked at the picture, and I'm not sure if that's the AC ground or DC ground?

I'm assuming that both of the V+ terminals are 24V. If so, you should be able to use either one. There should be a corresponding ground for those. Is there a manual with that?

From the last line of the Xylotex .pdf, "The GND & Vcc (+5VDC) available on the right hand side of the board can be used to pull limit inputs high through a 10K resistor. It is not intended to drive other devices."

Hack
02-26-2005, 11:56 AM
Just a few pics to update progress over the last few weeks. Got the table done. Not sure if I want to put some aluminum t - slots (like miter gauge slots) in the top or add some slatboard to allow parts clamping. Contemplating that machine #2 (if I build another) will go with a vaccuum table.

Got the steppers / xylotex / power supply wire together. Just need to connect it to the computer - computer is in limbo right now. Can't get the cd to read. Bad cdrom maybe.

Might just run pure dos with Turbocnc and transfer files from house to shop computer via floppy. Just wonder if simple files will be to large to transfer this way? Any input?

Still need to mount the router. PC trim router. Got the stuff to do it, but gotta get to it. Thinking I want to test the motors next to avoid going any further in case I have to tear something apart.

Well thats all for now.

Dan

ger21
02-26-2005, 12:05 PM
Just wonder if simple files will be to large to transfer this way? Any input?
Dan

Unless your doing 3D toolpaths, you should have no problem fitting files on a floppy. And you can always zip them to make them smaller if you need to.

Hack
03-06-2005, 09:18 AM
Well I got to spin the motors lastnight and actually cut a part for the first time!!!! If I wasn't hooked before, I am now!!!! Ready to do router #2 :) Down the road perhaps.

I'll post some finished pics in the next day or 2 an try to get some pics of actual cuts.. Thanks all for your help. I'm sure there is alot for me to learn, especially on the software sides. I've got some questions about Turbocnc but I'll put them in the proper forum.

Thanks again to everyone.

santiniuk
03-06-2005, 11:57 AM
Dan,

Always enjoy following these threads. Good reading.

Your a few weeks ahead of me but I can feel that desire to make #2 bigger and better !

Keep the pics flowing. How about some things you have cut.

Cheers

Shaun

Nonoriginal
03-06-2005, 02:08 PM
Dan,

I've been reading this thread witha keen interest, as I'm planning on using the same motor/driver/powersupply that you employed. Automation directs 276oz/in. Xylotex board, and the Mjpa popwer supply Gerry recommended.

If you don't mind, I would like to ask you a few questions about your set-up;

What controller software are you using or going to use? Are you going to stick with Turbo CNC?

I have been thinking about Mach 2, but I need to make sure its perfectly compatable with my CAM program.

What kind of computer did you hook everything up too?

besides the minor hang-ups you previously mentioned, have you had any other problems with the electronics?

Keep up the good work...It looks good!

Michael

Hack
03-06-2005, 05:56 PM
What controller software are you using or going to use? Are you going to stick with Turbo CNC? I am currently using TurboCNC as controller software due to the computer I am running limits my choices. I will probably stick with this for now. After using it and seeing how easy it is and what low system resources it uses, I will probably only switch if I have to or I find something that performs better. I have a long way before I would outgrow this software. I am using ACEconverter for my cam software due to it's recommendation on the TurboCNC website and it's free. If anything, Aceconverter seems to be the limitation, but again, I am very new to software.

I have been thinking about Mach 2, but I need to make sure its perfectly compatable with my CAM program. Downloaded it as well. Will probably spend some more time with it as soon as I get this one running good. Again, it will not run on the shop computer.

What kind of computer did you hook everything up too? I have this all running on an old pentium 200 with dos 6.22 installed. Seems to run ok. And I a person can buy these old computers very cheap if they look around. I have a newer computer in the house running Turbocad and Ace and just floppy the code out to the shop. Seems to work well so far. Not sure of really how to use the software (ACEConverter and TurboCNC) to thier fullest.

besides the minor hang-ups you previously mentioned, have you had any other problems with the electronics? I have only had one minor hangup with the xylotex board and it was simply because i tried running it before reading the manual. Simply had to set the vref on the xylotex board properly for it to work. Took about 3 minutes total. Jeff at xylotex has excellent support and helped me with the correct wiring of the steppers etc. Now I just need home and limit switches and learn how to use the software.

Keep up the good work...It looks good! Thank you. Wish you luck with your machine.

Michael

Hack
03-27-2005, 11:43 AM
Below are a couple of items that I have cut on the machine. Just shallow .1" cuts to test the machine and also the g-code. Took me a while to figure out the code issues. I was drawing these items and only getting about half of the results I was expecting. Found out that I just needed to explode the drawings a couple of times and it wourked great.

Cuts are made at 10 ipm again just to test the machine and learn what it can do. Rapids are 15 ipm. That may be about the best I will do with 1/4 - 20 allthread.

Overall, i am very pleased with the x and y axis setup. The Z leaves something to be deisired. I am just getting some flex with this setup. Will reconsider working it later. It is not much flex.

Total cost so far for this machine are estimated as follows

Materials (mdf, aluminum angle, bearings, drawer slides etc) $150.00
Electronics (steppers, xylotex, PS, wiring) $325.00
Laminate trimmer (already had this) $120.00 if you were to go buy
Computer - already had this

With all the misc odds and ends, I'd say someone could build this for less that $700.00 complete using all new part and scrounging a computer. Software is TurboCNC and ACE

Keep in mind, this is a 30 x 48 cut area (approx).

Will be adding home and limit swithches and a spindle control later on so this will add to the cost a little.

Only other things I will be doing differently is probably putting some aluminum ange to reinforce the table as the 60 or so inches it spans is to much for the little support it has. May upgrade to a different lead screw to get better performance and as I mentioned, may rework the z axis.

For a first machine, I am very impressed with myself and for others, this can truly be a budget machine in my opinion. I spent about 25 bucks a week on stuff. It is easily enough to keep you busy. Great hobby.

Hack
04-02-2005, 12:00 PM
Probably the biggest problem that I have with this machine is that it is slow!!! I have a lot of whip with the 1/4 -20 all thread on the x and y axis so I am considering upgrading to 1/2 - 13. I already have this laying around.

Unfortunately I have not been able to find a coupler to attach the 1/2" allthread to a 1/4" stepper shaft. Does anyone make this? I am trying to avoid the expense of having the rod turned down as I do not have a lathe.

Am I correct by assuming I should get about 35% faster rapids?

Thanks

2muchstuff
04-02-2005, 12:52 PM
You are corect in your assumption of 35% faster speeds. As for the coupler, find a coupler with 1/2" ends on both sides. To couple it to motor, find something to sleeve it with, 1/2" on the outside and 1/4" on the inside. Drill a hole the size of the set screw clear thru one side of the sleeve. Assemble and tighten the set screw against the motor shaft. The tighter the fit of the sleeve the better.