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View Full Version : Supermax Rebel 1, ATC crash, broke the carousel in 3 pieces, cause unknown, help



BNR_RANDY
04-14-2016, 12:05 PM
Last night I was finishing up a part on my Vertical maching center, YCM supermax rebel 1with Fanuc 0MC control (1995). The last tool finished and I always program a tool change back to tool 1 at the end of the program. As soon as the coolant turned off, I opened the door, no lock, and started blowing off the chips and coolant. I was looking down at the table and not watching what was going on, heard a loud bang and tools and pieces started flying. All came to rest with the spindle empty, 5 tools on the table and chip pan, 2 pieces of carousel in the pan, display reading tool 2, and me with a confused look. Power surge? relay hanging up? switch failure?

I am going to run it as a 14 tool machine for now, since I have no idea what went wrong. Any ideas on what to check?

mactec54
04-14-2016, 04:33 PM
BNR_RANDY

Check your program it sounds like it tried to put another tool where there was already a tool, this is a common mistake, when the machine puts a tool on top of another tool, you should not do this in your program sooner or later you will make a mistake and this is what will happen, It does not save any time by doing this, that's an expensive crash, it can also happen when someone is loading tools into the magazine or carousel

BNR_RANDY
04-18-2016, 09:29 AM
Program was previously run. No problems with the program. Machine was running tool 15, at the end of the program I do a T1M6 then a M30. After the crash tool 15 was back in the carousel where is should be, the rest is described below. NO tools were placed by hand, all changes were done through the program.

mactec54
04-18-2016, 09:59 AM
Program was previously run. No problems with the program. Machine was running tool 15, at the end of the program I do a T1M6 then a M30. After the crash tool 15 was back in the carousel where is should be, the rest is described below. NO tools were placed by hand, all changes were done through the program.

All of what you just posted would not crash or break the tool changer like it did unless it was trying to put a tool on top of another one, this is what usually happens when you get a breakage like this

No one said any tools were being placed/loaded by hand, this is what can happen also when tools are being loaded by hand, it was obvious that your machine was running a program when it happened

cncdan
04-21-2016, 10:40 PM
We had the same thing happen on a Takumi VMC where I used to work. The cause was due to the BT40 tool taper sticking in the spindle taper (similar to the way a morse taper locks into a mating taper). The tools would occasionally jam and 99.9% of the time just pop out with a bit of a jolt... but on at least 2 occasions the carousel umbrella couldn't take the pressure and snapped much like you described. We had a local welder weld it back together, it was a bit out of alignment but it worked until it snapped again. Then we bought a new carousel.
Obviously BT40 taper is not supposed to lock into the mating taper, but perhaps the spindle taper angle is slightly out of spec...? All of our various tools would stick on occasion in this one machine, but same tools would not stick in the other two machines with the same taper. Therefore the most likely culprit on our machine was the spindle taper.
Possibly you have a similar issue...?

BNR_RANDY
04-30-2016, 02:36 PM
I have the machine apart now to weld it back together. At least a temp fix until I can replace the carousel. I have a feeling the cause was a wrench that fell off the top of the machine earlier in the day, I believe it knocked tool one out of place, or maybe just cocked in the carousel. The other guy here says no, but all tool changes since then have been fine, so I do not think it was a stuck relay or switch. What a PITA changing all my programs to not use the missing tool positions. Three cheers for the Miller square wave 300!

BNR_RANDY
08-24-2017, 08:31 AM
We had the same thing happen on a Takumi VMC where I used to work. The cause was due to the BT40 tool taper sticking in the spindle taper (similar to the way a morse taper locks into a mating taper). The tools would occasionally jam and 99.9% of the time just pop out with a bit of a jolt... but on at least 2 occasions the carousel umbrella couldn't take the pressure and snapped much like you described. We had a local welder weld it back together, it was a bit out of alignment but it worked until it snapped again. Then we bought a new carousel.
Obviously BT40 taper is not supposed to lock into the mating taper, but perhaps the spindle taper angle is slightly out of spec...? All of our various tools would stick on occasion in this one machine, but same tools would not stick in the other two machines with the same taper. Therefore the most likely culprit on our machine was the spindle taper.
Possibly you have a similar issue...?

I had tools sticking in the spindle some time before this crash happened. I fixed the problem. The tool unclamp cylinder should not only release the tool it should pop it free of the taper. On my machine the bolt came loose that adjusts the knock-out/release. Properly adjusting that bolt fixed the tool sticking problem. I had tried cleaning the spindle and different tool holders in different locations all to no avail.