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winchdoc
05-22-2006, 03:54 PM
I have a Cincinnati Milacron 5VC 750 with the Acramatic 900 control, and I want to run some long engraving programs. I have a dedicated PC to serve as the DNC host, but I cannot seem to get it to work as a drip feed.

I use the pc to load programs into the machine memory, but the machine memory is too small.

Can someone point me to a resource for the correct machine paramater settings, and host settings. I'm using SmartCam communicate which has served well for loading into memory, but the drip feed thing eludes me.

Thanks in advance

Doug

Al_The_Man
05-22-2006, 05:15 PM
This may be close http://www.cadem.com/ncnet/dnc-details-files-41/acramatic-850sx.pdf
Al.

winchdoc
05-22-2006, 05:48 PM
Thanks for the link. I notice on the .pdf they say, "drip feed not available on this controller" This is not comforting... They go on to mention settings for DNC.

Is DNC and drip feed different? Does dripfeed have some sort of buffer load or something?

I've been around CNC stuff for a long time but never used DNC so my nomenclature may need some updating.

I also wonder why they don't list the acramatic 900 control, CM made a lot of them.

Doug

Al_The_Man
05-22-2006, 09:06 PM
DNC is 'Distributed Numeric Control' where the information is passed to several machines as in a network.
Unfortunately there is also another definition using DNC (Direct Numeric control) which refers to the program being stored on the host and drip fed to the machine.
Cadem use the first definition.
Drip feed loads the machine buffer with program segments as needed.
The listings of machine details they show has been contributed by users of their software, so it may just be that no one has bothered to confirm with them what para. and hardware work with the 900, if it was not changed greatly from 850 to 900 there is a good chance it will be the same, you may have to confirm this from a differnent source or from other users here.
Al.

winchdoc
05-27-2006, 03:20 PM
I had some success getting my SmartCam communicate to interface with my Acramatic 900 v2.

Using the Data Line feature, I can get the PC to send code to the controller, and it will execute the commands, but it appears that the PC does not wait for the controller to finish running each line of code. I read somewhere else on this forum that I should consider adding line delays, or character delays to my PC send paramaters.

I'm very encouraged with this progress. Can someone point me to more information on adding these delays?

Doug

Pophamrt1
06-13-2006, 02:04 PM
Siemens provides a specific DNC program for the Acramatic 850/900 controls called "DCdnc." I think its up to version 3.2. Its a terminal program that includes drip feed, file transfer, etc, from fully integrated menus within the Acramatic control. Effectively you gain full control over unlimited nc file space, size, etc. on the PC's hard drive, USB, CD, even network. All from new screens that appear under the Acramatic's "Terminal" screen. Pretty trick piece of software and bulletproof... reliable enough to run lights-out for days at a time with virtually unlimited nc file size.

Third-party dnc programs don't get along very well with the Acramatic controls. The protocols used for buffer memory management are slightly different. Whereas Siemens dcDNC uses a very robust buffer management protocol, the newer programs use a somewhat less-robust (Windows-based) buffer protocol. The result is buffer "overload" and "timeout" error messages when trying to smoothly using these third-party dnc programs with the Acramatic.

The dcDNC software can be downloaded from files section, including instructions, cable schematics, etc., under the Yahoo Acramatic Control Users Group (ACUGroup)...

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ACUGroup/

BTW, I'm not affiliated with Siemens or Cincinnati. Just an Acramatic 850SX owner (Cincinnati Sabre 1000 VMC) who's been enjoying the dcDNC software's unlimited file size and run time on a very solid machine.

winchdoc
06-14-2006, 11:15 AM
Thanks, Pophamart1, that looks like just what I'm looking for. I have subscribed to the group, but it is listed as 'pending'. the list also looks relativly new. I hope I can get approved soon so I can check out the software you mentioned.

Doug

meckardt55
12-29-2006, 12:01 AM
I would suggest that you invest in a " behind the tape reader" or (BTR) from Greco. This will let you run your programs from a standard PC disk as if it were a tape. I have installed several of the " Greco Box" and "CNC Stations" on machines with the 900 control for the same reasons that you have. You can also have your 900 load tapes converted to disk and load them through the Greco.

meckardt55
12-29-2006, 12:03 AM
We service all Cincinnati Milacron machines, look us up on the web at cncmachineservices.com

vpcnc
12-30-2006, 02:25 PM
For older CNC's that don't support true DNC or Drip Feed, I also recomend either a Greco MTIC or a Greco MiniFile, Both provide BTR function.
The MTIC interfaces directly to a PC via RS-232, while the MiniFile is a Floppy Drive unit.

Fairbanks
02-14-2007, 12:20 PM
Are you people serious, is that Greco crap even around anymore?

grweldon
02-14-2007, 01:12 PM
Greco IS still around, but there is still a BUNCH of old, existing Greco equipment in many thousands of shops.

I don't want to hijack the thread, but I have a Monarch VTC150 with an Acramatic 900 control. It reads block-by-block directly from the tape reader and has no internal memory for program storage.

I need to be able to communicate with this machine, but it has no serial port at all that I can find. The manufacture date of the machine is 1976 (no flames please)

I thought this subject was related enough to post in this thread, if not, I'll delete the post and create my own thread....BUT....can anybody enlighten me?

Thanks...

Al_The_Man
02-14-2007, 01:30 PM
Your Post came at an opportune time, I am just in the process of converting a 900 to BTR, almost as we speak, because of reader problems loading the executive tapes.
There are a few manufacturers out there and I have narrowed it down to a couple, based on feedback I have recieved from other forums.
Hopefull I will have something working in a couple of days If you can wait until I have done, I will update this post.
Al.

Fairbanks
02-14-2007, 01:33 PM
Call Manfred Strasser @ 847 844 3460
DLoG Shop Floor Data Management
He can get you squared away with BTR and software to communicate
www.dlogsfdm.com
Just a suggestion

grweldon
02-14-2007, 01:48 PM
AL, you ARE THE MAN! I'll check back frequently for updates!

meckardt55
03-05-2007, 10:42 PM
The A900 control did not come with a standard bi-directional Rs232. It did come with a RS232 looking plug , but this was for punch output only. The bi-directional RS 232 was an option. If you do not see the word " Data Line " on the main display, it does not have this option. As I stated above, you would need a " behind the tape reader " or BTR from GRECO or some other company. I have used the MINIFILE, and the CNC STATION on many 900 controls. This is about the only way, short of making a tape, that you have to load programs in the control. Look us up on the web cncmachineservices.com

meckardt55
03-05-2007, 10:46 PM
You can also convert your control load tapes to disk in a " .bin " file format and load them through your BTR, thus, eliminating the need for the tape reader altogether.

winchdoc
03-06-2007, 11:02 PM
My A900 control has the data line feature. I use it to load a program into the small memory and run it from there. Is there a way to get the data line feature to drip feed a larger contour program file?

Doug

meckardt55
03-07-2007, 08:33 AM
NO, the standard 900 control does not have the drip feed ability. You would need to go BTR with a Greco unit. THe control would think that it is reading a tape, but it would be comming from a disk. Look up Greco on the web

Mudflap
04-05-2007, 11:59 AM
Greco is not your only option for BTRs. I have BTRs on 2 900 controls, one is no longer made, the other is from JNL Industries aka Cimnet in Robesonia PA.
http://www.cimnetinc.com/dncprofessional_hardware4.htm
We like the Cimnet unit, it has it's own remote control panel. There are plenty of others available, just google BTR. The downside of a BTR is that it will only transfer data as fast as the original tape reader, if you are doing engraving or complicated geometry with lots of short segments data starvation will limit your feed rate - we can only engrave at 15 to 20 IPM through the BTR.

grweldon - are you sure you have a 900? I didn't think they were made in '76, and I thought 900s all had internal memory. You might have a Big Blue control, in which case you still can run it with a BTR.

jrchapman
09-24-2008, 09:28 PM
The A900 control did not come with a standard bi-directional Rs232. It did come with a RS232 looking plug , but this was for punch output only. The bi-directional RS 232 was an option. If you do not see the word " Data Line " on the main display, it does not have this option. As I stated above, you would need a " behind the tape reader " or BTR from GRECO or some other company. I have used the MINIFILE, and the CNC STATION on many 900 controls. This is about the only way, short of making a tape, that you have to load programs in the control. Look us up on the web cncmachineservices.com

Is this unit still available for retrofit? or is it not economically wise compared to the BTR??

charlesrgraves
02-14-2009, 08:37 AM
Your correct about the "dcdnc32". The only problem is that it prefers to run in the old DOS envirorment. (I still miss my old DOS)
I have been trying for a week to get to run from XP. I can download files but continious feed does not work. I suspect that DOS has direct control of I/O ports while windows does not allow this. If anyone has had success running dcdnc32 drip feed from XP I would like to hear from them.