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Halfnutz
06-08-2005, 11:41 PM
Well I finally feel like Ive got a decent start. I spent the weekend and this afternoon finishing up the Z axis, so now all thats left is the X and Y screws, and a control system. It has been fun, but dont let anyone fool you, this type of machine takes a lot of patience and hard work. I have pics of the whole build to date, I will add them as I have time. Here is how it sits at this point.

Footprint 25x38
Travel 22x32
Z axis has full 8 inches of travel and can be set for full 8 inches of clearance.

Total Cost:

Linear guides THK SR15TB 2 sets X&Y axis ebay 120.00
Linear guides THK HSR15VM & 4 cars Z axis ebay 25.00
2 50 inch rolled ballscrews w/ double preload nuts 200.00
1 12 inch Kirk screw w/ acetal nut Z axis 25.00
3 Centent CNO 162 drives (like gecko, but better) 180.00
45 v 8A, & 12 5A Power supply 35.00
3 nema 23 Slo Syn steppers 50.00
Aluminum 100.00

Total so far $ 750.00

svenakela
06-09-2005, 04:08 AM
Hmm... Shouldn't you rotate the z-axis horizontally 180 degrees? As I see it the z-axis should move when you raise the mill, but as I look at the picture the alu plate isn't going to move at all?

Halfnutz
06-09-2005, 04:11 AM
Sure it moves, like a charm.

Splint
06-09-2005, 05:03 AM
Yes it moves like a charm but the way it is set up at the moment there is overhang with the stationary (base) componant. If you turn it around the other way so that the smaller square section is stationary and the long rectangular section is the moving (up and down) section you will dramatically increase your usable z travel and z clearance.

Splint

svenakela
06-09-2005, 05:21 AM
Exactly, by rotating it your z-axis it's not in the way as I tried to illustrate in the picture. It looks like a really nice machine, but it with a minor change it could be even better. :)

Cheers,
Sven

Halfnutz
06-09-2005, 05:26 AM
Yes I could do that if I wanted to but it would be easier to just bolt a plate to the front and move it up all the way. That is why I designed it this way. I have up to 8 full inches of Z and 8 full inches of Z travel. Its designed to be adjustable. When cutting 2D work it is best to have the moment of force the weight as low as possible. If I need extra height I can put a longer plate on the front and move the whole axis up with four screws. But yes, your right, I could easily turn it around and accomplish the same thing.

JavaDog
06-09-2005, 07:13 AM
Thanks you for the pictures! You just helped me figure out a problem I was having with my Z-Axis.

Is your gantry all 1/2in aluminum?

mxtras
06-09-2005, 09:33 AM
Mr. Nutz -

Very nice looking stuff! I like the simplicity and the craftsmanship.

Excellent work. Are you having a blast, or what? It looks like it!!

Scott

Halfnutz
06-09-2005, 09:35 AM
Pretty much, the plate I get are remnants and are all different, but I tried to stay around .5", except the two bearing blocks are 1.25 in. Yes Im having a blast, look at this mess!

mxtras
06-09-2005, 10:25 AM
2 things, Mr Nutz -

You are profiling all of those plates on that mill? Nice work!

You said that the aluminum was $100????? Total???? That is awesome - it appears like you have several hundred $$ just in plate - not to mention the extrusion. Good grab! I need to consult with you on raw material purchasing - any pointers?

I like your mess - looks like a really good time...

Scott

Halfnutz
06-11-2005, 12:05 AM
Allright, I got the leadscrew for my X axis pretty much done, so all is left is the Y axis and a couple of bearing blocks. I'm hoping to have it done by monday. I am such a burn out. I spent all day (well all afternoon) trying to figure out why my lathe wouldnt cut this screw, and then today I went down and was turning it on when I realized that I had been trying to turn the screw in reverse the whole time. Four hours of scratching my head over that one. Once I turned it on the right way it cut through it like butter. And Scott, I get my plate at Industrial Metal Supply in Santa Anna, CA for 2.00 a lb. Its scrap, but theres nothing wrong with it. The guy at the counter was telling me that K2 gets there aluminum there also.

DieGuy
06-11-2005, 09:27 AM
3 Centent CNO 162 drives (like gecko, but better) 180.00


Better, talk to me! Gotta link for these?

Halfnutz
06-12-2005, 01:32 AM
Centents come up on ebay occasionally. Thats where I got mine. They were designed by the same guy, Marrisse, that designed the Geckos, from what Ive heard. They are 500.00 new for some crazy reason. I spent two months working ebay to get this set, its not easy, but they are there occasionally. I got my X axis done. It turned out really well. with full travel, no binding, angular contact bearings and an adjustable pre-load that works great. I can move it with two fingers the entire way with no bad spots anywhere. All thats left is the Y axis lead screw ( that one has been driving me nuts, trying to design it cleanly ) and mounting the motors, but I need to get a couple of belts before I mount them, probably middle of next week.

CNCRob
06-12-2005, 09:03 AM
Your router looks great, Very professional looking!

ger21
06-12-2005, 11:02 AM
3 Centent CNO 162 drives (like gecko, but better) 180.00


I wouldn't necessarily say better. Similar, yes. But I think Geckos are a more refined design. I could be wrong though. But if you can get the Centent's cheaper, it's a good choice.

One problem I see is that you may have some flex with your Z-axis hanging down like that. How much can you get it to flex if you push on the bottom?

Halfnutz
06-12-2005, 06:55 PM
The Z axis is set up so that is can be positioned all the way up for tall work, with full 8 inches of travel and clearance, or all the way down, as it is now just to keep it out of the way, for light load high speed engraving. It doesn't flex at all, but I doubt I will use it in this position much. Once I get everything else done I will probably position it around halfway, with four inches of clearance and travel. It only takes four hex heads to move it. I thought about this alot, and came to this design, because if it was set to allways have a full 8 inches of clearance, there would be times when the fulcrum would be too high and cause unneccesary torque on the bearings. And the motor would be sticking up twenty inches off the table all the time. Like I said most of the time it will be in a mid oposition, four inches higher than where it is now. If it turns out that this is too high, I can easily whack 2-3 inches off of the hieght, but I thought this was worth a try.

Yes, I know the geckoes are actually a newer ( and maybe better )version of the centent. Im just trying to rustle some feathers. But they cost three times as much, and there service is lousy, so they must be better!

Allmost done, just need pulleys for my motors and belts so I can mount them and get cutting!

Halfnutz
06-16-2005, 02:53 AM
Wow, I tweaked and adjusted the ballscrew preload, and moved the gantries dead end bearing block on it's ballscrew end cause it seemed like it was binding a little. Everything is so smooth now, no grinding or binding, I can push by hand both axis (not Z - its got an acetal nut) from stop to stop, and the ballnut just whizzes effortlessly, even with a decent preload. I'm really happy with the way its gone (so far). Tomorrow I'l get my drive pulleys and belts and I should be dancing a little jig with it by the weekend. Ive got a couple diferent routers to try, but I geusse I'll stick to the Porter Cable to start with. I thought about adding these linear bearings and rods for the Z axis to help suport it when its in the bottom position. These can come off one at a time as the slide goes up. I'm thinking of three mounting positions. One, all the way down with both rods as shown, One three inches higher with just one rod, and all the way up without either rods.

Halfnutz
06-25-2005, 05:46 PM
Well, its basically done, Ive got it cutting air hooked up to a HobbyCNC controller while I build the controller for it, and it works fine. I may add another support for the Z axis once I get cutting and see if it flexes any, but it seems really ridgid, so it may be fine the way it is. I still have to make some router mounts also, but right now I'm focusing on the controller. I'm running TurboCNC on an old laptop and plan on upgrading to Mach2 soon also. TurboCNC works OK, I geusse, I just dont like using it. Its like word processing on an XT with PCWrite in 1982. Mach2 looks so nice, I cant wait to get another CPU for the garage, maybe this week I hope. I think Id give up CNC if I had to use a dos system forever!

Halfnutz
06-26-2005, 02:19 PM
Wow! This thing is awesome! Even with these little motors and the 2 to 1 gearing on X and Y I can move it along at 200 IPM, but I settled on 120 IPM for X and Y, it seems to run real comfortably there. No binding, no grinding, full travel smooth and true, the motors are noisey but run cool. Man, it is so neet to watch this thing I built from scratch moving around and making all the trippy noises. Ive been running a couple different programs Ive got for engraving stuff, but I need to get busy writing some larger geography for this thing. The total cost ends up right around 1000.00 total, including the controller I have yet to put together, less than a third of what K2 wants for there's this size, and they dont even include controls or motors. I am so glad I built this thing, it has been a blast. If anyone needs help or wants to copy this design I would be glad to help anyway I can.

santiniuk
06-26-2005, 03:30 PM
Halfnutz,

Although I missed the progress of this build I have read back through the thread and just want to congratulate you. It looks the business. Really well made.

I'm only a beginner at cnc stuff and I'm learning new methods of assembly from posts like this.

Please continue the thread showing some of the stuff you can cut. A lot of build reports seem to end once they are built but I like to see what type of stuff each machine can do.

Well done

Halfnutz
06-26-2005, 08:04 PM
Thanks Santiniuk.
Well I love this stuff because I learn something all the time. I was wrong about the 120IPM I thought I was moving at. I was looking at the TurboCNC menue and thats what it said, but I didnt have the thing scaled correctly. TurboCNC is a really good product, and performs well, I just cant get used to the old interface and the DOS environment. So, anyway, after rescaling it apears, according to TurboCNC that the fastest I can go with these motors is around 60IPM. Over that and they start shutting down. I dont know whether this is considered slow or fast, but it sure looks fast to me. I cant see going any faster, but I think some machines do.

I printed out the Centent CNO142/143 manual and I'm reading it. It must have been written by Marrise, the Geckoe guy. It has a ton of info in it, and I'm learning a lot about how these steppers run. The whole world of motor control/performance is very complicated, there are so many variables to consider, its impossible to make this subject simple. I am looking forward to experimenting with the Centent controllers I got off ebay. I have two sets, one of the CNO142's and one of the CNO162's. Its a little overkill to use these with these motors, but I am anxious to see how microstepping performance compares to full and half stepping. If you think you know everything about steppers, your not looking very hard.

mxtras
06-27-2005, 09:37 AM
Very nice looking machine - very clean and to the point.

Congratulations, Mr. Nutz!!

Scott

wisp
06-27-2005, 10:31 AM
Nice work, machine looks great. Let us know how it cuts!

ViperTX
06-27-2005, 01:21 PM
Pretty much, the plate I get are remnants and are all different, but I tried to stay around .5", except the two bearing blocks are 1.25 in. Yes Im having a blast, look at this mess!

What width are the verticals (spacing of the y-axis) trucks.

Halfnutz
06-27-2005, 07:09 PM
The rails on the Y axis are 3.5" apart, on a 6" wide piece of 1/2" plate, and the Z axis rails are 2 3/4" apart on a 5" wide piece of 1/2" plate. The trucks are 2 or 3 inches apart from each other.

santiniuk
06-28-2005, 09:38 AM
Halfnutz,

I have only used my machine in microstepping mode. I think you will be impressed how smooth they sound in microstepping mode compared to full step.

I understand there is a trade off with microstepping and torque / missing steps but have not seen this issue yet.

60IPM is still going some rate, so I wouldn't worry about that. Still learning Mach2 / 3 here but from what I have seen so far I'm pleased with the purchase.

Show us action :)

Halfnutz
07-03-2005, 01:48 PM
First testing of machine looks good. This is the beginning of a vacume table I'm attempting. From what I've seen its not too complicated, a matter of partitioning 2 or 3 zones and plumbing them in to a vacume.

The machine looks like it will cut great, this was done just by taping a sharpie to the Z axis. I need to decide which router I'm going to use, I may use one that I allready own, but I'm thinking of buying a DeWalt laminate trimmer, they have one with a nice base on it that will bolt right to the plate on the router table. I dont think I'll need anything more powerfull than that for what I'm going to be doing with this thing.

For information's sake, this was done in 3 mins 40 sec., at a cutting rate of 70.4 IPM

Happy 4th everyone!!!

Ozinus
07-03-2005, 02:16 PM
Looks really good, are you getting any flex in the gantry uprights?
May be ok if like you say you are only using a laminate trimmer.

Oz

Halfnutz
07-03-2005, 02:42 PM
I cant move it with my hand unless I really push hard, and then it only slightly deflects, but time will tell, I have an extra 22 inch linear guide and two blocks, I think it is the wide 12mm, which is actually 22 mm wide, so if I need to its no problem adding an extra guide, but from what Ive seen I dont think it will be necessary. Like you said though it depends on what Im cutting and how deep and fast I go. I still need to raise the Z axis a couple of inches anyway, in order to get 4-5 inches clearance. I think once its raised it will really be stiff and unneccesary to add anything. DeWalt has that laminate trimmer with the two sided base, it looks like it was made for bolting to a slide. I dont know what the specs or price's are on them, any one ever use one of those?

Halfnutz
07-03-2005, 10:21 PM
I started using my HobbyCNC box in 16 microstep mode, and was just amazed at the difference between half and 1/16 steping. I was wondering about some feedback on the diference between 16 microsteps and 256 microsteps per step, like on the high resolution drivers. Is there a significant difference? Do you even notice any difference when using that resolution?

Halfnutz
07-06-2005, 02:59 PM
Ready to start cutting, but I gotta go to work. I decided to use this little 11 amp, 1.5 HP router that I have. I started making mounts for a Porter Cable, but my boring bar wont cut any larger than the 3.3 inches that this thing is. The Porter Cable's are a full 3.5 inches in diameter. Thinking about it, I dont know why I didn't just bore it on the lathe, oh well. I hope this Milwaulkie has enough guts. I'll find out this evening, after work.

Man this is stuff is all consuming. I havent even gotten the Harley out this year yet, I've been so involved in CNC. Thats pretty lame, a brand new Hog just sitting there, 'cause I cant stand to pry myself away from the CNC machines! Crazy! I must be half nuts. It sure is alot of fun thiough, and some day I hope to be making parts for Harley's with a CNC machine. I can get cheap blank points, clutch, tranny and air filter covers from China and custom engrave them, then have them re-chromed and sell them at swap meets.

I'll post again in a day or so with my first actual cuttings.

Came home for lunch, I couldn't wait.......

the_paco
07-06-2005, 09:12 PM
Great work Halfnutz! :wave:

A word of advice, stay with the Milwaukee brand; the PC 7518 is a problem(s)... (wedge)

The Milwaukee 5625-29 (3.5 HP) is a MUCH better tool. :boxing:

I have both and I don't use the PC anymore on the CNC router...:nono:

Halfnutz
07-11-2005, 10:50 PM
HELP! I am trying to figure out a decent way of holding 1/8 in. or 3/16 in. endmill shanks in my 1/4 in. router collet. I tried making something today, but I dont trust it and would like to see what others have done instead of re-inventing the wheel.

LeeWay
07-12-2005, 08:44 AM
Congrats from here on your build as well. Nice job. I see some nicely thought throughdesign in this one. :)

I don't remember where I got them, but I ordered some 1/8" cutters from somewhere (possibly Mcmaster Carr) and they actually came with 1/4" collets. If you are using the PC rather than the Millwalkee, you can use some 1/2" brass to make the collets yourself. I made some like this for 3/16" mills and it works fine. Granted, I only use this home made collet in my Mini-mill and not the router, but you could make several and use the one with the least runout. Mine doesn't seem to have any. I just drilled it using a my mini-lathe.
Other than that, I try to order mills with 1/4" or 1/2" shanks.

buscht
07-12-2005, 09:02 AM
Here's a collet adaptor.
http://www.porter-cable.net/porcab4214to.html

ViperTX
07-12-2005, 01:34 PM
Halfnutz....how are you driving the z-axis....is there something that goes over the top of the gantry? Show us a pic from the other side of the gantry. Thanks, Paul

Halfnutz
07-12-2005, 06:28 PM
Great Buscht, thats exactly it! I had asked at a local tool distributor and they were clueless, and they carry Porter Cable!

Viper these pics should detail it.

The ballnut threads into the plate, it should probably have a lockwasher, but it hasnt moved any so far.

The motor attaches to one plate with threaded holes and long screws, and the screws go through the other plate with oversize holes so the motor can be adjusted up or down, and then nuts on the screws tighten up the assembly, the cap nuts are like locknuts.

tauscnc
07-12-2005, 07:37 PM
Hey Halfnutz,

Awesome work man! The machine looks great! Glad to see it's working. I can't even imagine the amount of work you have put it into it.

Good job

taus
www.cuttingedgecnc.com

ViperTX
07-12-2005, 07:46 PM
Halfnutz...thanks for the additional pics...looks are you doubled up on the motor support...

Halfnutz
07-13-2005, 12:16 AM
Just a couple of pics, uit seems people ( I know I do) like seeing them. Note the temporary dust control with belt sander belt for skirt. This is a must, the dust control. Anyone building should keep it in mind, eventually you will want some type of dust collection.
The machine is cutting nice, but calibrating is a pain ( I still havent got it 100% ) because of the funky pullet ratio I have. So the X and Y axis drift out of calibration as it runs.

bkinman
05-18-2006, 01:16 PM
I dig this machine... big time. I will definitely be looking at it when i build my machine.

Halfnutz
05-18-2006, 01:29 PM
Its basically a copy of the K2 machines. I got it running right again, thank god. I had the router plugged into the same circuit as the contrller, and the computer into a diferent circuit. It was going crazy, just from that.

gotis
05-18-2006, 03:59 PM
Ready to start cutting, but I gotta go to work. I decided to use this little 11 amp, 1.5 HP router that I have. I started making mounts for a Porter Cable, but my boring bar wont cut any larger than the 3.3 inches that this thing is. The Porter Cable's are a full 3.5 inches in diameter. Thinking about it, I dont know why I didn't just bore it on the lathe, oh well. I hope this Milwaulkie has enough guts. I'll find out this evening, after work.

Man this is stuff is all consuming. I havent even gotten the Harley out this year yet, I've been so involved in CNC. Thats pretty lame, a brand new Hog just sitting there, 'cause I cant stand to pry myself away from the CNC machines! Crazy! I must be half nuts. It sure is alot of fun thiough, and some day I hope to be making parts for Harley's with a CNC machine. I can get cheap blank points, clutch, tranny and air filter covers from China and custom engrave them, then have them re-chromed and sell them at swap meets.

I'll post again in a day or so with my first actual cuttings.

Came home for lunch, I couldn't wait.......


Hehe! got mine out a month ago. :p

Bowman
05-18-2006, 06:33 PM
Very nice work Halfnutz. I have been thinking about my Z axis setup and trying to decide whether or not I want to make it where I can move the whole plate attachment on the slide itself up and down like you have yours. Or I might just go ahead and space another mounting hole below the top mounts on the gantry legs to just drop the whole Y axis down while leaving the Z in place.

My main objective is to be able to fit a 40" wood lathe on the table as a 4th axis and still have most of its working swing area free to mount stock for cutting. I will not have to go deeper than the centerline of the 4th axis for any cutting. But if I were to leave everything mounted that high for table level cutting I think the fulcrum affect would be magnified. This should keep things as low and stiff as possible for normal use and having the extra gantry leg sticking off the top shouldn't be an issue.

So many design choices to consider its great to have so many others trials/failures and successes to use as a basis for designing. Again nice work, well done. :cheers:

Bowman

jhowelb
12-21-2007, 04:00 AM
You, sir, know how to build a machine! Good looking job, I'm jealous!

corrie
02-12-2008, 03:13 PM
Very nice job , congrats . I,m in the middle of a rebuild and asking some advice. for starters what is the hieght of your gantry from bottom plate to the top.I,m just trying to figure out what to make mine. my machine was driven from one side only and was giving me a bit of a problem so I,m deciding to put the X-drive down the middle like yours. here are some pics of what it looked like and where it stands now . I,m going to use as much of the old machine as posible. Any advice would be apreciated and any specs you would like to share would be very appreciated.I, ve got a make shift drawing of what I see in my mind and it,s kinda like your machine. Thanks Corrie, cheers.

Halfnutz
02-12-2008, 09:18 PM
I measured the total length of the side plate and its 20 inches, but to be honest if I did it again I would make them shorter. Sometimes it flexes and I have never needed the extra height. When I first made the machine I thought the extra height would be useful but honestly I have never needed it and it creates vibrations when cutting some materials like aluminum. I'm building another one and I am making the side plates much shorter. The most Z height I've ever needed was a couple of inches.

corrie
02-12-2008, 09:53 PM
Thanks for the responce . What else will be different about your new build besides the gantry sides and what will become of your old machine,cheers.

Halfnutz
02-12-2008, 11:12 PM
Well, I'm still using the machine, it works fine so I didn't tear it apart. The new one I'm working on is a larger format, about 36'' wide by 50'' long with motors on both sides of the long axis. Ive got two Yaskawa 200 Watt ac drives and motors with absolute encoders that have batteries so they remember thier position one for each side. The idea is to be able to set it over a piece of plywood and work a section of a full sheet. I have the gantry and z axis done I'm just stuck on driving the long axis without having a screw underneath, exactly what you had problems with. I dont know weather I'll end up running two belts or two racks yet. Here are some pictures of what I've done so far, but I kinda got stuck with these absolute encoders. Just wiring them and setting up the drives is crazy.

corrie
02-12-2008, 11:29 PM
Well it looks like a fantastic start thats for sure, would like to help with the electronics but when it comes to that I,m not to keen.Seeings I already have a Y&Z assembly I thought of another way of doing my gantry, what do ya think.

Halfnutz
02-12-2008, 11:56 PM
That is similar to some really rigid designs I've seen and will give you the added height as well. Brace the inside of the corners and you will add even more stiffness!

Mr.Chips
02-13-2008, 02:54 AM
Very nice job , congrats . I,m in the middle of a rebuild and asking some advice. for starters what is the hieght of your gantry from bottom plate to the top.I,m just trying to figure out what to make mine. my machine was driven from one side only and was giving me a bit of a problem so I,m deciding to put the X-drive down the middle like yours. here are some pics of what it looked like and where it stands now . I,m going to use as much of the old machine as posible. Any advice would be apreciated and any specs you would like to share would be very appreciated.I, ve got a make shift drawing of what I see in my mind and it,s kinda like your machine. Thanks Corrie, cheers.

Nice machine you have there.:rainfro:
Are thoes bellows homemade? Sewn or glued?
Thanks for posting, do you have a build thread?

corrie
02-13-2008, 07:04 PM
Hello Mr Chips, the bellows were purchased, the material is like a neoprean inside with a weaved type material on the outside and are sowen. I don,t have a build log of this machine, but soon as I get some 1/2 inch toolling plate I,ll post as I go along.I finished tripple checking my measurements today and will be placing my order.? whats the difference between ball screw and lead screw? What would be best for my setup keeping in mind that I,ve previously run this machine for 6 to 8 hours at a time, cheers and thanks, by the way like what you are doing Mr. Nuts.

CNCfun&games
02-19-2008, 12:19 PM
Halfnutz,

Spend a lot of my time scrounging for aluminum & brass at IMS, Irvine (Santa Ana??)
Have you noticed how the prices of cut stock have been escelating?
DIX was always a better source for random cuts when they were in the area, but
since they moved to Huntington Beach I haven't used them. Do you know if they
have a surplus stock outlet at the new location?

Enjoy watching your thread, you are doing some real good stuff!!

W. Smith, Mission Viejo, CA

Halfnutz
02-19-2008, 01:24 PM
Thanks, CNCFun&Games, I haven't been doing much lately, but I probably turn on my machines and play around cutting air almost every day, I just love to watch and listen to the music.....

Yes IMS is where I shop usually and I have definately noticed the prices skyrocket. I remember when I built my first machine, I came home with so much metal it was great, for less than a hundred bucks I got an incredible amount of stuff. Now thats what they want for a couple of pieces of aluminum. I've never been to the place in Long Beach, is it any cheaper? Probably the same as everything is tied to price per pound that the metal's going for as scrap.

I would love to know of some scrap yards around here to rumage through, I bet there are a few in Santa Ana, but I dont know where.

Ebay is where I get most of my extrusions at, but 80/20 prices went through the roof as well over the last couple of years.

It probably has something to do with China buying so much raw goods.

corrie
03-01-2008, 10:47 AM
I must appologize,I feel that I have high-jacked this thread with my own rebuild log . How can I move my recent posts to my own thread, pictures and all, once agian sorry for budding in,thanks, Corrie.

diecutter
03-01-2008, 11:07 AM
HELP! I am trying to figure out a decent way of holding 1/8 in. or 3/16 in. endmill shanks in my 1/4 in. router collet. I tried making something today, but I dont trust it and would like to see what others have done instead of re-inventing the wheel.
__________________
Halfnutz

After much searching I went down to the local Sears hardware department and picked up a 1/4" to 1/8" adapter for about $8.00. It's intended for a Rotozip so it's rated for high rpm. Holds the bit with an Allen setscrew and seems acurate enough for most work.

joecnc2006
03-01-2008, 03:54 PM
a collet adapter woodcraft.com has them as well as most places that sells bits.