Want to buy 3 axis cnc mill for small engine parts

[Ironmancarbon]

Hello All, I have been looking for a decent small cnc machine for my application. I need one to cut small Engine connecting Rods, and other small engine parts. Classic aircooled volkswagen engine parts will be made as well. My budget is about 5-6k, but that is maximum and a machine that will do the job for less will obviously be the better choice. I have looked at www.cncmasters.com, but do not know if that is an overkill for my application. This will be my first cnc machine so I am looking for a nudge in the right direction. Thanks

[jalessi]

Welcome to the Zone.

What size con rods are you talking about? If you are talking about high performance VW rods a full size machine would really be the way to go.

Jeff...

[alexccmeister]

The cncmasters machines are beyond your budget if you look at buying tooling and stock materials as well. With 5k to 6k, there are alot of options you can go for. Please remember buying tools for your cnc mill can be more expensive than your cnc mill itself. So far tooling alone I have paid probably double what I paid for my mill.

Look at sieg X2, X3, taig or sherline. For small parts you are making, these mini and small mill should serve the purpose for you. Good luck.

[Ironmancarbon]

Originally Posted by alexccmeister The cncmasters machines are beyond your budget if you look at buying tooling and stock materials as well. With 5k to 6k, there are alot of options you can go for. Please remember buying tools for your cnc mill can be more expensive than your cnc mill itself. So far tooling alone I have paid probably double what I paid for my mill. Look at sieg X2, X3, taig or sherline. For small parts you are making, these mini and small mill should serve the purpose for you. Good luck.

I think the size of these you have mentioned would do the job, but how would they withstand under commercial use?

[alexccmeister]

I think some people here uses a few of the same machines to do repeated jobs. If you are into production run type shop, then your 5-6k may not even be enough. But as Jeff said, we need to know what it is exactly you are doing. When you say small parts, how small? Are you referring to scaled down engine parts as in hobby engine? If you can post some pictures, drawings or dimensions here or link to one if you can't post, some people here will be able to help you out.

[Ironmancarbon]

Originally Posted by alexccmeister I think some people here uses a few of the same machines to do repeated jobs. If you are into production run type shop, then your 5-6k may not even be enough. But as Jeff said, we need to know what it is exactly you are doing. When you say small parts, how small? Are you referring to scaled down engine parts as in hobby engine? If you can post some pictures, drawings or dimensions here or link to one if you can't post, some people here will be able to help you out.

This would be for a full size Aircooled Volkswagen engine (which is not very big at all) and parts to other small engines (motorcycles, atv, etc.) in the future.
Here are a couple of links to items in my store that I would like to manufacture at the moment:

About 2.5" wide
http://cgi.ebay.com/SCAT-VW-BUG-BUGG...742.m153.l1262

Again not bigger than 2.5"
http://cgi.ebay.com/SCAT-VW-TYPE-3-E...742.m153.l1262

About 5" wide
http://www.texasaircooled.com/store/...products_id=30

I would like to produce engine connecting rods, the rods range from ~5.4" (stock) to 5.7" (modified) in length.

Some measurements from my current source for them:
http://scatvw.com/ConnectingRods.htm

Here is a picture:
http://www.germansupply.com/home/ima...roductid=17415

Other items I would like to manufacture:

About 3" inches wide
http://store.bajasandrails.com/5760.html

Camshaft Gear, about 5.5" inches wide
http://scatvw.com/images/Camsha8.gif
http://scatvw.com/images/Camsha9.gif

Crankshaft Pulley, about 6.5" wide
http://scatvw.com/images/CrankP19.gif

There are other little parts I would like to manufacture, but I would like to keep it simple for now.

Thanks

[jalessi]

Forget about trying to manufacture connecting rods on a hobby machine for resale, the machining time it would require is astronomical.

You will be wasting your time.

Jeff...

[Ironmancarbon]

Originally Posted by jalessi Forget about trying to manufacture connecting rods on a hobby machine for resale, the machining time it would require is astronomical. You will be wasting your time. Jeff...

Would my original cnc pick do the job? If not now, I plan to manufacture engine parts. Despite my budget, I would like to know what will work for me. I saw www.magnificentmachine.com on the testimonials for cncmasters, they make engine connecting rods for corvair engines (Chevy's competition for Aircooled VW). The link is http://cncmasters.com/testimonials.htm Do you think one of their machines would do it for me? Thanks

[jalessi]

Why not spend your money on a used full size CNC machine?

Machining connecting rods require a very heavy accurate machine in order to do them on a production basis.

If you want to make one a day, go buy a small bench mill like you are talking about.

You will be painfully watching the hours tick by....

The importance of machine rigidity is very critical when it comes to speed and accuracy.

Ninety nine percent of the bench top machines wont hold .0005

The round column machine you are talking about has issues when the head is moved up or down, it will not stay indexed correctly.

There are fixes for it however most opt for a square column mill instead.

P.S. it would be nice to know your name

Jeff...

[Ironmancarbon]

Originally Posted by jalessi Why not spend your money on a used full size CNC machine? Machining connecting rods require a very heavy accurate machine in order to do them on a production basis. If you want to make one a day, go buy a small bench mill like you are talking about. You will be painfully watching the hours tick by.... The importance of machine rigidity is very critical when it comes to speed and accuracy. Ninety nine percent of the bench top machines wont hold .0005 The round column machine you are talking about has issues when to move the head up or down, it will not stay indexed correctly. There are fixes for it however most opt for a square column mill instead. P.S. it would be nice to know your name Jeff...

Thank you all for the advice, my name is Ricardo. Do you have any suggestions as to manufactures/setups to look for? Thanks

[jalessi]

Ricardo,

The venture you are thinking about requires evaluating all CNC machining equipment and processes before making any purchases.

If you jump the gun and buy anything, you are going to waste lots of money.

Good vendors may setup evaluation time and even run one of your parts if you are going to make a substantial purchase.

Do you have any idea about the equipment required and how long it takes to machine the parts you are thinking about?

Taking some time to work up a viable business plan may behoove you.

Scat sells connecting rods far cheaper than most could even think of making them, how do you plan on competing with them?

Several of the parts you sell are between $20-30 dollars, you wont make much money turning out only a few a day.

There is a big difference between a hobby, machining parts for fun and production.

The reason why I am not suggesting equiptment is because I personally don't think you have the budget required to get into the connecting rod business.

Maybe you should ask someone more qualified than me for better information.

Jeff...

[Ironmancarbon]

Originally Posted by jalessi Ricardo, The venture you are thinking about requires evaluating all CNC machining equipment and processes before making any purchases. If you jump the gun and buy anything, you are going to waste lots of money. Good vendors may setup evaluation time and even run one of your parts if you are going to make a substantial purchase. Do you have any idea about the equipment required and how long it takes to machine the parts you are thinking about? Taking some time to work up a viable business plan may behoove you. Scat sells connecting rods far cheaper than most could even think of making them, how do you plan on competing with them? Several of the parts you sell are between $20-30 dollars, you wont make much money turning out only a few a day. There is a big difference between a hobby, machining parts for fun and production. The reason why I am not suggesting equiptment is because I personally don't think you have the budget required to get into the connecting rod business. Maybe you should ask someone more qualified than me for better information. Jeff...

Jeff, You are correct. If this is true, I do not have the budget to compete with Scat. The reason I ask about acquiring cnc equipment, is I am currently working on a business plan for a loan from the SBA. Which could be a micro loan from 3rd party lender associated with the SBA (50k) or normal loan direct (around 100k or more), depending on how far I want to take it. This will not be something that can be done over night. I have been in contact with the SBA (http://scorehouston.org/) and they are currently helping me lay the foundation for my business plan. Finding out more information on manufacturing of parts would help me better situate what is possible with the loan and what is not. I really appreciate all of your help on this subject, as I am trying to better knowledge myself of manufacturing and the equipment that will be needed. MFG in general is what I was aiming for, whether it be crankshaft pulleys or connecting rods. SCAT started somewhere...