Hi llimis@hotmail
Im new to CNC milling and noticed the machine in question on ebay. Im wanting to use it to mill PCB's wth 0.05" SMD components as well as 0.1" DIP stuff. the secondry role will be milling holes/slots etc in aliminum faceplates and plastic cases. some questions.
1. Is the backlash problem something that can be easly rectified?
2. what spindle motor are you using?
3. is the spindle motor supplied up to much? can any one suggest a budget but good alternative (not a dremel).
4. I was thinking of using higher torque drive motors and 36/48 VDC power supply. any comments?
5 any general feedback on using this machine for my paticular applications would be good.
Happy new year to all
Ray
1. Yes,of course, if you spend money in another anti-backlash system, because the anti-backlash system that comes with the machine is very bad designed. Simply it doesn't work.
2. I use the same that you can see in the auction. 25000 rpm, very very noisy.
3. I think that the spindle cost me 70$.
4. The motors supplied with the machine are working very well. The problems of this machine are not the motors.
5. Sorry, I can't help you, I only use this machine to make pcb's.
Hi,
Have you tried milling PCB's with SMD mount components, 0.05" pad spacing, i took a look at the photo's you posted but these are 0.1" pads. just wondering if i have a chance of producing the larger footprint SMT stuff?
Thanks for the feedback
Ray
Originally Posted by llimis@hotmail.
I've got the machine a month ago. This machine has a big problem: their anti-backlash system sucks. It's made of two threads and a spring. The problem is that between the two threads are a lot of play (relatively). I've milled some pcb's. Horizontal an vertical lines are ok, but the angled ones are not straight (like waves). If you plan make pcb's with very fine tracks, forget this machine. If I can I'll post some photos.
Regards.
(sorry for my bad english)
I have asked seller about your question. The seller give me below that
you email to seller.
Hello!!
I just received your machine, but I have now 2 problems:
- Accidentally, I have broken the bearing of the X axis. The machine
runs OK without the bearing, but I want to replace it.
- The second problem, is that I the Z axis is not too deeper to reach
the table. I saw the vidoe of the machine working and I have noticed
that there is an adapter from the z-axis to the clip that holds the
mini-mill.
Can I buy the two items?, the bearing and the adapter. If the answer is
yes, send me the cost (including shipping costs) and if the answer is
no, can you indicate the dimensions and type of the bearing?
Best regards.
P.D.: Sorry for my bad bad english.
- llimis.
Have you disassemble this machine?
Your English is fine.
Are you sure that's the same machine as the one I'm talking about? The Sable 2015 from lukechan66 off eBay?
The reason I ask is because that setup you show doesn't look anything like mine. And I don't seem to have a problem with backlash. Not that I'm doing anything more right than you, or less wrong, or whatever... It just almost looks like we might be talking about two different machines.
Hi Skimask,
First off, i took a look at your video's on utube, thanks for taking the time to post them.
Now im very confused with the conflicting reports on this machine :-? i know i aint going to get the "space shuttle" of millers for this price but i do not want to lay out the cash for something that is useless.
1. what are your views on this machine?
2. have you done any PCB's yet? any picturers?
3. How is the supplied spindle motor?
4. the build quality looks good from what iv seen?
5. any negative points?
6. will it mill 0.5mm to 1.5mm aliminium?
Thanks in advance
Ray
The machine with the backlash problem does look to be a different machine altogether, from just looking at the pictures. For example, the Sable pictures posted here show a machine with ACME type leadscrews, whereas the picture of the machine with the backlash problem shows what looks like hardware store threaded rod.
My guess is that this is a case of mistaken identity, unless this problem machine is an older version, maybe.
Jeremy
Look at post #37...done on the 24th...3 days ago.
1 - I don't have any real views. I'm a Linux newb and a CNC newb. I'm not qualified to say it's a great machine or it's a piece of junk. It looks neat to me...but then again, a Tonka Truck looks neat to a 3 year old.
2 - again, post #37, done on the 24th, the day before Xmas, 3 days ago.
3 - see #2
4 - see #1
5 - see #1
6 - see #2
Could very well be. And like I said, I'm a serious newb! I don't know the difference between an ACME leadscrew and threaded rod!I would assume it's got something to do with the way the threads are cut in the rod itself.
I've got my Linux PC to load up correctly everytime and I can replicate that when I screw up my Linux load. I'm still trying to get Ubuntu 8.04 to work with my wireless and video card so I can get the updates for EMC2 loaded up.
Sable 2015 Video's
Your video's are very entertaining, the cat almost highjacked the show.
http://www.youtube.com/user/skimask87
Jeff...
Acme threads are trapezoidal in section, they look more square shouldered, with a flat'ish top. Standard threaded rod threads look triangular in section, with a rounded top to each thread.
The problem with using standard threaded rod is that the triangular thread form makes getting rid of backlash a bit harder, in some ways, the threads tend to be finer, leading to slower speeds, and the frictional losses tend to be greater.
The photos that you've posted, skimask, seem to show trapezoidal (acme type) threads on the leadscrews. The picture that llimis has posted clearly shows standard threaded rod as a leadscrew, which makes me think that these are two different machines.
Jeremy
I just took a harder look at the threads on my machine. Now I don't know what I've got. I compared my threads to a piece of 1/4x20 threaded rod I've got in the garage. The leadscrews I've got have a definite 'cap' on them, leading to that trapezoidal shape you spoke of, however, the 'cap' isn't very large at all, which might lead me to believe that they're actually the threaded rod. AND, the leadscrews I've got don't look much different from those other pictures. Might need a micrometer to figure it out for sure!
On my next trip out, I'll zoom in on the leadscrews a bit more and post that picture.
Hijacking kitty - ya, that cat 'hijacked' a 1/4x20 flanged lock nut of mine awhile back...$950 and 3 days in the 'cat hospital' later, I got the nut back! Seems that things like that don't pass thru digestive tracts too well.
New shots.
I have made some tunning to the machine and this is what I get now:
The wavey effect is less pronounced, but.... why the cutter cuts wider in the Y axis direction than the other directions?. The width of the track is not homogeneous. Anyone with milling experience can explain it to me?. This defect is more evident in the circles and in the pads.
Regards.
I'm not sure quite what your problem is, but can you confirm that the machine you have is actually the Sable 2015, sold by Lukechan on ebay, please?
One or two of us think that your machine might actually be a different model, so it would be helpful to know if this is the case.
Jeremy
Yes it is. When I unpacked the machine, the X leadscrew (under the moving table) loosen (sp?) from the coupler, crashing the bearing of the X-Axis. I did request replacement bearing from lukechan, and the machine was repaired. I have come to the conclusion that the spindle is not perfetly perpendicular to the table, and for this reason the width of the tracks are not homogeneous.
Regards.
Last edited by llimis@hotmail.; 12-30-2008 at 02:36 PM.
Thanks for that. I think you may be right about the spindle not being perpendicular. If it turns out to be this, then it should be fairly simple to fix.
Jeremy
Excellent videos on ebay. Will there be any more? Looks quite solid for the money. Similar to the widgetmaster but cheaper.
Can it cut alu or is it light use?
Freddean2006,
Plan on taking very light cuts if you are milling aluminum, the stock spindle motor is 230 watts and is equipped with a 6mm ".2364" inch capacity chuck.
The stepper motors are 60 ounce nema17, that is not very much holding power.
The Wigitmaster routers use nema 23 motors, they have 4 to 8 times the holding capacity.
The depth of cut will be very shallow.
Milling anything of substance will take a very long time to cut.
What do you plan on making?
Jeff...
I checked my Y-axis to make sure it was actually perpendicular to the table. It is. However, I'm glad the point was made about the couplers. I checked mine and 2 of the screws were a bit loose, the rest were tight. Also checked the rest of the nuts/bolts all the way around the machine. Everything else was tight. Had to re-spread the grease around a bit. I was spinning up the Y-axis as fast as it could go to find it's limit under no-load, and it started flinging grease!
Before I get crazy with this thing as start making a mess out of various PCBs, I'm trying to work out all of the functions of the controller board, the headers, extra pins, and so on, and I'm trying to figure out a good way to mount everything in an enclosure, add limit and home switches, and an E-stop switch, and a small panel for manual jogging of the 3 axis'. Going to add an extra set of limit switches on each axis at the very very end of travel to actuate the E-Stop function. (total of 15 roller switches on the machine, 13 buttons on the enclosure, 9 for manual jogging, 1 e-stop, faster/slower multi- step buttons replacing the 555 timer used for manual step speed with a digital pot)
When talking about Nema17 or Nema23 motors...what does the 17 or 23 refer to? Is it the mounting hole spacing? Current carrying capability? Or just some random number given to a different range of stepper motors?
Can I ask you folks what software you are using for design/etc? I'm using an old version of Protel Schematic 1.0 for the schematic, importing the netlist into Protel AdvPCB 2.7.1 (only using Protel because I'm very familiar with it), exporting gerber files/excellon drill files over to a trial version of DeskCNC for conversion/saving to G-codes, copying those files to a USB stick to get them over to my Linux box to run EMC2/Axis.
So far, relatively good.
I haven't tried an actual PCB yet, but it looks like I can get DeskCNC to give me a good set of G-codes to properly route a PCB the way I want it. At least when I pull up the file on EMC2, the screen looks correct (offsets for milling, etc)...
Problem I've got is with the Excellon drill files. The tools look right, the tool changes look right, everything looks ok, except for the offset. I cannot get the offset of the drill holes to line up with the rest of the PCB. Is there something special you have to do with the layers before exporting them? Exclude some layers, add something in?
Videos - yes, there will be more videos...but only when I am sure of what I am doing so I don't end up confusing others more than they already are.
It only took me about 10 minutes to get the Ubuntu8.04/LinuxCNC LiveCD installed and working (used Wubi. Great program.). It took me another 6 hours or so to get the wireless working under Ubuntu 8.04 (wired LAN worked fine straight away), and another 3 hours to get a screen resolution of more than 800x600...and I still don't have the nVidia drivers loaded correctly.
Like I've said, I'm a bigtime Linux newb (although I've bought a couple of books to help me out).
Going to order a load of those limit switches, push buttons, 2pin connectors, and so on this weekend, then figure out how to mount them correctly and configure EMC2 to recognize them. Then still have to mount the whole thing in an enclosure (keep out the flying pieces/parts ya know). An extra fan for the PSU might not be a bad idea either.
Maybe should start a new thread in a more appropriate section about this since it's getting a bit off-topic.
Nema is a reference to the motor frame dimensions and mounting.
The bigger Nema size usually has more torque also.
http://www.flextecinc.com/stepper.html
I thought the motors looked small in the videos. So this cant be upgraded to nema 23?
Do still like it though. Can the widgetmaster mill aluminium or does it depend more on what motors are put on it?
Would like a small desktop for anything from pcbs, carvings(plastic), signs(wood) and maybe watches(after seeing some being made using a proxxon mill in another thread)?
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