What is the best bang for the buck for a turn-key cnc with tool changer

[johnnyquest]

Greetings All-

This is my first post so I'm sure I will get lumps along the way There are so many machines out there that I would like to find a starting point.
This is the initial budget....my partner was quoted 80k and I'm thinking 30k if i built it myself.

I'm about to partner up with another builder on the purchase/build of a cnc for sheet goods- melamine, baltic birch and acrylic
My partner wants to be able to run cabinets parts straight from the cnc to the edge bander then assembly.
I'm ok with this as I see a huge benefit from not running the slider saw all day only to move on to line boring.
We do a fair amount of European lock sets that would go so much faster on the "Right" cnc in place of our Porter Cable hand crank in the field.
I do believe that a tool changer is essential to facilitate the ability to mill holes/slots/profiles on the horizontal edges. Again way more efficient than moving on to another work station.

Does anybody have an idea as to what has been tried and true to fill these requirements?

I'd like to have an usable cutting area of 5 by 12 feet. I'm not sure if its out there but a plasma cutter head attachment could make things even more versatile ( yeah it was only a dream )

Thank you for taking the time to read this.

Regards,
Johnny





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[ger21]

What would you be getting for $80K? Probably something with a multiple spindle boring head? I'd say it's unlikely you can duplicate that type of machine as a DIY project.

Generally, the more things you want the machine to do, the fewer things it will be really good at. I would say that plasma isn't even an option.

How many sheets of melamine do you cut each day? I would say that a machine for cutting melamine cabinet part won't be good at milling horizontal edges in hardwood. Mainly due to the workholding requirements, and the time it takes to switch from a nested based vacuum table to something with elevated vacuum clamping. You'd also need a 90° aggregate head, which can cost $10K for that alone.

You'll want to use vacuum for holding down sheet goods, and a 5x12 table requires a lot of vacuum. We have a 5x12 at work that uses two 10HP Becker pumps, and it's barely adequate when cutting smaller parts. And that's nearly $20K in vacuum pumps. The only time we really use all 12 feet is when cutting Corian sheets.

[johnnyquest]

Thank you Ger21 for your reply,,,,, I will toss the idea of a plasma head, wishful thinking followed by a reality check
I'm running the table so large for that one job that that always has you wishing you had more area to accommodate that curved store front header that roles through the shop every once in a blue moon.
As for the large table I had planned on running 3 separate vacume zones because 4 by 8's are the norm around the shop, I would just run what is needed for the sheet size.
I've got several 5 hp pumps from back in the day when I was vacuum forming my skate boards (I could only do 5 decks at a time so we moved on to a hydraulic cold press and male/female molds to triple our output)
I was hoping to find a cnc that does everything very well, now this is not the case so I'll have to say that milled cabinet parts ready for edge banding is the goal. My material usage on commercial jobs can have me
cutting up to 2 units (bunks) per day..... and during slower times 10 sheets for a small kitchen. I cringed at the 10k aggregate head so I'll back off on that.... thank you again for the heads up.
It was only this Monday that my partner ran the 80k figure by me and i'm not certain of the manufacture and options at that price. I will find out though.
For this arrangement between my partner and I to work he will want accurate parts from the cnc to edge bander and assembly for our own jobs and other shops sourcing to us.
I'm interested in the all of the other fun things a cnc can do outside of trimming a cabinet end with holes for hinge plates, shelves, grooved backs and drawer slide holes for Euro screws.
I'm most certain I could have my DIY cnc built and making $$$ on my personal artistic endeavors, however this will not go over well if I can't churn out dead nut accurate parts for a company that majors in Euro style cabinet cases. So I will continue the search.....and thanks again for the input!!

Regards,
Johnny

[ger21]

At 80 sheets/day, then I'd recommend one of the major industrial players. Biesse, Weeke, SCM, Morbidelli, Holzer, Bussellato.
I'm not up on current pricing, but $80K might be on the low side. I'd say that it's mandatory that you get something with an ATC, about a 10HP spindle, and a boring head with as least 12-14 spindles. Expect to spend another $10K-15K on software to take full advantage of the machine. Without the right software and someone who knows how to use it, you'll spend more time programming than cutting.

There's a big difference, though, between 80 sheets/day and 10 sheets/day. But even if you average around 100 sheets per week, A $100K machine should be making you money.

We have a Morbidelli at our shop, and one guy can do 50-80 sheets a day by himself. Cut, bored for hardware, and ready for edge banding and assembly. Our machine unloads the sheet and cleans the table, so it's ready to start cutting the next sheet while parts are being unloaded. Cycle times depend a lot on how many holes are being bored, and how many different sized holes. A sheet with a dozen parts and no drilling might take 2 minutes to cut, while a sheet of parts with a few hundred holes might take 5-8 minutes.

[johnnyquest]

ger21
my experience with a cnc router was 18 years ago,,, thanks for bringing me up to speed the with some leaders of industry and a sound price point....nice to know the #'s work

Regards
Johnny