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Thread: My homebuilt spindles

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    Default My homebuilt spindles

    Once you play around with this stuff for a while, soon or later many of us get an unhealthy interest in making our own spindles.

    Presently I am working on making two different spindles so I thought I'd share them.

    The ER-32 collet spindle is being built into the housing of an industrial right angle reduction gearbox I picked up from the scrap dealers. It will replace the ER-16 Sherline industrial spindle I currently have on my FrankenDeckel.

    The Other one is a small Proxxon Collet spindle which I want to use as a tool post drill, mill and grinder for the CNC'd 7x12.

    Similar Threads:
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails My homebuilt spindles-er-32-spindle-pdf   My homebuilt spindles-spindle-assy-pdf  
    Regards,
    Mark


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    Nice drawings. The ER32 spindle with the tapered roller bearings, interesting the way the bearings are used. Usually the cup is mounted in the housing not in the retaining cover. Can't remember ever seeing them mounted this way. How are you retaining bearings to shaft?

    cary



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    I have a Proxxon IB/E, but it is not rigid enough to use as a tool post bore grinder, as it only has a single bearing. I picked up a box full of FAG 7200 AC's off Ebay, so I decided to design a rigid spindle around them.

    Hi Cary,

    The cups are a located radially in the housing, but axially by the caps. Bearing preload has been set by shimming the cups. This was the way the angle gearbox was, and I figured a nicely aged cast iron block with precision bore is a better housing than something I'd hack together.

    I need to post some pictures of the physical parts. The picture shows the current physical condition.

    I have not decided on the bearing/ pulley retention system for the rotor yet.

    Since there is a shoulder at the bottom of and shaft and a spacer between the two inner races, the the whole rotor will be retained from the top. Whether to turn a thread and use collar nut, or use a taper locking set up which includes the drive pulley is open.

    This bigger spindle is on hold because I am more interested in the little one at present. My projects tend to take a rather meandering journey to completion.

    I need to go see a friend and get a valve spring so I can finalise that design. The spring will preload the upper, floating bearing. The design is based on Herbertkabi's recommendations here.
    High Speed Spindle for SIEG X2 Mill - getting technical

    So far I have just made the main spindle shaft (2x - the first one I messed up), and the bearing spacer.

    Regards,
    Mark


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    Would you mind sharing the dimensions and angle of the proxxon taper? I've been able to locate information about the dremel taper, but I'd prefer to re-use some of the proxxon stuff I already own. I've not yet been able to find out anything official though.



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    Quote Originally Posted by RotarySMP View Post
    I have a Proxxon IB/E, but it is not rigid enough to use as a tool post bore grinder, as it only has a single bearing. I picked up a box full of FAG 7200 AC's off Ebay, so I decided to design a rigid spindle around them.

    Hi Cary,

    The cups are a located radially in the housing, but axially by the caps. Bearing preload has been set by shimming the cups. This was the way the angle gearbox was, and I figured a nicely aged cast iron block with precision bore is a better housing than something I'd hack together.

    I need to post some pictures of the physical parts. The picture shows the current physical condition.

    I have not decided on the bearing/ pulley retention system for the rotor yet.

    Since there is a shoulder at the bottom of and shaft and a spacer between the two inner races, the the whole rotor will be retained from the top. Whether to turn a thread and use collar nut, or use a taper locking set up which includes the drive pulley is open.

    This bigger spindle is on hold because I am more interested in the little one at present. My projects tend to take a rather meandering journey to completion.

    I need to go see a friend and get a valve spring so I can finalise that design. The spring will preload the upper, floating bearing. The design is based on Herbertkabi's recommendations here.
    High Speed Spindle for SIEG X2 Mill - getting technical

    So far I have just made the main spindle shaft (2x - the first one I messed up), and the bearing spacer.
    Seems my recommendation was bit unclear - I can not understand how you thought your upper bearing will be preloaded by spring when this upper bearing is stoped with upper cup-nut? With looseing this cup-nut?
    At that - you do not use sliding cup for upper bearing - I think that height of bearing is too small to be as the part of slide. Please remember, in my desing this bearing is inside slider-cup, all bearings are (super precision) angular contact bearings, all parts made as *precision*.
    This actual Spindle has been in full work more that one year, near every day, at least 12 hours in day, sometimes even 24h. Month ago I did open ot once - to look how bearings ... everything was OK, just added bit grease and go on.
    Although this Spindle runs up to 50.000 RPM, I do not use higher than 35k, even than 1/16 endmill bits, most of all between 12 ... 24 k when 6mm ... 3mm endmills. I have 8mm collets for ER11 but not tried yet.
    Heli governor mode of new esc´s keeps choiced RPM well (some types have narrow keeping area, some has wider, like Schulze Fut.).
    My spindle has 1.5kw slotless motor made myself, water cooled - milling coolant goes through spindle. Ampermeter pulsates at 3 to 10 when small bits and at 10 to 15, even up to 20A when 6mm endmills.
    Wow-wow-wow ...-> kind of voice when governor keeping needed RPM under load and this noise level is low, comes most of all from mill and material, not from spindle.
    cheers,
    herbert



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    The Proxxon Collets are 60° taper. I also looked everywher to confirm this, but ended up taking a hi res digital photo, and importing as a background in AutoCAD, then drawing lines along the taper and shaft and letting AutoCAD measure the angle. Kind of a cheap optical comparator.

    I turned mine with a 7mm larger diameter. 7.5mm would probably be better. The thread is M8x0.75.

    Regards,
    Mark


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    Herbert,

    That is not the final design, as I have not yet sourced the spring. Once I have it there are a few dimensions I will need to adjust. The clearance between the upper cap and the bearing outer race being one.

    Edit:
    Actually, I just checked, and there is already clearance in that drawing I uploaded in the first post.

    Last edited by RotarySMP; 04-19-2010 at 02:54 PM.
    Regards,
    Mark


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    how do you cool this spindle? water? air?

    forgot to ask, whats the estimated max speed of this spindle?

    ● Distribuidor Syil en Argentina ● "www.syil.com.ar" ●


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    I am not planning to turn it faster than 20K (more likely to gear it down to max 12K). If it gets hot I will have stuffed up the bearing preloads.

    Regards,
    Mark


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    Quote Originally Posted by RotarySMP View Post
    The Proxxon Collets are 60° taper. I also looked everywher to confirm this, but ended up taking a hi res digital photo, and importing as a background in AutoCAD, then drawing lines along the taper and shaft and letting AutoCAD measure the angle. Kind of a cheap optical comparator.
    Interesting approach. I guess it could be verified with a bit of spotting compound to check collet engagement with a new taper in some scrap. If my lathe wasn't in such a sorry state I'd give it a go myself ;-)



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    Here are the first couple of parts made for the little spindle. The spare is simple 13mm OD 10 ID tube, 63mm long (Came out 63.02mm as best as I can measure it).

    I used 5bears method of sneaking up on the bearing journals.
    http://www.5bears.com/cnc16.htm

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails My homebuilt spindles-img_6604-jpg   My homebuilt spindles-shaft-pdf   My homebuilt spindles-spacer-pdf  
    Last edited by RotarySMP; 04-19-2010 at 04:20 PM.
    Regards,
    Mark


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    Why to cool the spindle? Mine runs up to 50k, no needs for cooling - only motor is what wants to go hot becayse eddy, iron and copper losses. Eddy´s come highly up especially when higher speeds - it really looks like heats more than spent electricity
    My low rpm motors up tp 12k do not need any cooling except what exist through mechanical parts.
    When just spindle goes hot then something has been done wrong ... bad /wrong/ bearings... or too much preload ... too tight seal... to much filled grease ... even too much oil when oil used ... when good seals and you fill high speed spindle full of even thinnest oil then on high speed temperature rises up to ... oh dear - do not try!
    Right made spindle can come "hot" but only just like 30 ...40 degrees and Z-axis throug spindle holder is more than good enough cooling device.
    cheers,
    herbert



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