Just became a Tree hugger - Tree 2UVRC Tradesman 200

[KC130LOADIE]

Hey everyone, first post here.

First mill I used was a Lguan FTV-1, and a couple of Bridgeports, then I got to use my buddies old Tree 2UVR.
So, after much reading, and reading, and re-reading, I found on Craigslist a Tree 2UVRC - Journeyman / Tradesman 200. It was part of a giant lot of gear to sell. I asked the guy if they would let it go seperately, and they said sure. I asked how much, and they said $600. Yeah....$600.
I went down to the shop which is only 5 miles away to check it out. It has the body of a 2UVR-C all right, big box ways. No powerfeeds at all unfortunately (I guess that was redundant with the servos). The kid who works at the shop and was handling liquidating their equipment said he had never seen it turned on, it just sat in the back of the shop taking up room. They put power to it, and after some fiddling with the enclosure door lock / switch, she turned on. The NC control seems to be shot, no response to any button mashing, but the forward and reverse buttons fired up the motor.
Ahhhh, she purrs like a kitten. No grinding, clunking, nada...just smooth.

I tested the spindle for any runout...I couldn't find any...not anything more than one Thou at least. The quick change collet system worked fine, and they even had 8 collets. Check backlash on the X-axis, there is maybe 1-2 Thou tops.

On the negative side, the motor brake doesn't work (I'm thinking the cork is just worn away).

The Y-Axis is almost impossible to move. It does move, but it is SUPER hard. I'm not sure if the servo motor was fighting me, or it was bound up from sitting for 18 years not being used.
The electronics (at least the NC part, there was no tape reader available) I am figuring are junk. I could hear different relays clicking when manipulating some of the major controls.
There is no X or Y table locks due to the machine being NC.
No powerfeeds at all.

So, I am going to use it in a manual fashion until I get some more coin together and will Linux CNC the beast.

What I am looking for is does anyone have any input or advice upgrading this mill to a newer CNC system? I want to go full 3-Axis, LinuxCNC, etc.

P.S. Does anyone know if AdobeMachine is around? He has a very similar setup and I need to pick his brain.


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[Alaska Bob]

I have a 2UVR-C that was converted to NC by Tektronix. It had NC400 drives, DC servos and a custom built Tektronix Machine Controller. I have changed out the motors and drives with Emerson /Control Techniques and use Mach3 to drive it. I use a vfd for the spindle.
I'm happy to answer questions or send photos if you want to see how this one was done. They did a good job with adjustable double nut ball screws and a central oiler.
--Bob

[KC130LOADIE]

Alaska Bob, I'll soak up any and all information you are willing to share. Was your 2UVR-C manual before and then converted to NC, or was it like mine then upgraded with the Emerson / Control Techniques?
I am just starting to get into the weeds on the research of drives, motors, controllers, and software. I definitely see the VFD being nice as it can be controlled by the computer. Do you have any cooling issues for the motor when it is in a low RPM state and not pushing much air?
Are you running normal 110/220 for your setup, or still using 3-phase power? With the VFD, 3-phase wouldn't make much sense to me.
How do you like Mach3? Have you tried other solutions before? Some of the interweb banter seems to get pretty religious between Mach3 and LinuxCNC / EM2, etc.
Were there any pitfalls or lessons learned when doing your upgrades / conversions?
-Kit

[Alaska Bob]

Kit,
I purchased the mill as a 3 axis CNC machine. So all I did was change out the old drives and servos with the Emerson equipment. I am not certain, but I think the original conversion from manual to NC was done by Tektronix for use in their model shop. I haven't seen many photos of the early NC Journeymans, but there are some key differences between how yours is set up and how mine is. I'll get some photos posted here when I get some time for you to look at.

I run the machine with 220 Volt (110/220 split phase residential wiring). The VFD allows me to run the 3 phase motor off the 220V. I have not experienced any cooling issues but I hardly ever run it slow. It has the variable speed belt drive and back gear, so going slow on the spindle with full rpm on the motor is not a problem. When I am milling small diameter and aluminum, I usually overspeed the motor up to 80Hz to get higher feed rates. I have run it for hours at a time at that speed with low loads and she doesn't get too hot that I can't put my hand on it. I don't have the guts to go any higher, but it is tempting when using a a single flute 1/16" cutter.
Some of the Emerson drives will run on 120V, but I use 220V to get the most out of them. It is all doable with 220V you don't need 3 phase.

I like Mach3...it works easily. I have not made a machine to run on linux just because I was impatient and wanted to see chips fly. Mach was more plug and play in my mind.

My one word of warning would be when getting 'great deals' off auction sites etc, is to understand connector and cable requirements. I lucked out with some great deals on cables but the Emerson equipment has MS connectorized motors and they get pretty spendy pretty quick. I have also picked up some Mitsubishi servos/drives, and they use a much cheaper connector that is easy to assemble yourself. I have a few servos that cost me 30$ and then I had to buy the 50$ cable.

I am currently reworking the whole control cabinet. I put it together quickly to get it running and then once running she stayed that way...cables everywhere! I am now adding a smooth stepper and trying my best to make it neat and tidy.

Oh something else to think about. 440V VFDs are generally easier and cheaper on the auction sites because not many have 440 in their garage. I originally used a 2Kva control transformer to take 120V up to 440V to run a 30HP VFD to drive the Tree spindle motor. You need to carefully set up the VFD to output a percentage of the voltage and other parameters, but it is a possibility.

I'll try to get some photos here later today. Congrats on the new mill, they are great old machines.
--Bob

[Alaska Bob]

PHOTOS NOW ATTACHED
Here are some photos of my 2UVR-C. She's been in storage for 2 years and is still covered with LPS3. Which I have to say worked well at keeping the rust at bay on all my equipment.
You can see how the limit switches are set up and the ball screws are simply supported. The old encoders are not being used in the current setup. Note the x axis screw remains stationary (rotates of course but doesn't move left or right. The ball nuts are mounted to the table.

[KC130LOADIE]

Very, very interesting! Does the knee elevation act as your Z-Axis? If so, how tight of tolerances and returnability do you have? Some others I have seen, including AdobeMachine tried getting the knee to act as a Z, but needed BIG servos / motors do to the weight, and instead opted for the head and spindle acting as the Z-Axis.
The servos look tiny, then again...electronics have come a long way in 35 years. So the X-Axis screw is captured by the saddle and drives the table rather than being captured in the table and driving or "pushing" off the saddle?

For the X-Axis, if the screw is captured in the saddle, does the amount of X-Axis travel become limited due to running out of screw? I assume that with the screw in this setup, any kind of manual hand operation is impossible, unless you want to bend down under the table and run a handle on the drive system; then again, maybe that's the point.

Why do the limit switches look like they are fed into a hydraulic / oil line and manifold system?
I see that the encoder sits in-between the servo motor and the drive screw. I was under the impression that most if not all encoders were also located on the servo / motor.

I am pretty torn if I should go VFD now, and get one that can accept commands and report back; or go the RPC route for now until I am ready to fully CNC. I have to do this in stages due to a pretty constrained budget. I really have a problem with enjoying expensive pursuits way too much. I have a lead on a new 10HP 3-phase motor for $100, so I might go that route just to "future proof" (ha!) for any additional 3-phase equipment I might aqquire later. As for the VFD, do you just keep the variable belt at a specified setting a leave it alone? Do you have an encoder or tach for your spindle to provide data / feedback to your controller?

Thanks again for all the info Bob. I can see that there is definitely more than one way to skin a cat in this game.
--Kit

[Alaska Bob]

Yes, X-axis screw is captured in saddle.
Yes, the knee is my z-elevation - and yes it is heavy. Goes down fast but up is a bit slower but at least 80 ipm if I remember right. It is a small servo (.48kw) and took a 10:1 reducer to get it to move. I think I get 90 in-lbs out of the reducer. But the servos are nice as they will overdrive 30-50% for a few seconds when it needs it. I'll get the specifics for you so you know what it takes. Z-axis is also a ball screw. I get 0.002" repeat-ability on each axis at least probably half that.

The limit switches are electric, There are nearby lubrication lines though that might be confusing.

The encoders are from the old setup and I haven't taken them off. Yes, all my servos have built in encoders.

I do not have any link for the spindle. I adjust my speed with the variable belt all the time. If I am running slow speed cutters I set the VFD to 60hz and use the variable belt to set my speed. If I am running high rpm I crank the mill belt all the way up and then maybe hit the VFD up to 80hz. I wouldn't worry about any intelligent controller on the spindle to start. Make it spin and you'll be good to go for a while. Of course, I plan on hooking it up to the controller eventually. Soo many projects....

[KC130LOADIE]

I am pretty sure (99%) that my knee screw is Acme. I was wondering what yer fancy knee screw boot thing was for. I hear ya on the VFD and spindle. I have been hitting up this and other forums trying to find out what servos were in my mill...so far havn't heard back from anyone. I guess that is the problem when you are PM'ing and replying to threads from 7 years ago.

I am reading up on a guy who revamped a Bridgeport CNC with a tool changer with a DSPMC/IP by Vital Systems. It seems very up to the job, especially if using older servos. Soo many options.

[KC130LOADIE]

So, today I was just prepping and cleaning the mill at the previous owners' shop before I move it Saturday. Figured might as well make a mess there rather than my garage. I made sure the ram actually locked (saw another thread on here where the ram wasn't actually captured and slid off during transport), got to do an even more in-depth check of the mill, and found out why the Y-Axis was SOO hard to move; the damn gib was tightened up to where the table would barely move. After loosening that...every moved smooth as silk. I worked the head tilt back and forth with lots of PB blaster, then remembered to drain the oil out of the head BEFORE I inverted it. I did take apart the Y-axis drive plate, and was surprised at how much dang grease was in it. I also noticed that the encoder? looked to be wearing a nice ring into the cover. How did this start happening? Oh, I broke off the limit switch bracket, I barely wiggled it and POP went the metal. Looks like I'll be making a new one.

Does anyone know what the little brown breakout circuit board that is attached to the mainboard does?




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