Tormach ER20 Holder "recall"

[WOTDesigns]

As if I needed another example of good business practice and dedication to customers from Tormach:

Dear Tormach TTS Customer:

If you are receiving this email, our records indicate that you have recently received 1 or more ER-20 Tormach Tooling System (TTS) tool holders from Tormach, either as an individual part or as a component of a TTS Set.

We have become aware that a number of these holders (shipped between November, 2011 and January 2012) were not manufactured to our specification and do not meet the tolerance standard for ER-20 profiles ( ISO 15488:2003), resulting in unacceptable TIR. Unfortunately, this problem was not captured during our typical Quality Auditing procedures.

We regret to inform you that your ER-20 holders may have been from this production lot. If you believe that your ER-20 holders are unacceptable, please contact us. We will be happy to provide guidance on how to verify the problem and facilitate any necessary returns.

An unfortunate consequence of this issue is that we are temporarily backordered and will not be able to provide immediate replacements to most requests. When our stock replenishes, we will send you replacements free of charge. We estimate this will be sometime in Q2 2012.

All replacement cases are subject to review. Should you have any questions regarding this issue, please contact:

We apologize for this inconvenience, and we continue to strive to provide the best value in small CNC mills and accessories.

Mistakes happen. Who else "recalls" a tool they aren't getting sued for selling yet (I'm only assuming since no one has mentioned it here). After spending all night testing SS Holders and one ER20 Holder I have no idea which holder was from that batch. Guess I'll check them all (only 3) and if I can't tell I guess it doesn't matter.

[s2jesse]

Yes such good support. Tormach even contacted me once based on a forum post on here to help me with an issue

On topic though
What is the method to check the collets. I have a bunch of them from that period. Ive been getting a lot of chatter. Im sure its just my feeds and speeds but would be nice to feel confident its not the tooling

Jesse

[WOTDesigns]

in interested to hear "their" method, but I chuck a 1/4" engraving tool (very long) upside down in a collet, throw it in the spindle after cleaning collet, tool, and nose. then set a DTI horizontally with the tip havering to the left, set the spindle at 200 rpm and bring the 1/4" tool into contact with the center line of the tool. any run out will move the needle on the DTI back and fourth. the total left and right needle movement is the run out. a good practice is to loosen the spindle collet, rotate tool holder 90° and check again in case the spindle/collet error happened to hide error in the tool.

I believe it may be "better" to rotate by hand but I get some selection on my little mill that way. that is the method described in my haimer 3d manual to center tool to my spindle.

[WOTDesigns]

actually haimer says to use a plunge type dial indicator with an "elephant foot" and press into the side of the tool which does work well also. I use dti because its more accurate within my selection of measuring indicators.

[s2jesse]

Ok i was making sure you wouldnt measure the insde of the holder or soemthing...

next question is what is acceptable runout?

jesse

[WOTDesigns]

Less than i have the ability to measure I posted in my f&s thread about last nights findings. the er20 holder I tested barely even vibrated the needle on my .0005" DTI. don't know if it was an old one or the new one though.

[tbaker2500]

I got this email too, after receiving 2 new ER20 holders just a few days before. I had just done extensive cutting with a 1/8" collet and carbide bit, with absolutely beautiful results. So, I guess I got lucky. I mounted a 1" chamfer bit in the other, I guess I'll find out if it's wobbly. :-)

[beanbag]

I think you ARE supposed to measure the inside taper on the holder itself.

[MichaelHenry]

I don't think that checking tool runout with the spindle under power is such a good idea. I'd use the DTI on the inside taper of the collet holder and hand turn the spindle to check runout. Check the collet itself by indicating off the solid side of an endmill or with a dowel pin or gage pin that is known to be good, again with the spindle turned by hand.

Mike

[philbur]

Indicating off a pin held in a collet will tell you the combined run-out of the tool holder/ER collet/pin/R8 collet/ R8 spindle assembly it will not tell you what the run-out of the holder is. To test the holder only you need to use a lever type DTI inside the holder, on the taper, at both the top and bottom of the taper. Then you need to loosen the drawbar rotate the holder 180 degrees then repeat the measurements, then Repeat the above operations 3 times With a little bit of maths you will then have enough information to make a judgment on the holder tolerance.

Phil

[Don Clement]

Another method of testing runnout of TTS holders would be using a V-block on a surface plate with a TDI. The advantage with this method is it would eliminate the artifacts from testing the TTS toolholder in the spindle with the spindle’s runnout. In addition if one had a Flexbar Ball Bearing V-block then one could detect not only runnout but also lobing. http://www.flexbar.com/shop/pc/SML-B...PS-66p4571.htm

Don

[s2jesse]

I wonder if anyone would mind sharing their findings. Ive tested about 8 holders. 7 of them all registered around .0005 - .001 of rounout testing with various methods and averaging.

1 must of been from the bad batch because it was way off around 0.01 runout.

And luckily I havnt cut with that one yet. So thanks again tormach for great support and being proactive with this. It may have saved me a part or more!

Jesse