What to Build for a Stand??

[Willyb]

Hi Guys

I know I asked this question before and at that time allot of the Tormach Stand Owners hadn't had time to setup their Coolant system. I am in need of a Stand for my Mill and I can’t decide what to build. My original plans were to go with a Full Enclosure with high sides and a sliding front door, similar to the Haas Mini Mill. I also am very interested in the DIY Tormach Stand. After allot of research I am still undecided.
I will be using Coolant most of the time and I am curious how you are finding the Tormach Stand to keep the Swarf and Coolant off of the Floor? How is the Plexiglas Shield to use? Is it awkward to Re & Re off of the Table? Does the Plexiglas Shield require trimming when used with the Vise? Do you find the height of the panels satisfactory? I remember reading something about an interference problem with the Vise or Vise Handle and the front of the Stand? Where do most of the chips end up? Should the Drain be located in a different position? Should there be two Drains? (one on each side of the Mill?) I am also interested in any changes or modifications you might consider if you were building a Stand from scratch? Thank you for taking the time to help me with my questions.

Regards
Willy

[NinerSevenTango]

The plexiglass or lexan shield that is provided attaches to the table. Naturally, my first job involves work that extends past the limits of the table, so I never even installed it yet.

Now that I have fabricated a piece of lexan to slip onto the front of the machine, I probably will always use it.

The stand I bought is a really nice job, with separate compartments on the sides for holding the coolant tank and the computer, and one in front for holding tooling or whatever. It is welded construction and provides a solid base for the machine, with adjustable feet so that everything can rest solidly.

The coolant scheme is well thought out, with a fine screen in the drain that can be pulled out and dumped easily, which drains into a pan, which then drains into a double compartmented coolant tank. The pan under the screen nicely catches any chips that get by the screen when you take it out, and it slides into the compartment like a drawer, so you can just pull it out easily for cleaning (or you can just vacuum through the screen hole). Everything fits nicely into the side compartment of the machine. It would have been a real pain to design and build all of that myself. I haven't had it all back out of the machine for a thorough cleaning yet, but it looks like it was designed to make that a minimal fuss job. Just have to pump out the coolant first, then it all pulls right out.

I saw somewhere else where someone tilted theirs to make the coolant run towards the drain, with shims under the mill to make the machine level. I might do this myself, just to make it drain quicker. It works OK the way it is, but this might help with evaporation.

The job I am running right now involves hogging out 1" deep circular slots in aluminum. It didn't take me long to figure out that in order to do this on a routine basis, I'm going to have to blast the chips out of the slot with coolant, or else re-cut all the chips while wearing out tooling and roughing up the finish. A single nozzle pointing from only one direction can't do that all the way around. So, I am fabricating a coolant ring that will give me three nozzles instead of one. I am going to need lots of coolant flow, splashing and spraying chips in all directions.

The sides of the stock stand do not extend very high. If you even think about blowing chips off your work with an air gun, you will be sending chips across the room. Same thing with serious drilling in aluminum without the table-mounted guard installed. Zing! Duck! So I will be adding removable panels on the sides and rear very soon as well. I'm contemplating various ways of getting it done with stuff I have around. (I have lots of stuff around!)

One thing about using air to blow coolant - laden chips around is that it makes a big mess. It also occurred to me that blowing chips around would be a great way to have them end up behind the way covers, something I don't really want. So I spent all day yesterday modifying the coolant system. I put larger hose, a check valve, a tee, and a bunch of other stuff together so that now I have it set up like the HAAS mills do -- there is a short run of garden hose with a nozzle on the outside of the front of the machine. So now I can gently wash the chips away, instead of blasting them everywhere. That part works really nice, it's something I wished for from the start. Turned out to be quite a plumbing and fabrication job, but I'm happy with it.

What I will end up with is Lexan shields that extend pretty much all the way around, standing on pegs that slip into pockets attached to the base, so that everything is contained inside the machine. Because I intend to do lots of coolant blasting. Now this isn't to say that the Tormach base is inadequate -- there is an awful lot of workmanship and features built into the thing for comparatively little money. I wouldn't consider building my own base for it unless it were for hobby reasons and I wanted to do it for the pleasure of doing it. There are a whole lot of hours saved by having those features already thought out and built in. And it's relatively easy to add whatever modifications you like. I'll take some pictures and post them once I get everything set up the way I like.

I saw the wooden design, and it's very nice. That said, I would never build one out of wood, myself. That's because mine will be very wet, a lot of the time. And sometimes, the building gets water on the floor. If anyone were to decide to build one of wood, I would be very sure to use marine grade wood, and be very careful about sealing.

--97T--

[Willyb]

Hi NinerSevenTango

Thank you for responding to my questions on the Tormach Stand. I am going to be making my Stand out of Steel Tube and Sheet Metal. I agree that the Wood could become a problem down the road, especially when using allot of Coolant.

I put larger hose, a check valve, a tee, and a bunch of other stuff together so that now I have it set up like the HAAS mills do -- there is a short run of garden hose with a nozzle on the outside of the front of the machine. So now I can gently wash the chips away, instead of blasting them everywhere. That part works really nice, it's something I wished for from the start. Turned out to be quite a plumbing and fabrication job, but I'm happy with it.

Yes I was also planning to install a Wash Down Hose on my Stand. How did you find the pressure from your Coolant Pump? Does it have enough squirt to blow the chips off of the Table and clean things up? If I find my Coolant Pump doesn’t have enough pressure I could always install a second Pump just for the Wash Down. Did you use an ordinary Garden type nozzle? Is the Check Valve to prevent the Coolant from running back when the Pump is turned off? What type of Check Valve did you use?

I saw somewhere else where someone tilted theirs to make the coolant run towards the drain, with shims under the mill to make the machine level. I might do this myself, just to make it drain quicker. It works OK the way it is, but this might help with evaporation.

This is a great idea. Were is the drain hole on the Tormach Stand? Do you think it would be beneficial to have a second drain on the other side of the Mill?

So, I am fabricating a coolant ring that will give me three nozzles instead of one. I am going to need lots of coolant flow, splashing and spraying chips in all directions.

I like this idea of the Nozzle Ring. You could make it to fit the bottom of the Spindle with a short hose to connect to the single Coolant connection on the side of the Spindle Housing. That way if you didn’t need it, you can remove it and use the single Coolant Nozzle.

Thanks again for your help with my questions. I guess I had better get busy designing my Stand.

Willy

[NinerSevenTango]

Willy,

The coolant pump has plenty of volume for the job. I could have saved a lot of time by buying stuff at the pipe supply, but I was in too much of a hurry and bought all the crap at Home Depot at night, thereby wasting more time than I saved. I used 5/8 garden hose and all the fittings and stuff to fit. The check valve is a flapper type thing they had in there, a backflow preventer. It works pretty nicely. Doesn't restrict flow, and holds pressure in the back direction, which surprised me.

I found out the only way to get those buggery little stickers off the pipe fittings is by scraping them off with your pipe wrench while trying to assemble them, thereby clogging the teeth on the pipe wrench so it doesn't grip any more, causing it to slip and mar the finish on the fitting while putting knuckles in grave danger. The only way to get the gummy paper residue off the pipe wrench teeth is by fouling your wire brush, so that it picks up rusty dirt and retains it so every time you use it on something, you can transfer some of that nice black tar onto whatever it is you are trying to brush off. Next time, I'll skip the Home Depot for pipe supplies, and wait until the plumbing supply is open.

I used a cheapo standard garden hose nozzle. And a U-bolt for a holster. I'll post up some pics when I can make it a little more presentable.

The drain hole is on the left side of the stand. If they wanted to put one in both sides, it would interfere with the idea of putting the computer under the right side. And, maybe the placement of the tank on the left side would cause opportunities for drain trouble without much slant from the right side. So I see why they didn't put a drain on both sides. Starting from a clean sheet, however, you can put the tank wherever you want.

I won't have time to make the nozzle ring for awhile. But the spindle does get hot after running high RPM for hours. I figure I'll make it a ring clamp that will cool the spindle -- should be pretty slick.

Always glad to help if my hack jobs aren't too coarse to consider.

--97T--

[Willyb]

Hi NinerSevenTango

Thanks you for the information on your Tormach Stand. I like the idea of a Coolant Ring around the bottom of the Spindle for multiple Coolant Nozzles. I was planning on doing this just for the extra Nozzles, but now I see that it has the benefit of helping cool the Bearings. Great idea.

Stand Drain.
If you are standing in front of the Mill, looking straight at it, which side is the drain on? Left or Right? Sorry for my confusion.

The Chip Drawer is on the left side (Keyboard & Monitor side) so I am thinking that the Drain should also be on this side? But if you look at the Plans for the DIY Stand, they show it on the right side when looking at the Mill.

Does the Chip Drawer have a Baffle in it to help prevent Swarf from returning to the main Coolant Tank?

Approximately how long is the Chip Drawer?

Is the Coolant Tank large enough? Have you ever run out of Coolant while machining?

Thanks again for your help with my questions.

Willy

[MichaelHenry]

On the Tormach Deluxe stand the drain is on the left, the chip screen is 5x10, and the drawer under that is 12x18x4. The coolant tank has baffles in it to help separate tram oil and chips. So far I haven't run out of coolant but I haven't milled for extended periods at a time yet.

Mike

[Willyb]

Thank you NinerSevenTango and MichaelHenry for your help with my questions. It is going to be a big help when I start designing and finally building my New Mill Stand.

Willy