New machine on order.

[jttoner]

Okay, a tad OT, but really cool. I ordered a new machine. Not a slant lathe, not even an RT. Inspired by Gary, I ordered a 3d printer. It's a Chek made Prusa i3 Mk2S. Smaller and not as pricey as Gary's, but should still be fun. Comes in kit form for $0.7k. Unfortunately, it also comes with a seven or eight week back order.

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[nitewatchman]

And yet another Money Pit is created!

I think that you will love it. I have used mine for quick prototypes, replacement parts (new door slides for the Tormach enclosure), printing RC Airplanes 60+ wingspans, printing a 780mm Quadcopter, toys for grandkids, the list is endless.

You will need a good 3-D design program and a good slicer. I use DesignSpark (free) and Simplfy3D ($150).

gary

[popspipes]

And yet another Money Pit is created!

I think that you will love it. I have used mine for quick prototypes, replacement parts (new door slides for the Tormach enclosure), printing RC Airplanes 60+ wingspans, printing a 780mm Quadcopter, toys for grandkids, the list is endless.

You will need a good 3-D design program and a good slicer. I use DesignSpark (free) and Simplfy3D ($150).

gary

I just finished some obsolete pipe flanges for a buddy for the YS 60 and 61 rear and side exhaust pattern airplane engines.

[jttoner]

Gary, a new money pit for sure, I'm hoping to use my Fusion 360 and Simplfy3D. I know your Rostox has a bigger work envelope than mine (approx. 8x8x9 inches), so I'm guessing the 5 foot wingspan was printed in sections.

[nitewatchman]

The planes were designed by 3DLab Prints. They have a bunch of nice designs now. They are in logical sections and I believe that they will fit your printer also. If not they can always be cut down further using netfabb. Printing the Mustang is about a 30 hour job, but I start the printer and go to bed or to work.

The pictures show a Supermarine Spitfire and a P-51 with printed Invasion Stripes. The wingspan for these are in the 40" range or 1:12 scale The .stl files are quite complex. You can see the ribbing on the inside in the Spit pictures which was printed in clear PLA. Next up for me is a their P-38 Lightening. Plane is twin engine, retractable gear, flaps and is also 1:12, wingspan is in the 50" to 60" range.

The planes are amazingly strong. A friend and I decided to break a printed wing and we were really surprised have much force it took, had to be 10 times greater than a stick built plane.

I have used S3D here also, it allows you to added things like flanges to the ends of the sections and intermediate frames just by manipulating the "processes" within the factory file. That will make sense after you start using S3D. I think that Fusion 360 will do a great job. Almost anything will work for design as long as it can output a .stl image.

If I can help get you started just drop me a line.

gary

[jttoner]

Gary,

Prusa includes the .STL for the SM Spitfire which, when I was a kid during WWII, was one of my favorites. After the war I became an avid war-bird model builder, balsa sticks and tissue style. My ultimate was a Douglas A26. BTW, I watched 3DLabPrint's P38 flight video. Very impressive. I believe it called for a 12 channel rig. Someday if my work envelope will handle it, else I might have to go to a larger printer. That could be grounds for a divorce, but ...

John

[tmarks11]

Wow, thanks for the pics Gary.

That is too awesome. Didn't ever think about printing something like that.

What model 3D Printer do you have?

EDIT: two minutes of stalking Gary give me the answer. Rostock Max V2. A printer I had never heard of... I had been considering an Makergear M2 or Ultimaker 2, but I guess I need to do some more research.

[jttoner]

Currently V3

[tmarks11]

What led you to go for the delta configuration instead of the more typical XYZ setup 3d printer? Or have you gone through several printers to find the right one?

[nitewatchman]

I got our first printer in our office for R&D prototypes about 10 years ago. It was a Z-Corp 450 and printed by fusing powder with a binder. The envelop was 8x8x10 and it cost $65,000. We still use it to day. We have also added a couple of Rigidbot printers since at about $1300 ea. but this over the years has exposed us to a lot of technology.

I went with a Delta printer because they are neat to watch and they are FAST. My default printing speed is 100mm/sec with a traverse of 300mm/sec, this can be two to three time the speeds of a Cartesian printer. They also tend to have large print envelopes, my Rostock envelope is about 11" in diameter by 15" tall.

I particularly like the SeeMeCNC Rostock Max Series. Their philosophy is very similar with Tormach's. The machine can always be upgraded to the equivalent to the latest printer release both hardware and software. While mine started life as a V2 couple of years ago, it is now equivalent to a V3 with additions like the new H280 hotend and automatic calibration. In addition SeeMeCNC's customer service is as good or better than Tormach's.

The biggest downside to a Delta printer is calibration. Compared to a Cartesian printer in can be daunting and a down right pain in the ass. The Rostock Max V3 has now eased this significantly by introducing a good auto calibration system. Using Cell Phone Accelerometer technology the hot end bumps the print bed in a fashion much like probing and triggering location by the g force of the impact. Playing around with this, it is very accurate. Using this data the plane of the bed is electronically leveled to the Delta Arm travel, the Horizontal Radius Correction Constant is computed and the Z axis zero is set. There is a lot of math required to define the toolpath, which is the same gcode we use, since a straight line in any direction requires motion on all three delta axis.

I have added several options on my printer that take a lot of the hassle out of printing. I printer on a bed that is borosilicate glass with a thin sheet of PEI plastic bonded to the top forming the print surface. PEI is attractive to almost all plastics when hot but tends to release the print when it cools. This does away with glue sticks, painters tape, abs soup, hair spray and all the other messy stuff used to get prints to stick to the print bed, Additionally I have a copper plate under the glass for a heat spreader. Using it the temperature of the bed only varies a degree C or so anywhere in the print area. Biggest improvement was moving the heated bed to 24VDC controlled by a solid state relay. The conventional bed could take as long as 20-30 minutes to reach 100C required to print ABS, the modified bed takes 4 minutes.

3D printing has a learning curve just like anything else but within reason, if you can draw it you can make it. Using materials like Polycarbonate and Nylon the parts are also quite serviceable. We have made patterns for small metal casting that have produced hundreds of prototype parts before wearing out.

I believe that in the coming days this technology with continue to improve at an incredible rate and change the way we look at everything.

gary

[Uman]

I also have the Chek made Prusa i3 Mk2S for prototyping and a Fusion-3 F400 for production with Simplefy 3d CAM. We have a new product to market and it has a small gearbox housing. I was researching injection mold for the housing, when I came across a 3D printed sample. Before that, I was turned off on 3D printers because all the examples were of toys and I thought that was all they were for; Wrong. Took the chance and ordered the two printers. The Prusa i3 Mk2S is much slower, but it fits in my office and I can do convenient test runs. The Fusion3 F400 is much bigger and is faster, much faster. Like Gary said, there is a learning curve; but not like a cnc mill.

We now make the housing and several other parts on the 3D printer for production. What was plastic parts to be milled are now printed; this changes the part design concept completely. New capabilities exist that were not possible or practical before 3D printing came about. These printers offer precision and capabilities not possible before. The beautiful part is that a design change does not require a new injection mold; this is a huge advantage, since I have made several changes since production began and plan to make more....no tooling constraints here.
When our product sales increase, a second+ printer will be added to keep up.

The CNC router for aluminum chips is next on my list.

[Sareks2k]

Congrats on the new machine (order)!

I was looking into a small prototype use 3D printer. I'm totally new to this.

Would this kit be a good consideration for a total noob to new 3D printing?


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[tmarks11]

I particularly like the SeeMeCNC Rostock Max Series. Their philosophy is very similar with Tormach's.

I appreciate your putting your thoughts down. I have been thinking about getting a 3d printer for a couple years, but the mechanics of affordable printers seem to be immature and require a lot of care and feeding, and I have never got to the point of pushing BUY or purchasing components to make one. I have never cosidered the delat config until now; didn't realize they had such an advantage.

I agree that this technology is exploding, and I am sure there will be some very interesting developments over the next couple years.

The CNC router for aluminum chips is next on my list.

And then a cnc plasma table.... and then a CO2 laser....

[daniellyall]

If you can run rings around a CNC machine a 3D printer is easy, just don't listen to the computer twats they are dangerous.

[jttoner]

Congrats on the new machine (order)!

I was looking into a small prototype use 3D printer. I'm totally new to this.

Would this kit be a good consideration for a total noob to new 3D printing?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I would say yes. Also, Gary's Rostock is available in kit form.

[Sareks2k]

I would say yes. Also, Gary's Rostock is available in kit form.

Awesome. Thank you.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[nitewatchman]

The Rostock Max kit takes about 20 to 25 hours to assemble. Others have claimed "world records" at 10+/- but mine with manual calibration took about 20 hours. The first part made on the machine "which is a fan housing used on the printer" was also good.

The new auto calibration greatly simplifies the setup and the assembly documentation is available at SeeMeCNC.com. I think it is very clear and very good.

For what it is worth I work buy a Delta Printer and the Rostock Max again. With that said, I am also thinking about building a Prusa Type printer with a thick machined aluminum frame, linear guide ways, Duet Controller and ball screws. Not for the feint of heart.

gary

[MichaelHenry]

I just ordered a Wanhao Duplicator D7 DLP printer based on a mostly positive review from someone on YouTube. I need something that can print smaller parts at better resolution than my Zortrax M200 printer and that seemed to fit the bill and was "only" $400 + shipping from China.