Question about 770 with auto oiler

[tas99]

I recently received my Tormach 770 with an automatic oiler and was wondering if anyone has experience with how long and how frequent to set the oilier timing?

Any help would be appreciated.

Tom

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[kstrauss]

I believe that the Tormach manual (TD10038) suggests 12 seconds every 240 minutes. Note that the elapsed time counts from the first time that your spindle is energized and includes time spent changing tools or thinking.

[tmarks11]

And you can always manually operate to lube if you leave the machine idle for awhile (recommended) The trick is that you have to jog the spindle first so it turns on the VFD and provides power to the oiler.

[nitewatchman]

The Auto Oiler on my 1100 is not powered any time the spindle is off (toolchange, part change out, crash recovery, etc.). I run 8 seconds every 80 minutes. Uses more oil but oil is less expensive than Turcite.

[kstrauss]

Hmmm. Perhaps I have a wiring error but my oiler is powered whenever the VFD has power (whether or not the spindle is actually running). My VFD (770) only goes off when the spindle lockout/spindle door interlock is activated. Is your VFD powered at all times or only when the spindle is actually active?

[nitewatchman]

My VFD is only powered when the spindle is commanded on. You can hear the contactor pull in and out when the spindle is issued a command to start or stop.

[kstrauss]

Curious. I wonder if that is a 1100 only behaviour or there is something amiss with my machine. Can any other 770 owners comment? My machine is about 3 years old if that changes anything.

[Advil]

Timely thread. Yes I also have a new (within a year) 770. And it does exactly what kstrauss's does. You have to jog the spindle to turn the oiler on, but once it's on, you have to key off the spindle to turn it off. It stays on otherwise, which has been annoying me the last few months while I pick at learning how to use it. 12 seconds ever 240 minutes is a LOT of messy oil everywhere when you are spending a lot of time thinking and on Fusion and forgetting to key the spindle off for a couple hours at a time.

Anyone know if this is for sure how it's supposed to work? Or are all the 770s just wired differently from the 1100s unintentionally at the factory?

[tmarks11]

ut once it's on, you have to key off the spindle to turn it off. It stays on otherwise....Anyone know if this is for sure how it's supposed to work? Or are all the 770s just wired differently from the 1100s unintentionally at the factory?

That is how it is supposed to work. 1100s works the same way. One the VFD is commanded on, it stays on until you e-stop or turn off the machine. Manual discusses that IIRC.

Not a wiring issue. The C2 contactor (which controls power to the VFD) is controlled by the machine control board directly. It is a firmware/software issue.

[kstrauss]

That was my understanding, tmarks11. However, nitewatchman's description of his 1100 differs.

[nitewatchman]

Not sure I understand either. Especially after comparing the schematic of the 1100 against the 770. In this area they are functionally identical.

There is actually a set of C2 NO contacts shown on the diagram that seals the C2 Contactor on after it is energized even if the machine controller drops power to the C2 contactor. I must go back pull covers and see what is amiss. By the wiring diagram for both machines, which is logically identical, the C2 contactor should only be dropped out by a Stop button, spindle door interlock or the key switch. If the C2 NO contact is not wired to seal the C2 on then depending upon firmware the machine controller could drop the C2 contactor out stopping dropping power to the VFD.

Okay off on a mission.

[nitewatchman]

OKAY - I have an answer!

ATC

When I manually start and stop the spindle the VFD remains energized and the C2 contactor remains pulled in keeping power to the Auto-Oiler indefinitely. BUT when the spindle is stopped by command (M05) AND the Tool Change (M06) is initiated, the C2 Contactor drops out and power is removed from the VFD and Auto-Oiler until the next spindle command (M03/M04) is issued. Behavior is also the same if the spindle is not stopped and the Tool Change command (M06) is issued without a prior M05. Strikes me as this is the way that Tormach makes sure that an Auto Tool Change is not attempted with a running spindle.

I would be curious to know if the M06 command behaved the same on a machine without an ATC. Or to ask another way; On a non-ATC machine, does M06 result in the C2 Contactor being released?


gary

[tmarks11]

There is actually a set of C2 NO contacts shown on the diagram that seals the C2 Contactor on after it is energized even if the machine controller drops power to the C2 contactor.

But when the C2 contactor loses power, those C2 NO contacts open, securing power to the C2 contactor. So it doesn't energize when power returns (unless the machine control board has the signal locked in... which it shouldn't on a loss of power).

My point was that the VFD doesn't power up until the first time the spindle was commanded to turn (which is commanded shut by the machine control board). After that the C2 contactor sys sealed on by the auxiliary inputs until e-stop/spindle door/etc.

Tormach also ensures the spindle is not running on an ATC by using the zero speed contacts on the VFD, which prevents PDB accusation (if wired per the ATC wiring diagram).

If the OP doesn't want the oiler to remain powered on, he could use an auxiliary relay and the "zero speed" contacts on the VFD. That way the oiler would only count down when the spindle was turning. If you do that, you probably was to drop the count-down timer quite a bit.

[kstrauss]

I just tried a simple test on my 770 without ATC. Entering from the MDI:
T1M06
S500M03
M05

I get a request to change to T1, the spindle starts, the spindle stops, the VFD is still powered up. If I understand nitewatchman correctly, on his machine the VFD is off at the end of this sequence. This is what I would usually like to have happen. Actually, since I sometimes do drag engraving, I would like to be able to control the oiler from Gcode.

[tmarks11]

Rev 1.3 of the PDB control board runs the "spindle door" signal through the PDB control board.

Any actuation of the PDB (manually or by ATC) interrupts the "spindle door" signal, which causes the VFD to shut down (it takes about 16 seconds to discharge the capacitors).

Nitewatchman has an ATC, and when he initiates a tool change, the PDB cycling shuts down the VFD.

KStrauss, if your PDB doesn't shut down the VFD, it is probably because you have the an earlier revision of the PDB control board.

Not that this solves your initial concerns.

I just tried a simple test on my 770 without ATC. Entering from the MDI:
T1M06
S500M03
M05

Mine works identical to yours. VFD doesn't power off unless I manually cycle the PDB.

[mountaindew]

I would like to note the most important note to follow is to not set to long of a duration.

CAUTION! Pressure Hazard: Do not set the actuation time too high as excessive pressure may result in
hose damage or a cracked manifold. If more lubrication is needed, shorten the interval time. Failure to do so
may result in damage to machine and cause personal injury.