Shuttle jog controller question

[mklotz70]

Ah! There it is! It's a percentage. I never use that flyout.....didn't even think to look there. Thanks!

[mklotz70]

The P1 and P2 Vista series pendants both have rotary switches for all axes which I think is much preferable. When you pick up the shuttle you have to be very careful that you don't accidentally press a button and when you do want to change axis you have to press several times to be sure the change has registered.. With a rotary switch you can see what axis is selected and there is no risk of accidentally selecting another axis.

Phil

It's certainly more definitive. I don't find the rotary anywhere near as convenient.....but I also have my shuttle sitting on a tool box just to the right of where I stand in front of the mill. If I had to use both hands with the shuttle, I'm sure I'd be using the vista more. Or...if the vista were mounted more securely.....or maybe at a different angle.

I had similar random shuttle issues with Mach on my Tormach. They went away when I switched to Path Pilot although that involved a new controller as well.

I got into such a habit of double-tapping the axis buttons I still do that even though there's no need now.

I've seen a lot of people have the "double tap" issue with the shuttle. I'm pretty convinced at this point that it's a windows/mach issue and it will stay gone if I get switched over to pathpilot.

Thanks guys!!

Set everything up to push the start button......then went up and said good morning to my wife.....nodded off in my chair for an hour or so.......it's still working right now.

[mklotz70]

Thought I'd put up a short follow up.

My shuttle started to get flaky again....buttons didn't want to register and the bed would keep moving when I let go of the wheel. With the power still on, I swapped the usb cables around to different ports. Shuttle back to working perfect and had been for a few days now. Pretty easy to blame windows and consider this a usb issue unless someone figures out something different. Hopefully, this will help anyone else that's been having shuttle issues.

[kstrauss]

There are probably a variety of causes of "flaky" shuttle operation and they require careful consideration to diagnose the actual cause in each case. If many functions are flaky then USB issues -- Windows, poor connection to the USB cable, etc -- may be the culprit. I have had two problems with my shuttle: continued jogging even when the wheel is released and erratic sensing of the Z-axis button. In the first case the problem was a sliver of aluminum between the jog wheel and the body of the shuttle. The second problem was a failed Z-axis switch in the shuttle. It is very unlikely that specific and reproducible problems result from a bad USB connection although general flakiness may well be.

Having purchased a replacement shuttle from Amazon, I have decided to move the guts of my old shuttle with the failed Z-axis button to a chip proof enclosure. Pictures to follow when I have time to finish the project.

[LeeWay]

While I have not had any issues with the function of the two Shuttle Expresses that we use, I do think the design and layout could be much better. The Express is round and buttons laid out around the perimeter. I find that I often orient the thing before pressing an axis button for some reason. Perhaps a subliminal double check that I hit the correct button? A more traditional pendant layout would be more user friendly I think.
Look forward to seeing what you made.

[jttoner]

Why can't Tormach program PP to accept pendants? It can't be rocket science. It was no problem with Mach3.

[LeeWay]

I have no doubt that they can. Will they is a different matter.
They refuse to offer Servo's. They have neglected to implement an auto collet closer on the lathe. Several other things that would make them a better product for some is either overlooked or dismissed. Either they know exactly what every customer needs (unlikely) or they are overlooking a market segment by not offering more of what the customer wants (more likely).

[shred]

From my conversations with Tormach, they have a limited resources and have a long list of things they'd like to do so they have to prioritize what they actually do.

IMO the pendant sellers have more to gain by making them work with PP, yet they don't seem to care either.

[popspipes]

I have a PS1A Vista pendant that worked fine with Mach 3, It did not work with PP, I emailed the fellow, cant remember his name, never got a reply back from him. This was some time ago and maybe they work now but I never got any acknowledgement of my email or whether it would or would not work.

[SCzEngrgGroup]

I have a PS1A Vista pendant that worked fine with Mach 3, It did not work with PP, I emailed the fellow, cant remember his name, never got a reply back from him. This was some time ago and maybe they work now but I never got any acknowledgement of my email or whether it would or would not work.

Email sales@vistacnc.com. You'll get a response from Lee, the owner. He is at least working on supporting LinuxCNC, which means he should support PathPilot. I thought he was in-production, but perhaps not yet. Last time I conversed with him, about a month ago, he certainly indicated it was in-process.

While it may not be "rocket science", doing a pendant plug-in is NOT a trivial undertaking....

Regards,
Ray L.

[LeeWay]

From my conversations with Tormach, they have a limited resources and have a long list of things they'd like to do so they have to prioritize what they actually do.

IMO the pendant sellers have more to gain by making them work with PP, yet they don't seem to care either.

I understand the limited resources thing, but if they increase the resources, the bottom line would increase too with more sale s I think.
If you aren't flush with capital though, you kinda have to dance around where the money goes to some extent. The path of least resistance is not always the most profitable. Some risk is required in business if you expect it to grow, especially in the technology arena.

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Just reviewed my e-mail exchanges with Lee at VistaCNC from about a month ago - He was, at that point, actively working on a PP driver, and had much of it working. An e-mail to inquire about status would likely get you an update straight from the horses mouth. And expressions of interest would no doubt help motivate him to continue moving forward.

Regards,
Ray L.

[kstrauss]

Just reviewed my e-mail exchanges with Lee at VistaCNC from about a month ago - He was, at that point, actively working on a PP driver, and had much of it working. An e-mail to inquire about status would likely get you an update straight from the horses mouth. And expressions of interest would no doubt help motivate him to continue moving forward.

Regards,
Ray L.

What is his email address?

[TurboStep]

... He is at least working on supporting LinuxCNC, which means he should support PathPilot...

As Lee has discovered, supporting LinuxCNC is not the same as fully supporting PathPilot. Unlike Mach, PathPilot was not intended to be sold as a product in its own right. Tormach have no interest in supporting non Tormach machines or 3rd party hardware, or even providing convenient interfaces for other to do so. Adapting PP for other machines is very easy and adding support for the Vista P2S Pendant didn't take long either, so there's not doubt that Tormach could very easily accomplish this, if they wanted to.

...Either they know exactly what every customer needs (unlikely) or they are overlooking a market segment by not offering more of what the customer wants (more likely).

I find it hard to believe that anyone NEEDS a Vista Pendant. I got all the functions of the P2S working - and put it back in the box in favour of the shuttle! Anyone who really can't live without another Pendant is free to use Mach3, Mach4 or straight LinuxCNC - it's a free world, or so they say!
I'm sure that Tormach have a fairly good idea what customers WANT (I'm sure they receive a lot of feedback from you all!), but how they address the real needs with their limited resources is up to them. They will never by able to satisfy everyone, not even part of the time.
They have mentioned one reason for not supporting the Vista Pendants and there may be more. They even appear to have played around with the idea themselves in the past but it doesn't appear to have made it to the top of their list of priorities for the moment. They do however have some interesting stuff in the pipeline - yes they have been listening .
Step

[philbur]

Tormach have no interest in supporting non Tormach machines or 3rd party hardware, or even providing convenient interfaces for other to do so. Adapting PP for other machines is very easy and adding support for the Vista P2S Pendant didn't take long either,

Once upon a time Apple took that view with their Mac computers and nearly went bust in the process.

Would you be happy to share your driver for the P2S.

Phil

[mklotz70]

There are probably a variety of causes of "flaky" shuttle operation and they require careful consideration to diagnose the actual cause in each case. If many functions are flaky then USB issues -- Windows, poor connection to the USB cable, etc -- may be the culprit. I have had two problems with my shuttle: continued jogging even when the wheel is released and erratic sensing of the Z-axis button. In the first case the problem was a sliver of aluminum between the jog wheel and the body of the shuttle. The second problem was a failed Z-axis switch in the shuttle. It is very unlikely that specific and reproducible problems result from a bad USB connection although general flakiness may well be.

Having purchased a replacement shuttle from Amazon, I have decided to move the guts of my old shuttle with the failed Z-axis button to a chip proof enclosure. Pictures to follow when I have time to finish the project.

Just sharing what worked in my case. No chips in the shuttle. Previous posts have explained more about what I tried previously. This was pretty clear cut and this is the second time this action fixed this problem.

Looking forward to seeing your enclosure.

[kstrauss]

Attached are some photos of the first assembly of my chip resistant shuttle. The switches are waterproof, the lid is secured to the paddle with a cork seal and the bearings are shielded. The paddle lets me comfortably hold the shuttle, The white case is from a PVC sewer pipe end cap. The funny piece with the four prongs engages with the jog and MPG encoders on the original shuttle. The photo shows things before I installed the MPG knob. I'm tired of accidentally changing the jog step size with disastrous results so I simply eliminated that button; you can change the step size on the PP touch screen.

[sharmstr]

Nice. I received mine on Friday. I've taken it apart but havnet had the time to do much else. We are basically thinking the same thing, though mine will be panel mount. In the year that I've had the Tormach, I have yet to hold the shuttle in my hand while operating it. God job! Any thoughts to adding an LED for the active axis?

[LeeWay]

That does look cool. Robust as well.
I don't ever hold it in my hand on either the lathe or the Pulsar. It's always really close to where I need it at.

[kstrauss]

Everything that I did would work for a panel mount; just replace my paddle with your panel. The biggest fabrication problem is how to couple the knobs to the concentric jog and MPG encoders.

I'd like to add axis LEDs but haven't yet had time to examine the circuitry on the shuttle board. Please let us know if you learn anything.