Anyone using HSMWorks Express with Tormach Personal CNC 1100?

[WOTDesigns]

I wish I had done it a couple weeks ago for the paperwork to flow through the system. I am actually going to have my lawyer set it up as it is going to get fairly complicated. If it was just for paper it would be easy, but I am in a very high lawsuit risk position manufacturing "cruise-controls" for motorcycles and soon other parts that people may want to blame for their own mistakes to make them look better... and get rich. I am setting up two independent corps/LLCs- one for the product itself and another for the machine shop which gets paid to make the products. Since my lawyer will be the one defending me I think I should let her set it up. The $1700 savings to do it myself could cost hundreds of thousands of dollars in the long run so I am playing it safe.

Really hoping the Haas goes through since I take keys for the new 2000sq/ft shop with 400a power in 13 days (oh god its going to be nice to be able to take more than one 2 steps in any direction without having to turn or step over parts). I already put a $1500 good faith deposit down with Haas a week ago to get in line since they have a 4 week lead time till build right now. Haas rep was very confident in getting approval but that IS expected.

500ipm and 15" Y would sure be nice as I can finally use two double station vises and machine 4 of another production part at a time. Honestly if it wasn't for your work on the coming ATC the Novakon would not even be a consideration. I would just buy another Tormach and 2 tool changers.

I do give my Tormach credit. It has done a great job over the last 9 months and on production parts for cruise-control it is pushing out 20 gallons of chips with a 0.250 Data Flute 2flt EM constant slotting (down to 1.035" deep) with a 0.01" finish pass on about 600 parts per day (12-16 hour days of course).

The section you posted above is exactly what I was trying to modify to stop the error, but I think looking at yours will let me solve it if I decide too. Though if Haas requires it I will continue doing what I am doing and not worry about it.

[WOTDesigns]

That is kind of funny and ridiculously outdated. Fingers crossed... I might have a new Haas to test it on by the second week in April. Which is perfect timing since I will be at AZ Bikeweek for the entire first week but that will put a bunch of spare change on hand to start buying Cat40 tooling, carts, er-32 collets, 6" double station vises (ouch). Funny the things that end up seeming to cost the most are the cheapest per piece :-/

I always thought the "O0001" all of my MC posts put out was to make sub-routines easier. I just cut the tool change section out, add it before the O0001, replace the m30 at the end with m99, and add sub calls to the top, plus m30, % obviously. 80% of what I program is sub routines. Gets pretty damn complicated with variables, but it makes adjusting for part variations easier.

[cadcam]

Please explain (For example I use carrier machining ) I have never heard of this saying. Thanks
Have you talk to any one about this at HSM or the HSM forum?

[rlockwood]

From Talon-Grip..

Q: What is the “carrier” concept?
A: The “carrier” concept is a method for machining parts that uses an amount of sacrificial material, the “carrier”, to hold onto a part while the top and sides of the part are machined to finish size. The part is then re-positioned with the machined top portion down and clamped on the finish machined sides using hard jaws or nested in soft jaws, then “carrier” material is machined off and any other finish machining is completed on that side of the part. This process allows completing a high percentage of parts in just two clampings. The most efficient version of this process uses Talon Grip Vise Jaws and requires no pre-machining of the blank material in order to effectively hold the part while machining aggressively.

But in reference to the question asked.. HSMXpress will only simulate using rectangle and cylindrical stock, so when you simulate, it fills in the gap between the two boxed. HSMWorks, on the other hand, fully supports simulation of stock of all shapes and sizes, as well as simulation of multiple jobs in succession from different angles, and simulation of form tools.. among a million other enhancements.

[WOTDesigns]

Carrier meaning leaving sacrificial material in the vise below the entire part body to allow machining of all contours and top features. Machine soft jaws to match the part. Flip part into soft jaws and machine off carrier then any features on the bottom of the part. Talon grips by mitee bite have video examples of the principal. I do this for many parts and I am sure there is an easier way to do it in hsm than we I tried last night (Ray's advise will get tried today)

No I haven't joined the hsm forum yet as I just started playing with it. Definitely digging it and looking forward to getting the full package in the next 3 or 4 months for 3D and 4th axis work. I don't have a 4th though the Haas is going to be wired for it and I expect to pick one up by end of summer.

Brian
WOT Designs

[cadcam]

Rlockwood,
Thanks for that , I have been machining for about 30 years and used all types of machine from Lathes, mills to robots, waterjets and more. I contract around the states and have now two Cam packages that I have been selling under my belt and never heard a customer ever stat that. I also teach Cad-Cam at the colleges for 14 years and more. but just to show that you are never to old to learn, Also you are correct about the diffrence between what we offer on the Express and HSMWorks there is allot more options and control in the Works side. Do you use HSMWorks?

[cadcam]

Brian,
I have to ask have you talked to your HSMWorks dealer here in Cali to see what is takes or costs.. Dam I am a lousy sales man at times lol

[cadcam]

The the that you folks were talking about is allot like this, leaving materal when machining to hold in the vise . these are snap shots for one of my class files I teach.

[SCzEngrgGroup]

From Talon-Grip..



But in reference to the question asked.. HSMXpress will only simulate using rectangle and cylindrical stock, so when you simulate, it fills in the gap between the two boxed. HSMWorks, on the other hand, fully supports simulation of stock of all shapes and sizes, as well as simulation of multiple jobs in succession from different angles, and simulation of form tools.. among a million other enhancements.

In fact, it only supports rectangular stock. Even if you specify cylindrical, it's treated as rectangular.

Regards,
Ray L.

[WOTDesigns]

Yep. Carrier.

I'm just trying to find an effecient way to do it. I drew a sketch with the soft jaws positioned 0.875 apart to machine with parallel separating, and created a new coordinate system at the back left corner of the jaw with the part inverted and a job to machine them
The used the same coordinate system for the 2nd side. Works well but the simulate comes out a little wacky (my fault no doubt) so I started checking the G code and couldn't read it very easily which is what started my original questions. Sorry have sidetracked your thread a good bit.

Brian
WOT Designs

[cadcam]

No side tracking good place to get stuff worked out.
Ray thanks for your help that is really what this site is all about.

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Brian,
I have to ask have you talked to your HSMWorks dealer here in Cali to see what is takes or costs.. Dam I am a lousy sales man at times lol

HSMXpress is free, and works with Solidworks and Inventor, but does only 2.5D. HSMWorks does full 3D, and is about $4K for a single license. I would take HSMXpress over any other CAM I've tried. I recently bought Solidworks, basically just so I could use HSMXpress. As far as I'm concerned, it was worth the $4K cost of Solidworks just to get HSMXpress. It has been fantastic, gets better the more familiar I get with it, and is lightyears better than the VisualMill, BOBCad/CAM, and others I tried for a few weeks before settling on HSMXpress.

Regards,
Ray L.

[cadcam]

Ray, I am figuring your statement that ( HSMWorks does full 3D, and is about $4K for a single license.) was in regards to SW and not the cost of HSMWorks?
And really gald to hear how happy you are with HSMWorks.

[rlockwood]

Rlockwood,
Do you use HSMWorks?

Yep, somewhere around 40 hours a week for nearly two years now. =)

WOT, most all of the parts I program make use of the 'carrier concept' and I have hundreds of examples in HSMWorks. Unfortunately, I can't really share them, ITAR, company property, etc.

I'll take a minute to discuss how I setup a part, though..

Start your machining assembly by placing the part and fix it in place.

I always define my stock by building a solid, so next I insert a virtual component, open it up, and sketch my block size. Move back to the assembly, mate the stock solid in place in reference to the part.

I also keep a couple separate 'template' assemblys that include the vise i'm planning on using, and the jaws i'm planning to use. Insert this and mate it in place to the stock.

I find creating a solidworks work coordinate system to be the most controlled method of defining WCS, so create one and define your zero point and axis directions.

Go into configurations tab, name your default one "operation 1" or similar, mark the 'link display states to configuration' button.

Go into HSMw/x tab and make a job, select all the model, stock, fixtures, wcs, etc.

Program your part.

When its time for the second op, create a new configuration "operation 2", hide the operation 1 components in the new configuration, input a new vise template, etc.

I try and keep fixtures as virtual components, too. Makes it easier to manage.. so make a new virtual component for your fixture, mate it in place to the vise and reference it to your part. If its a soft jaw, use 'convert entities' on a sketch to create the pocket profile (important, AFTER mating the fixture in place.)

Rinse & repeat.

By working this way, you can quickly and easily switch between all of the relevant components in your various operations, everything exists within one main assembly.. etc.

[cadcam]

Rlockwood,
Great explanation. Do you think having a Video showing this process would be good for new users?

[rlockwood]

Rlockwood,
Great explanation. Do you think having a Video showing this process would be good for new users?

Probably. It took me quite awhile to nail the process down. There's a setup video of some sort, but I think it mostly just goes over setting up a part in the most basic way. Something more in-depth would do a lot of good for new users attempting to make real world parts. More often than not, a part won't have nice flat sides like your example

[cadcam]

Rlockwood,
Yes the video that is out is the basics. I know Al the guy that is making them is making more . I will talk to him tomorrow about making one with more of a complex shape.
Later on I know I will start posting some of my own like I have for years in my other software.
What state are you in sir?

[cadcam]

Never mind my last question. I hope that NexGenCam has taken good care of you ?

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Ray, I am figuring your statement that ( HSMWorks does full 3D, and is about $4K for a single license.) was in regards to SW and not the cost of HSMWorks?
And really gald to hear how happy you are with HSMWorks.

No, HSMWorks is also about $4K - I'm using HSMXpress only, for now. I got a quote a while back, but don't recall the exact price. May have been "only" $3500. Whatever it costs, it's worth every penny!

Regards,
Ray L.

[rlockwood]

Never mind my last question. I hope that NexGenCam has taken good care of you ?

I actually usually go directly to the HSMWorks forum, purely because I prefer the format, and because it hits a bigger sample group of users, developers, and of course the NexGenCam guys are on there regularly as well.

I've been very pleased with the support I've received all around.