Buying from Syil

[MichaelBurton]

Hello everyone,
Long time viewer first time poster.
I've been a machinist since I was 15 (50 now) My prime area of work is Information Technology, Computers and Computer support. My hobbies are making CNC equipment, Radio Controlled Aircraft (Big ones), and electronics.
With a good measure of Tig welding and woodworking thrown in.
Last year I bought a Grizzly G0602 lathe. Perfect for my needs.

I'm about to pull the trigger on my decision to purchase a Syil X4+.
After looking at Tormach (Love the Tormach, but a bit more than I need.), Smithy, and Syil, Syil looks to be the winner.

However. . . Does one measure a product on pre-sales response time?
I know I sure do. After having done 6 months worth of on line research I'm ready to approach the Syil sales department with my pre-purchase inquiry.
I e-mail them on tuesday, It goes something like this.

**********
Sirs,
I am very interested in your X4 Plus product.
Can you please provide detailed technical information about the machine, including Axis drive system (23 or 34? servo or stepper), DRO system (What feeds the DRO?) If you have a manual in pdf or doc format that would be appreciated. I need pricing good for 30 days including shipping to xxxxx zip.
Please also quote Flood coolant system, fourth Axis, Steel Stand, MGP.
Tooling kits or clamping kits available? Quick Change?

I'm not a big fan of Mach 3 and parallel input. Can I use a FlashCut controller or WinCNC? What would the price be without the stepper drives? Should I desire servo drives.
Sorry but your webpage just doesn’t provide enough information.

I will be making my purchase decision in 10 days.
I will need availability of the product. When I order, what is the "time to delivery"?
*************

Now I have been looking for a couple of months, And I can be a patient man. But not even an automated response saying they got my request. So today I decide to call Syil. And guess who I got to talk to? A GD answering service!
This poor girl knew nothing. I asked to speak to a Sales rep. She stated she would e-mail them with my contact information. CRAP ! I've done that already ! She stated she had no direct line into them. WOW my expectations just got kicked to the curb.

Whats going on here? I would think that in this troubled economy a company would be delighted to know someone is about to drop $6.5K of hard earned cash in their pocket.

Sure I do ask for some options not listed on their web page but that because a 14 yearold could have put that page together, and probably did. From what I have read I'm not alone in feeling Syil lacks in the information department.
Pictures are nice, but in this particular industry Technical data is KING.

My Advice, If your going to offer a product for sale. SELL IT ! Have sales people ready to answer the phone and close the deal. Have information on your website to inform the potential customer of available documentation, Pre-shipping quality control and Shipping process.

Note: for those of you like me who want to see a manual I found it posted here on CNCZONE http://syil.com.cn/en/Download.asp NOT on SYIL's website.

Hey Syil ! I have cash in hand! Want to close the deal ? Contact me.
If not I can go to Smithy, Sieg, or Tormach. You decide.

Gosh, I don't mean to be harsh. But customers make the world go around.
I'm sure I will love the X4+ if I can get a sales person to talk to me.


Michael
____________________________________

This country was built on Ideas and those who look outside the box.
Get out of your box and do something.

[syil]

how are you,
frist i`m not got your any emails.
and you can call syil america Mr jeff cell number: 541-404-7999
or richard 541-404-7941
or call me or email me at sales@syil.com.cn/0086-13957850550
i`m glad to help you to finish the order.
or left your number,i will ask them contact you immediately.ok?

[sharpshooter90]

Originally Posted by MichaelBurton Hello everyone, I'm about to pull the trigger on my decision to purchase a Syil X4+. After looking at Tormach (Love the Tormach, but a bit more than I need.), Smithy, and Syil, Syil looks to be the winner. However. . . Does one measure a product on pre-sales response time? I know I sure do. After having done 6 months worth of on line research I'm ready to approach the Syil sales department with my pre-purchase inquiry. I e-mail them on tuesday, It goes something like this. ********** Sirs, I am very interested in your X4 Plus product. Can you please provide detailed technical information about the machine, including Axis drive system (23 or 34? servo or stepper), DRO system (What feeds the DRO?) If you have a manual in pdf or doc format that would be appreciated. I need pricing good for 30 days including shipping to xxxxx zip. Please also quote Flood coolant system, fourth Axis, Steel Stand, MGP. Tooling kits or clamping kits available? Quick Change? I'm not a big fan of Mach 3 and parallel input. Can I use a FlashCut controller or WinCNC? What would the price be without the stepper drives? Should I desire servo drives. Sorry but your webpage just doesn’t provide enough information. I will be making my purchase decision in 10 days. I will need availability of the product. When I order, what is the "time to delivery"? ************* Now I have been looking for a couple of months, And I can be a patient man. But not even an automated response saying they got my request. So today I decide to call Syil. And guess who I got to talk to? A GD answering service! This poor girl knew nothing. I asked to speak to a Sales rep. Whats going on here? I would think that in this troubled economy a company would be delighted to know someone is about to drop $6.5K of hard earned cash in their pocket. My Advice, If your going to offer a product for sale. SELL IT ! Have sales people ready to answer the phone and close the deal. Have information on your website to inform the potential customer of available documentation, Pre-shipping quality control and Shipping process. Hey Syil ! I have cash in hand! Want to close the deal ? Contact me. If not I can go to Smithy, Sieg, or Tormach. You decide. Michael ____________________________________

Michael,
On another thread I posted my opinion of Syil's business plan. I think your experience re inforces my comments. In order to rapidly expand their network they have made the mistake of offering franchises to anyone who will buy 1 or 2 machines. This often attracts people more interested in getting a machine for themselves at a discount than people willing to commit time and money to a long term business plan. These "dealers" then take orders and Syil ships direct to the end user on an LTL basis. Syil recognized the error of this method and the problems of freight damage. With the type of experience you have, you would be better off to buy a stripped down machine direct from China and do your own QC and install your own electronics.

[Kevin Moore]

Hi,

I purchased a Syil SX3 complete with 4th axis, clamping kit, tooling etc. 1 year ago. I have had excellent service from Richard and Jeff at Syil America. Their service after the sale has been excellent. They usually respond to e-mails very quickly, occasionally 1-2 days. I had a ballscrew go bad after 11 months, had a replacement screw complete in 48 hours under warranty. I would recommend them, and their product, anytime. Just my 2 cents worth.


Kevin Moore
K&L CLOCK SHOP

[ataxy]

bought a syil x4+ from syil canada and had no problem with the sale service, i even had syil china emailing me to know that they were aware of my problem and looking into it, great service so far.

[Contract_Pilot]

I am trying to figure out the pricing?

http://syil.en.alibaba.com/product/2...e_X4_Plus.html

Here is a link I found from the manufactures web site..

Payment & Shipping Terms:
Minimum Order Quantity: 1 Piece/Pieces
Price: FOB Ningbo USD 2900~3400
Packaging Details: Export Wood Packing
Delivery Time: 20 days
Supply Abiity: 100 Set/Sets per Month

I understand there is shipping cost involved to the local dealer and that they have to add that to the price but should not be over $800..

I am thinking it may be better to order direct from china?

[ataxy]

yes but there is more then shipping cost there is also wharehouse rent and paperwork that they are charging you but yes you are right they are less expensive if you buy them direct

[syil]

Originally Posted by Contract_Pilot I am trying to figure out the pricing? http://syil.en.alibaba.com/product/2...e_X4_Plus.html Here is a link I found from the manufactures web site.. Payment & Shipping Terms: Minimum Order Quantity: 1 Piece/Pieces Price: FOB Ningbo USD 2900~3400 Packaging Details: Export Wood Packing Delivery Time: 20 days Supply Abiity: 100 Set/Sets per Month I understand there is shipping cost involved to the local dealer and that they have to add that to the price but should not be over $800.. I am thinking it may be better to order direct from china?

we do not sell directly from china for syil dealer area.
otherwise dealers will be no useful.
also,dealer when they stocks machine,also inspection after a long ship transport...it is very important.
if we sell directly,machine have problem,we hardly to konw during the langauge,also sent DHL or TNT of replacement parts very expensive.
hope you can understand,it is same a like car seller set distributor around the world....

[MichaelBurton]

Pilot, I know what your saying. I think everyone wants a fair shake on pricing. But if support is needed it's nice to know at least I have a dealer who would be more willing to talk to me because I bought from him. When I purchase, I will buy from US dealer. It just makes good business sense to to buy from authorized dealers. Hopefully I have not struck a nerve. And Syil has been quite prompt here in explaining his position, which I can respect. Richard has been in contact and I will be making my decision shortly. I also directed a few more questions to him. One thing I wish to note is the lack of vital information on the Syilamerica website as I mentioned before. So many of us expect information to be readily available. I believe it will get better.

Also I wish to appoligize for being rude in my first post if that is how it was percieved.
Admitedly I was a bit put off with the answering service. Same goes with automated attendents. I firmly believe that for business to survive in todays market personal and direct attention must be paid to the customer or potential customer. Hopefully my message is understood and no-one got their feelings hurt.

I am looking forward to doing business with SyilAmerica.


__________________________________________________________________________

As a member of this forum I cannot help but think I'm surrounded by some of the brightest people on the planet.
I am pleased to be in such good company.

[sharpshooter90]

Originally Posted by Contract_Pilot I am trying to figure out the pricing? http://syil.en.alibaba.com/product/2...e_X4_Plus.html Here is a link I found from the manufactures web site.. Payment & Shipping Terms: Minimum Order Quantity: 1 Piece/Pieces Price: FOB Ningbo USD 2900~3400 Packaging Details: Export Wood Packing Delivery Time: 20 days Supply Abiity: 100 Set/Sets per Month I understand there is shipping cost involved to the local dealer and that they have to add that to the price but should not be over $800.. I am thinking it may be better to order direct from china?

Contract,
You can do better than the quoted price with a little negotiation-probably more like 2375.00 FOB. LTL shipping to any US port will be about 250.00. If you do your own short form entry, there will be no brokerage charges, but you will pay the duty of 4.4% under class 8458.19.0020 14190 22no. This will put your landed cost at about 2740.00. As a matter of formality Syil will probably tell you that they cannot sell to you if you are in certain areas where they have dealers. However in casual conversation they may mention that if the stated country of final destination is not covered by dealer contracts they are free to sell to you. As an example, they may suggest that if the final destination is Tibet, in order to maintain quality control, you would have the machine trans shipped via USA for the purpose of inspection before sending it on. Then, if your Tibetan client suddenly changed his mind and cancelled the order, you would be stuck with a machine in your garage. Syil would have all the documents to prove that they thought the machine was going to Tibet. When times were good they required LC at sight, but lately the Chinese government has been trying to boost exports and some companies are offering terms of 30, 60 or even 90 day sight- never hurts to ask, since they are guaranteed payment by the LC.

[ataxy]

Originally Posted by sharpshooter90 Contract, You can do better than the quoted price with a little negotiation-probably more like 2375.00 FOB. LTL shipping to any US port will be about 250.00. If you do your own short form entry, there will be no brokerage charges, but you will pay the duty of 4.4% under class 8458.19.0020 14190 22no. This will put your landed cost at about 2740.00. As a matter of formality Syil will probably tell you that they cannot sell to you if you are in certain areas where they have dealers. However in casual conversation they may mention that if the stated country of final destination is not covered by dealer contracts they are free to sell to you. As an example, they may suggest that if the final destination is Tibet, in order to maintain quality control, you would have the machine trans shipped via USA for the purpose of inspection before sending it on. Then, if your Tibetan client suddenly changed his mind and cancelled the order, you would be stuck with a machine in your garage. Syil would have all the documents to prove that they thought the machine was going to Tibet. When times were good they required LC at sight, but lately the Chinese government has been trying to boost exports and some companies are offering terms of 30, 60 or even 90 day sight- never hurts to ask, since they are guaranteed payment by the LC.

could but a bit unethical.

[sharpshooter90]

Originally Posted by ataxy could but a bit unethical.

Ethics is not a big word in the Chinese business dictionary.