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Thread: SprutCAM 11 - Coming Soon!

  1. #25
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    Default Re: SprutCAM 11 - Coming Soon!

    Quote Originally Posted by mountaindew View Post
    I am sorry imho you are WRONG!
    I know software improves but sprutcam has problems opening files made by other users of the same version. And this should be a their main concern NOT added features. Added features does nothing if you cant use your previous files without problems. Backwards compatibility and bug fixes should be their number ONE concern when evaluating each code block that is added! I dont have one purchased program that has this problem except sprutcam. Freeware is that and I would expect problem because its free. Just think if you had to re draw every part because you updated software or new version. Re write every note or word in a book or anything else because of this problem. They are a professional software company and should know this! I use to consult and helped write code for a very complex software program for estimating huge construction projects. And the company was very very careful about this Most people cant even use this program very well. I can because I know how to look for bugs and work around them I also could guess what language its written in and the compiler used to compile it. uneducated guess is c# by microsoft! I use a couple very expensive programs that have no problem opening version 1 files all the way to version 15 files I dont expect version 1 to open version 15 files. Again INHO sprutcam could be a better product if they make it bullet proof and as error free as possible. Just ask tormach about the problems with their new rapid turn product. You try to avoid this as much as possible but sometimes it bites you. And ends up costing you more money then it will ever be worth short term anyway. People will move to other products if they find yours to be a problem to use.

    And NO I have not explained this to them I am a Dumb user and they are PROFESSIONAL software developers and should KNOW this. btw I know that software is like the game of chess 12 moves into the game the number of branches approaches infinity so it pays to be very careful and to control every branch! imho its nice to get feedback from customers and use their ideas. but not at the expense of added bugs and backwards compatibility!

    It looks like Sprutcam started this thread and I hope they use my user FEEDBACK.


    BTW I spent 12 hours figuring out a simple error when I upgraded from 9 to 10. The chip pan in the machine definition had NOTHING to do with my PART or my operations caused me to spend that much time. I showed this to the tech support they said it was my fixtures that was causing problem . And it was the chip pan. now all my chips fall on the simulation floor. I would be embarrassed if such a simple error made its way into a new software distro like that. Hope companys that use this mentality never write code for flight systems of self driving cars

    This is my way of communicating the problem private or public makes no difference to me. If I am wrong I learn from it, change my methods sometimes reluctantly and try not build on it! Build on a bad foundation its just a matter of time before it fails.
    So, to summarize, you won't be upgrading?
    Step



  2. #26
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    Default Re: SprutCAM 11 - Coming Soon!

    Quote Originally Posted by TurboStep View Post
    So, to summarize, you won't be upgrading?
    Step
    I know my rants bother you
    Are my complaints valid or NOT?

    Probably not unless they allow me access to version 10 for as long as I need it with NO hassel of multi sub keys............... I noted in another thread changing over to autodesk cam tools. Only big difference is no real 4th axis support yet but its FREE. By far a larger user base in less then 3 years, I dont see that many complaints about bugs. Long term it might prove to be a better product. What can I say I dont like to do things twice. or spend hours chasing down a simple errors like chip pan on! lol



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    Default Re: SprutCAM 11 - Coming Soon!

    I am sorry imho you are WRONG!
    I know software improves but sprutcam has problems opening files made by other users of the same version. And this should be a their main concern NOT added features. Added features does nothing if you cant use your previous files without problems. Backwards compatibility and bug fixes should be their number ONE concern when evaluating each code block that is added! I dont have one purchased program that has this problem except sprutcam. Freeware is that and I would expect problem because its free. Just think if you had to re draw every part because you updated software or new version. Re write every note or word in a book or anything else because of this problem. They are a professional software company and should know this! I use to consult and helped write code for a very complex software program for estimating huge construction projects. And the company was very very careful about this Most people cant even use this program very well. I can because I know how to look for bugs and work around them I also could guess what language its written in and the compiler used to compile it. uneducated guess is c# by microsoft! I use a couple very expensive programs that have no problem opening version 1 files all the way to version 15 files I dont expect version 1 to open version 15 files. Again INHO sprutcam could be a better product if they make it bullet proof and as error free as possible. Just ask tormach about the problems with their new rapid turn product. You try to avoid this as much as possible but sometimes it bites you. And ends up costing you more money then it will ever be worth short term anyway. People will move to other products if they find yours to be a problem to use.

    And NO I have not explained this to them I am a Dumb user and they are PROFESSIONAL software developers and should KNOW this. btw I know that software is like the game of chess 12 moves into the game the number of branches approaches infinity so it pays to be very careful and to control every branch! imho its nice to get feedback from customers and use their ideas. but not at the expense of added bugs and backwards compatibility!

    It looks like Sprutcam started this thread and I hope they use my user FEEDBACK.


    BTW I spent 12 hours figuring out a simple error when I upgraded from 9 to 10. The chip pan in the machine definition had NOTHING to do with my PART or my operations caused me to spend that much time. I showed this to the tech support they said it was my fixtures that was causing problem . And it was the chip pan. now all my chips fall on the simulation floor. I would be embarrassed if such a simple error made its way into a new software distro like that. Hope companys that use this mentality never write code for flight systems of self driving cars

    This is my way of communicating the problem private or public makes no difference to me. If I am wrong I learn from it, change my methods sometimes reluctantly and try not build on it! Build on a bad foundation its just a matter of time before it fails.
    So whats the point of coming out with a new version if there are no new features? In talking with Tormach/SprutCAM America the dongle is now kept with us and upgrades are sent to that dongle, no exchanges which allows it to open previous versions so if you had contacted them, you would know this. I'm sorry but if performance is enhanced on the calculation of toolpaths, you will need to rerun them to take advantage of them. You also need to reopen them to take advantage of new features that do indeed help. Adaptive feedrate? Hell yeah i'll go back through 100 projects to cut run times down by minutes on my production parts if I get that feature. Id rather have it as an option than to not have my files load in 100% properly. To each their own.

    So a tech support guy gave you wrong feedback and you hold it against them for eternity? Ive seen you drop that fixture comment multiple times. I have found the tech to be very helpful and reactive to any issues I've had. I do sense a common denominator here though in that I have a level of expectation for a 1,300 dollar CAM software. You are holding it to the degree of an expensive software (id guess what? 10-15k?) for the price, there is nothing out there that gives you the functionality and performance of SprutCAM.



  4. #28
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    Default Re: SprutCAM 11 - Coming Soon!

    Quote Originally Posted by Phillyb24 View Post
    So whats the point of coming out with a new version if there are no new features? In talking with Tormach/SprutCAM America the dongle is now kept with us and upgrades are sent to that dongle, no exchanges which allows it to open previous versions so if you had contacted them, you would know this. I'm sorry but if performance is enhanced on the calculation of toolpaths, you will need to rerun them to take advantage of them. You also need to reopen them to take advantage of new features that do indeed help. Adaptive feedrate? Hell yeah i'll go back through 100 projects to cut run times down by minutes on my production parts if I get that feature. Id rather have it as an option than to not have my files load in 100% properly. To each their own.

    So a tech support guy gave you wrong feedback and you hold it against them for eternity? Ive seen you drop that fixture comment multiple times. I have found the tech to be very helpful and reactive to any issues I've had. I do sense a common denominator here though in that I have a level of expectation for a 1,300 dollar CAM software. You are holding it to the degree of an expensive software (id guess what? 10-15k?) for the price, there is nothing out there that gives you the functionality and performance of SprutCAM.
    "I have a level of expectation for a 1,300 dollar CAM software."
    What does cost have to do with quality. Using that as a basis for products. Example cheap cnc machines are dangerous, break down all the time and are worthless, The way I see it if they are designed and built efficiently not over built or under built for the intended use the cost and quality can be controlled. I have overpaid for terrible products and saved money by using good products that were priced competitively.
    Many products like this, price is based on how much money you can make using their product and the developer wants to slide the price around to maximize their roi for their product. Example accounting software for a huge construction company cost $100k per year. same software for a smaller company cost $10k per year. ask me how I know? Another example of the opposite side of that issue. Ford truck used for hauling stuff makes 5k$ per month and one that sets in drive way cost 800$ a month both cost the same in that case.


    "So a tech support guy gave you wrong feedback and you hold it against them for eternity?"
    They hold it against ME! I just point out the facts as I see them. And always say its my opinion. I respect your opinion also!

    Heck its worth the update if they fix the simple chip pan error so my simulated chips stop falling on my simulated floor "did they ever fix that?" or allow access to this module so I can fix it myself .? Just saying I would be embarrassed if this happened, and in fact I was thinking it was a joke played on users. or added by a unhappy employee.

    . I hold that against them because I explained in advance I looked at this for a number of hours before contacting them. Also I have a great deal of experience with this program and I am not a NEW USER! Support looked at it long enough to jumped to the conclusion it was MY problem. Funny I fixed it myself and it was NOT my problem. If I zeroed out a person well I am sorry he or she should have taken more time and actually asked others for help before telling me it was my problem. If they took it personal so did I and they are no better then ME and in fact I have reported other bugs and I guess this person does not like me so it effects his support for me and demanded I Prove there was a bug. I laughed I can list hundreds that everybody can and does see every day. OK Can I get another support person if this person does not like me? I will ask you next time? Are you willing to help me for free? I have spent many hours helping others around here on this program because I like to. Not getting paid to do it. If I was, I would be a professional sprutcam support and be paid to take the time to help and ask for more information.

    Foot note: I reported a bug in path pilot that causes the program to jump to last operation and run without tool change and drove a 75$ end mill into 75$ vice jaws and scared me. " one of those wow what just happend" ,always thinking it user error, I spent a great deal of time looking and finding the problem Before I reported it. I found this bug the first day of use on first release "distro" in linux lingo. Provided a detailed example of it. And I would have to check this new version but it was in last version. I guess it is deep in the linux cnc kernal and not easy to fix!


    Anyway this boring. I moved on! I will speak of this no more all fun and a spirited discussion!



  5. #29
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    mountaindew is absolutly right (I could hug you for your posts ). The first thing SprutCAM should do is to fix the massive bugs in their versions (I have 9,10 and 11). For 2 years I tried to figure out what the community thinks about a bug tracking system:
    https://en.industryarena.com/forum/w...m--279676.html
    But the people began to list the problems in this thread. This was not my intension...
    But I still think it would be a good idea. It's a win win situation for both sides: SprutCAM and his customers.
    There are many people who know "there" Bugs. Maybe they told it to SprutCAM America. But what happens? Nobody knows it! Every Upgrade and Version(!) you must check it. But the bug still exists!!!

    I'm from germany and I know that "SprutCAM Germany" has good contacts to the developer team in russia. But the support in Germany is horrible. They are not interested in any problems I told them (incl. Video). I mailed the russia team... no answer.

    They only integrate new features. But the problems still exists. And in my opinion: the problems grow.

    The Software "SprutCAM" will die, if they further ignore the problems in the software.
    I hope the Version 12 will only be a great Bugfix (My dream: no kernel errors, a im- and export for 3D models (so it has the same structure after a reimport), a working im- and export for job trees, and many many more... but also speed)

    Sorry about my english... I hope you understand me.



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