How to get SprutCAM to NOT call out m998 and tool changes

[beanbag]

I am using SC 7.1.3 and 7.1.5 (Don't ask why) with a Tormach CNC machine. Since it does not have a tool changer, I break the postprocessor output into one file per tool. I have a few minor problems which always require me to hand edit the g code.

1) How do I get SC to STOP calling out M998 (and also G43) at the beginning and end of each file? It causes MAch 3 to complain because I haven't referenced the machine and don't want to anyway.

2) Sometimes I have multiple operations done with one tool, like roughing waterline followed by 2D contour as a finish pass. However, I still get a M998, M5 M3, and a G43 between each of the operations. Obviously I don't need to stop and restart the spindle. I tried messing with the values of "Tool change position" as well as making sure I have the same tool number for each operation, but that didn't seem to do anything.

[MetalShavings]

Greetings beanbag:

I wish I had the answers you're looking for.

I just wanted to welcome you to the frustrating world of SprutCAM ownership. I wish that I were experiencing only the problems you're inquiring about.

I don't want to presume to speak for all SprutCAM users but, some of us have experienced or, are experiencing frustration with this software on an order of magnitude that I'm sure has robbed some of the time off of our lifespan.

The irony is that most of the answers we're seeking are simple ones. It's just that the software seems to be set up in such a complicated way that finding those simple fixes is next to impossible without a SprutCAM guru to help you out; and those gurus are few and far between.

I long for the day when I can stop whining about the misery this software causes and start using it to its full potential.

There are folks here that have experienced few if any problems. I envy them. There are others I'm sure, that have just grown weary of it all and just given up on this software. You don't hear to much from these two groups of folks for obvious reasons.

If you don't get the answers you're looking for here, there are a couple of other SprutCAM specific forums that may be able to help.

Hang in there. Don't allow this to ruin whatever ambitions brought you into CNC. Even though these setbacks and frustrations are enough to drive a person to drug abuse, all is not lost.

MetalShavings

[TXFred]

Originally Posted by beanbag I am using SC 7.1.3 and 7.1.5 (Don't ask why) with a Tormach CNC machine. Since it does not have a tool changer, I break the postprocessor output into one file per tool. I have a few minor problems which always require me to hand edit the g code. 1) How do I get SC to STOP calling out M998 (and also G43) at the beginning and end of each file? It causes MAch 3 to complain because I haven't referenced the machine and don't want to anyway. 2) Sometimes I have multiple operations done with one tool, like roughing waterline followed by 2D contour as a finish pass. However, I still get a M998, M5 M3, and a G43 between each of the operations. Obviously I don't need to stop and restart the spindle. I tried messing with the values of "Tool change position" as well as making sure I have the same tool number for each operation, but that didn't seem to do anything.

I'm really baffled by this post. You're not referencing your mill when you first start it up? Why not? Doing that will eliminate the Mach errors.

Also, why are you breaking up your gcode? If you don't have a tool changer, then Mach will move to the tool change position and wait for you to swap tools. But that will only work if you have homed the machine, because the tool change position is defined in machine coordinates.

And why don't you want G43?

As for the extra tool change commands, those don't happen in the current version of Sprut. You could see if the most recent Tormach post will work with your older version.

Frederic

[dbrija]

Originally Posted by beanbag I am using SC 7.1.3 and 7.1.5 (Don't ask why) with a Tormach CNC machine. Since it does not have a tool changer, I break the postprocessor output into one file per tool. I have a few minor problems which always require me to hand edit the g code. 1) How do I get SC to STOP calling out M998 (and also G43) at the beginning and end of each file? It causes MAch 3 to complain because I haven't referenced the machine and don't want to anyway. 2) Sometimes I have multiple operations done with one tool, like roughing waterline followed by 2D contour as a finish pass. However, I still get a M998, M5 M3, and a G43 between each of the operations. Obviously I don't need to stop and restart the spindle. I tried messing with the values of "Tool change position" as well as making sure I have the same tool number for each operation, but that didn't seem to do anything.

Same question as TXFred... Why would you not home, and use G43 to apply your tool length offsets?

As to how to stop that output, depends on whether you have the "All Posts" or the "PCNC only" version of SC. With "All Posts", you can modify the post processor to omit M998, etc....

[beanbag]

Originally Posted by TXFred I'm really baffled by this post. You're not referencing your mill when you first start it up? Why not? Because I don't need to. Doing that will eliminate the Mach errors. Also, why are you breaking up your gcode? So that I can easily modify individual operations. For example, I have two separate files for spotting and then drilling. I might decide after spotting that the divots should be deeper. Trivial to change the g code and run it again. If you don't have a tool changer, then Mach will move to the tool change position and wait for you to swap tools. But that will only work if you have homed the machine, because the tool change position is defined in machine coordinates. I don't want the tool to move to some pre-defined machine position. I usually insert in a G0 Z3 or press the page up button. And why don't you want G43? Because I don't own the machine. I just come in with my tools, zero them, make the part, and then pack up my stuff and leave. No need to mess with somebody else's tool table. As for the extra tool change commands, those don't happen in the current version of Sprut. You could see if the most recent Tormach post will work with your older version. 95% of the computers I have access to have SC 7.1.3, so I prefer to stick to that version to avoid backward compatibility issues. Using the latest post processor on that didn't help and just gave me an annoying dialog box about flipping the A axis.

I hope this answers all your questions.

[Eric_Tormach]

The post processors are developed in conjunction with Tormach to be compatible with the approved way to operate the machine.
If a custom post is needed then I can make one, but I do not normally do this as I would have to make a new post for everyone who is using the machine in a "unique" manner.
As far as the multiple tool change call outs are concerned dbrija is correct, that was a bug issue with that version please talk to tech shop as they are able to update the software to the newest version.
The annoying A axis flipping dialog box just needs you to click "OK" if you don't need to flip the a axis code. There is a ATC post that eliminates the M998.
There should be no need to break up your code to find the G-code that you want to edit, just do a search and find in the text editor for the canned cycle cal lout (G8 .etc).

[TXFred]

Originally Posted by beanbag Because I don't need to. (reference the mill)

You really do need to do this, regardless of how you're running your program. Homing the machine should always be the first thing you do on any mill. It costs you nothing to do this, and has several advantages already described. Plus, it lets you shut down the mill and come back later without losing your work offsets. That's a major advantage.

I ran my last mill for a while without home switches. It sucked. So I'm speaking from experience.

I don't want the tool to move to some pre-defined machine position. I usually insert in a G0 Z3 or press the page up button.

I'm not sure why not. It's a very safe way to do things. You can even set the tool change coordinates to not move the machine at all (input 999.999 for the values), then the M998 would do nothing at all.

My mill is currently set for no movement in X and Y, and a full retract in Z (enter 0 for this, the head travels all the way up to machine zero).

Because I don't own the machine. I just come in with my tools, zero them, make the part, and then pack up my stuff and leave. No need to mess with somebody else's tool table.

I understand that. If you're being loaned the mill, you don't want to cause problems for the owner.

How many tools do you have? You could talk to the machine owner and see if he would give you a group of tool and offset numbers all your own. For instance, if you have ten tool holders, see if he'll let you use tool numbers 201-210, and work offsets G58 and G59. That would let you have your tool offsets in the table, and have two predefined work offsets, without affecting anything else.

Has the owner has signed Tormach's waiver? If so, you can copy the Mach configuration and edit the copy. That copy would have all your settings, tools and offsets in it. Your config would be independent of the owner's config, which would give you a lot more freedom and flexibility, as well as saving setup time.

If he doesn't have the unlocked config, perhaps a second copy of Mach could be installed to a different directory. When you want to run the mill, start the second copy, which would have your configuration, offsets and tool table in it.

These may not be the answers you want. I don't know how to edit a SprutCAM post, so I cannot give good advice there. But you'll find that things go smoother if you can work with the owner on this. You'll have the mill working the way it was meant to work, which means faster production for your work, and no need to edit your gcode after posting it.

Frederic

[beanbag]

Originally Posted by Eric_Tormach There should be no need to break up your code to find the G-code that you want to edit, just do a search and find in the text editor for the canned cycle cal lout (G8 .etc).

Let's say I have a very simple Sprut program that is just spot drilling, hole drilling, and then end milling on sheet metal. I roll it up into one file that has the tool changes and offsets. As I run the program, I find that the holes weren't quite deep enough and didn't fully poke thru the sheet metal, so I need to run the drilling part again. How can I do this if I just have one big file that includes all operations?

99.9% of the time, I have separate files for each tool operation. This is because the only thing I bring in is my cutting tools, which I then mount into the ER collets. I zero against the part and go. Afterwards, I take the tool out of the holder and go home. Since I usually make only one part, I have no need for M998 nor the tool length offsets. If I need to use a tool twice, I use the alternate coordinate systems g55, g56, etc. It takes 10 seconds of additional time to close and reload a new g code file.

There was only one time I used the tool length offsets, doing menial production work that required tool changes.

[TXFred]

Originally Posted by beanbag Let's say I have a very simple Sprut program that is just spot drilling, hole drilling, and then end milling on sheet metal. I roll it up into one file that has the tool changes and offsets. As I run the program, I find that the holes weren't quite deep enough and didn't fully poke thru the sheet metal, so I need to run the drilling part again. How can I do this if I just have one big file that includes all operations?

There's a "Set Next Line" function in Mach. Just scroll to the correct point in the program, Set Next Line, start the spindle and coolant manually to be on the safe side, and Cycle Start.

Play around with it in the air first, to get a feel for it.

There's also a "Run From Here" but that does preparatory moves. And on my Tormach, it moves to Z=0 and then makes an XY move, which is just bloody stupid. So I avoid using that function.

Frederic



Frederic