new versions of Huanyang VFD -- can they use a braking resistor?

[unterhaus]

I have the 4K version of the new style HY vfd. It doesn't have the same main circuit board as the old ones, and I understand there is no place to put in the IGBT's for the braking circuit. I'm wondering if they really did away with it, or if they decided to make it work themselves. Where the wire used to come in from the IGBT is now some large white component that I haven't identified yet.

I was thinking I would just hook up a resistor and see if it works, but I have to remember where I hid them.

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[unterhaus]

it looks like it's just as simple with the new ones. Ok, I'm not positive, but this person seems to have a new version A Different Kind of Chinese Motor Controller?! Adding Dynamic Braking to your Inexpensive Chinese VFD | equals zero
I'll check back once I have explored the mod a little more

[ger21]

Not sure which version you have, but I bought mine I think a few months before you started this thread, and it doesn't have the braking circuit. You can tell by just looking at the board at the braking resistor terminals.

There's a long thread at the Machsupport forum on adding the missing components, but it's a bit more involved than what I wanted to do.

[unterhaus]

yes, I'm familiar with the machsupport forum thread, but nobody has addressed the new design. I am pretty sure the VFD at the link I provided matches my VFD. It actually looks easier than the older design. Of course, I could be wrong.

I really want to use my lathe today, or I would look at it. Unfortunately, digikey doesn't have the IGBT, but mouser has both parts. The only trick looks to be soldering the optocoulpler. Okay, soldering the IGBT doesn't look that easy either.

I was thinking about building an external braking module, but if this works, I'm not going to do it. My lathe really needs external braking, it has huge inertia. It has a monster of a gearbox.

[mactec54]

I have the 4K version of the new style HY vfd. It doesn't have the same main circuit board as the old ones, and I understand there is no place to put in the IGBT's for the braking circuit. I'm wondering if they really did away with it, or if they decided to make it work themselves. Where the wire used to come in from the IGBT is now some large white component that I haven't identified yet.

I was thinking I would just hook up a resistor and see if it works, but I have to remember where I hid them.

The IGBT has noting to do with the Breaking resistor

[mactec54]

yes, I'm familiar with the machsupport forum thread, but nobody has addressed the new design. I am pretty sure the VFD at the link I provided matches my VFD. It actually looks easier than the older design. Of course, I could be wrong.

I really want to use my lathe today, or I would look at it. Unfortunately, digikey doesn't have the IGBT, but mouser has both parts. The only trick looks to be soldering the optocoulpler. Okay, soldering the IGBT doesn't look that easy either.

I was thinking about building an external braking module, but if this works, I'm not going to do it. My lathe really needs external braking, it has huge inertia. It has a monster of a gearbox.

The IGBT has nothing to do with the breaking resistor, did you smoke your VFD, if you did not, then why would you be replacing the IGBT, post a photo of what you are trying to do

[unterhaus]

you need an igbt to drive the braking resistor. Do you understand how braking circuits work? When you brake, the back emf from the motor drives the voltage of the dc bus up. The braking igbt pulls current through the braking resistor to dissipate that extra energy and keeping the voltage within limits. the current has to be controlled, thus the igbt.

[unterhaus]

Back to the topic at hand, here is the post that stopped me from working on this when I bought the VFD. Huanyang VFD controller plugin

edited this, he posted the old circuit and the new circuit. New circuit definitely is missing the igbt

[lonewolf55]

you also need to add D1 and a pair of 18 Volt zeners across the Gate and Emitter of the new IGBT that you add, these components are for Protection. and yes they work fine

EDIT: on the 4KW units the D1 is D3 marked on the PCB between the External Resistor Connectors.

[lonewolf55]

And just a Note: the Torque specs for tightening the screws on the FGH60N60SMD TO-247 IGBT is 10 in/lbs Max.
also I might add that the TLP701 is a medium current device and the TLP701AF is a Small current device there is no speed difference between the 2 as stated in the link you posted... the TLP701 will work fine.

[mactec54]

Back to the topic at hand, here is the post that stopped me from working on this when I bought the VFD. Huanyang VFD controller plugin

edited this, he posted the old circuit and the new circuit. New circuit definitely is missing the igbt

If the IGBT where missing the VFD would not run at all, the IGBT is one of the main components that make a VFD run, without it there is no VFD, the basic photo below shows you what part is the IGBT

[lonewolf55]

Mactec54 we are talking about the Missing IGBT's in the HY VFD's you only get Dynamic Braking if you order the unit with this option, IF you don't have the option then you need to add parts to the PCB that are missing.

[lonewolf55]

Back to the topic at hand, here is the post that stopped me from working on this when I bought the VFD. Huanyang VFD controller plugin

edited this, he posted the old circuit and the new circuit. New circuit definitely is missing the igbt

It looks to me like he has posted the 2.2KW units and the final one he posted is the HY Clone .. all the New Cheap HY clones do not have provisions on the PCB to add Braking Components, The actual HY made units still have the Board etched for the components, unless you order the Braking Option they just don't come populated with the Brake support components, but you can still add them yourself, BUT be sure what you are buying the FW is also Different on the Clones too.

[mactec54]

Mactec54 we are talking about the Missing IGBT's in the HY VFD's you only get Dynamic Braking if you order the unit with this option, IF you don't have the option then you need to add parts to the PCB that are missing.

Correct that's not called an IGBT circuit, its a Chopper circuit, which has ( 1 ) IGBT in it, This is connected through the DC Bus, the only part of a VFD that you refer to as IGBT, is the output stage of the VFD

I know these drives inside out and have repaired many of them

The only problem by add these components so he can use the breaking resistor, the firmware may not have been configured, I know most of the older one's it was active, in some of the drives only

I have the special code to get into the firmware, the rest he would have to do himself, it's easy to mess it up by setting the wrong Parameters in the firmware

[lonewolf55]

it is in Fact called an IGBT an IGBT is simply an Isolated Gate Bipolar Transistor and yes the Circuit it's being used in is called a Chopper, however many VFD don't use IGBT in the Output Inverter section some use Thyristors (SCR) NMOS MOSFETS and various other electronic components used for high current switching.

And I Imagine most that mess with these inverters like myself also have the 0260F8A-AU3-55113
VFD code as it's extremely easy to dump and disassemble and understand when you know how to use various Atmel tools

[mactec54]

it is in Fact called an IGBT an IGBT is simply an Isolated Gate Bipolar Transistor and yes the Circuit it's being used in is called a Chopper, however many VFD don't use IGBT in the Output Inverter section some use Thyristors (SCR) NMOS MOSFETS and various other electronic components used for high current switching.

And I Imagine most that mess with these inverters like myself also have the 0260F8A-AU3-55113
VFD code as it's extremely easy to dump and disassemble and understand when you know how to use various Atmel tools

You say you know a lot about and work on VFD Drives, then why in your diagram, what you are referencing, is incorrect

That is not the code to access the firmware for these VFD Drives You don't have to dump anything or have any Atmel tools

The out put stages are called IGBT modules and almost all VFD Drives use them, including this VFD Drive

The single IGBT being used is a MOS FET, and is a single unit that dumps the excess back EMF voltage out to the external braking resistor, or the smaller internal resistor, if it was installed

[unterhaus]

mactec54, with all due respect, you are not fully informed on this subject. You can go look at my links and prove yourself wrong.. I feel like you should do that before posting in here any more, but obviously I'm not going to do anything to stop you.

These inexpensive Chinese drives don't use modules, I assume the discretes are somewhat less expensive for them. When I designed a drive, I used a module, and I think most high-end designs use modules. Until you get up to really high power drives, where I think they go back to discretes. And for me, a module was cheaper. The discretes in my HY VFD cost 4-6$ apiece, vs about $10 for the modules I used.

[unterhaus]

you also need to add D1 and a pair of 18 Volt zeners across the Gate and Emitter of the new IGBT that you add, these components are for Protection. and yes they work fine

EDIT: on the 4KW units the D1 is D3 marked on the PCB between the External Resistor Connectors.

lonewolf55, thanks for your clarifying posts. The ebay vendor I bought from went to great lengths to make it look like my drive is a real HY, so I hope they weren't lying. I have never seen anyone list a HY vfd with the braking circuit as an option, do you know of a vendor?

And I Imagine most that mess with these inverters like myself also have the 0260F8A-AU3-55113
VFD code as it's extremely easy to dump and disassemble and understand when you know how to use various Atmel tools

what is that part number? Google refuses to reveal. I have never seen a reference to anyone messing with the firmware before now. Are these VFD's controlled by an 8051 device?

[lonewolf55]

lonewolf55, thanks for your clarifying posts. The ebay vendor I bought from went to great lengths to make it look like my drive is a real HY, so I hope they weren't lying. I have never seen anyone list a HY vfd with the braking circuit as an option, do you know of a vendor?


what is that part number? Google refuses to reveal. I have never seen a reference to anyone messing with the firmware before now. Are these VFD's controlled by an 8051 device?

ok first off to Get a unit that has the Brake option installed one needs to contact the HY reps and request this feature at either this website Huanyang Electrical Co Ltd - China Exporter, Manufacturer | HKTDC

or you need to contact support at this website, it is in Chinese so you may need to use your Browser Translate feature ??????????

Ok now for information on the MCU that controls this inverter PN 0260F8A see this Data Sheet and you should have all the info you need https://www.renesas.com/en-in/doc/pr...1_16c26ads.pdf

From that point it should not be hard to figure out what Programmer to use, anyway I'm sorry the other person doesn't understand that an IGBT is not called a MOSFET but the Part number of the IGBT is FGH60N60SMD and the Zener Diodes are 1N4746A for D3 I use a 1N4007.

But anyway I'm not here in these Forums asking for help with inverters, but I do hope my posts are helpful to those that are asking for help

[mactec54]

mactec54, with all due respect, you are not fully informed on this subject. You can go look at my links and prove yourself wrong.. I feel like you should do that before posting in here any more, but obviously I'm not going to do anything to stop you.

These inexpensive Chinese drives don't use modules, I assume the discretes are somewhat less expensive for them. When I designed a drive, I used a module, and I think most high-end designs use modules. Until you get up to really high power drives, where I think they go back to discretes. And for me, a module was cheaper. The discretes in my HY VFD cost 4-6$ apiece, vs about $10 for the modules I used.

I'm well a where the these cheap drives don't have a potted module, as I already said I have repaired lots of them, not so many now as they have improved the competent ratings, and quality

More informed than you will ever be, We manufacture a IBGT intelligent module, for OEM user's which are used in VFD Drives and AC Servo Drives

If you where so good at this why did you bother to start a thread, wanting information on what to do, what you needed to do is a walk in the park, if you know how