VFD protection filter etc.

[Al_The_Man]

naspc: Does the EMC/EMI filter go before the VFD or after the VFD on the cable that goes to the Spindle.
Anyone using EMC/EMI filters can recommend one?

If putting any money into a filter, I would personally use a 3 phase inductor on the output side of the VFD, these protect the VFD and the motor.
Al.

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[naspc]

Al,

Will this work?
AC Tech Lenze 508-120 EMC Filter - 20 Amps, 1

[Al_The_Man]

I prefer these line reactors, between VFD and motor.
https://www.automationdirect.com/adc...3&TxnNumber=-1
Al.

[qwertysimo]

Are not line reactors intended for scenarios with many VFDs attached to mains?
E.g. instructions for Huanyang VFDs say that AC reactor is recommended for power factor improvement if the input capacity is more than 1000 kVA.

When installed on the load side, will it have any positive effects to VFD when used with e.g. small 2.2 kW spinde?

[Al_The_Man]

The option is to fit line reactors on either supply or motor side, or both.
Many manufacturers extol the advantages and benefits they give to both motor and VFD by installing between VFD and Motor, particularly in the case of long VFD to motor cable run.
I have always installed them this way.
Al.

[mactec54]

Are not line reactors intended for scenarios with many VFDs attached to mains?
E.g. instructions for Huanyang VFDs say that AC reactor is recommended for power factor improvement if the input capacity is more than 1000 kVA.

When installed on the load side, will it have any positive effects to VFD when used with e.g. small 2.2 kW spinde?

It can and will always have a Positive effect, no matter what size motor/spindle is in a system, but is it for you, low cost motor/spindles/VFD Drives hardly has any effect apart from helping with noise in the system, the cost is the factor and if you have to be EMI compliant

Different manufactures sometimes will tell you what may work best, an output AC Reactor smooth's out the PWM wave form, getting it closer to a Sinewave form, in most case's Hobby level, where Spindle only cost from $200 to $400 Dollars, your money may be better spent in other places, using a input Power Filter on the Power supply, is inexpensive, and can clean up the power in your system

The main thing is do you have a problem in your system or because people are talking about it this is a must have ??

Not one Size fits all, a Reactor has to be sizes to suit your application, so you can't just go buy one and wire it into your system.

Line Reactors can Protect your Ac Motor/Spindle, and reduce Power Line Distortion from your VFD Drive

On the line side, reactors will stabilize the current waveform, which reduces harmonic distortion that mess with upstream electrical equipment, so you have to decide which is best for your system.

The use of line and load reactors will increases the reliability, performance, and efficiency of your VFD drive system, it can extend the life, of both drive and Motor/Spindle, and can reduce the amount of energy consumed by the Motor/Drive system.

[qwertysimo]

The main thing is do you have a problem in your system or because people are talking about it this is a must have ??

I have not observed any problems related to EMI so far.

Any idea where I could buy line reactors in Europe? I found one item in Farnell and one in TME - not many options indeed.

[Al_The_Man]

Any idea where I could buy line reactors in Europe? I found one item in Farnell and one in TME - not many options indeed.

Check out any of the VFD manufacturers, most also sell a line of reactors or can recommend a make etc.
Schaffner is one source.
Al.

[naspc]

How would I select the best reactor for my scenario?

[Al_The_Man]

See the Automation Direct link I posted, they go by the voltage/HP.
Al.

[naspc]

See the Automation Direct link I posted, they go by the voltage/HP.
Al.

That might be a problem. I don't know the HP on the spindle. I assume it has to be a 230v. Can I go big on the HP?

[Dan911]

If you have a 2.7kw spindle than its 3.6 Hp

[naspc]

I Would it be ok to get 2 230V 5hp reactors? They have a 3hp and 5hp.

[mactec54]

I Would it be ok to get 2 230V 5hp reactors? They have a 3hp and 5hp.

Here is some reading for you, no you would not have 2 of the same

[qwertysimo]

Schaffner is one source.

It seems to be twice the price compared to automationdirect.com products...

Well, I have 2.2 kW chinese spindle and considering the spindle eBay price, does it have any practical effect to use load reactor with it? Will be the spindle life extended? Will it run cooler? Will it be quiter? Can you witness any of these aspects? I somehow consider this spindle to be a consumer products.

[mactec54]

It seems to be twice the price compared to automationdirect.com products...

Well, I have 2.2 kW chinese spindle and considering the spindle eBay price, does it have any practical effect to use load reactor with it? Will be the spindle life extended? Will it run cooler? Will it be quiter? Can you witness any of these aspects? I somehow consider this spindle to be a consumer products.

You are correct in what you are saying, as I already posted this, if you have a cheap spindle, the only benefit is that you can become EMI compliant some country's, have standards that have to be meet to be EMI compliant

[naspc]

You are correct in what you are saying, as I already posted this, if you have a cheap spindle, the only benefit is that you can become EMI compliant some country's, have standards that have to be meet to be EMI compliant

So are you saying its not necessary to have a line reactor?

[qwertysimo]

So are you saying its not necessary to have a line reactor?

Everything you need to run spindle is VFD and mains!

Everything else is optional - more or less recommended for safety or interference reasons.

[naspc]

That makes sense. I would still like to know how to pick the right ones for my setup. There is formula in the attachment that mactec posted.

240/20=12ohms 3%x12ohms=0.36ohms

'Your drive distributor should be able to help you size a reactor for use with a drive. If you wish to calculate
the value yourself, the following example may be helpful. If a 3% reactor was required for a 100 amp 480
volt drive, a 100 amp or larger current rating would be required. The drive impedance would be: Z=V/I or0
480/100 = 4.8 ohms. 3% X 4.8 ohms = 0.114 ohms inserting this 0.114 impedance in the equation for
inductance we get a value of about 300 Microhenrys.'

[Al_The_Man]

Everything else is optional - more or less recommended for safety or interference reasons.

On the motor side the main reason is to suppress harmonics etc that can damage both motor and/or VFD, especially in the case of a non-vector rated motor.
Al.