Buying a Shopmaster Patriot

[Roadster]

You received a machine that you found unsatisfactory. You could have exercised your warranty and returned the machine for a refund less shipping. Just as you knew when you bought the machine. Period.

I will evaluate my machine when it arrives. If I'm satisfied, fine. If not, I'll pack it up, hook up the RV and head to Nevada from North Carolina to return it or have Taylor make the necessary adjustment.. I'll enjoy a long hunting trip. Quail, partridge, and pheasant hunting. Maybe a little turkey hunting. Perhaps some waterfowl hunting. That was my plan long before I ever placed my order.

If I keep the machine, Taylor and the machine may become a valued part of my life. If not, it and he will be placed along the road with the other unnecessary baggage which I don't wish to carry. Good or bad, it will just be another experience. Something to be remembered or something best forgotten.

[joeybagadonuts]

Roadster,

Who is "Mo", is he a Shoptask expert?

JoeyB

[jdclark]

You received a machine that you found unsatisfactory. You could have exercised your warranty and returned the machine for a refund less shipping. Just as you knew when you bought the machine. Period.

Roadster,
You have the correct perspestive on the whole issue. Before I ordered my machine, I spoke at length to JT about Digital and Norvil. As we all know, there are 2 sides to every story, and essentially both of these guys decided they would rather spend the rest of their lives complaining than spend a few hundred dollars in freight to return the machines. Digital screwed himself, because he planned to make his own Patriot out of the cheaper model, and foolishly stripped the machine down and discarded a lot of components instead of taking a few days to evaluate the machine first. Norvil complained that the ball screws had too much backlash and despite having anti-backlash nuts sent to him free of charge he claimed they made no difference. He then foolishly posted that he would give the machine away for free, and when someone took him up on the deal, he stripped the machine of the DRO, CNC and Ball screws, so he still has 80% of what he originally bought. The guy who got the machine for free is now happily making parts. These 2 guys must hold the all-time record for having posts deleted by the moderator because of their name calling and wasting of space to no good purpose. The irony is that because they are so over the top in their endless repetition of the same story, a lot of people figure they are just trolls for one of JT's competitors.

[Roadster]

Actually, norvil hasn't lost anything. He, like most of us will write off the machine as a business expense for a home based business. Assuming that he is in a combined Federal and state tax bracket of 35%, he saved $3400 on his income taxes. That is written off on the upper part of his income. He kept the DRO $900, Ball Screws $800, CNC $2500, and the other $2000 plus worth of tools that he bought from Taylor. He at worst is at a break even situation.

Digital did have a honestly bad situation with a leaking casting. He received a replacement that had been previously repaired. I can see why he was upset. However, he repaired the replacement himself, reassembled his machine and has done some really good work with it. He has posted some photos of his project on here. Good, informative work that we can all learn from.

A bad casting is the worst thing that you can get. During the contract phase, the manufacturer and distributor contract for a specific number of machines and spares based on expected failures. Non wear items, such as a gear box castings, are rarely included as a spare part or perhaps less than one per 200 machines. Failures of these items rarely occur, but when they do, it is a major hard feelings problem for all parties. Especially for the purchaser.

Norvil had expectations for a machine that were well within reason. Unfortunately, lathes and mills made in China tend to have poor quality control. Castings aren't adequately cleaned and the machines aren't properly adjusted. After I retired, I took an industrial arts and gun smithing program. The school received a couple of Jet lathes. They were very inaccurate. The two instructors tore them down, cleaned out the sand, lapped and adjusted them, and reassembled them. The Jets went from junk to jewels. Comparable to a South Bend or Turn Master. The two instructors had over 60 years of combined experience with machines. Most of us would be pressed to get it right.

Norvil and Digital did have an impact on the way Taylor did business. He contracted with an ISO 9001 certified manufacturer to improve quality control and upgraded the quality of the castings.

[digitalmdj]

You can clearly see he took a step backwards with his new machine. It is a totally different machine than he was offering at the first of the year. He removed the picture of the red patriot machine because he wants to sell a inferior machines to the public. No where on his site does he have a picture of the machine he was selling. But he continues to sell this new machine at the same price. Clearly his is doing this on purpose so no one will ask for the red one which he cant afford to offer anymore.

[joeybagadonuts]

Digitalmdj,

I prefer the blue and yellow myself.

It matches our decor better, I am sure you would agree.

JoeyB

[digitalmdj]

I see you would rather pay for color and not quality. If we all did that it would be a sorry world to live in. Since you are showing the new machine wouldn't it be fair to show the red one and give people a chance to voice their opinion. Instead of showing them just the one you want to sell.

[Roadster]

I prefer the looks of the new patriot much better than the red and blue myself. Except for the X and Y manual control handles, I like it better overall. I like the long single handle for the tail stock and X axis lock downs much better than the knobs. The colors are much more business like and less flashy. I am neutral on removal of the guard which was on the front of the old patriot. I didn't see it as necessary.

I'm looking forward to machine's arrival in a couple of weeks. Unfortunately, there are three transmissions, five motors, and a radial arm saw occupying the space right now. And of course, other assorted collected treasures including many 1/3 full cans of solvents, oil, and paint. I have a good start though. I threw out a short piece of wire and a paper towel. I already miss them. And I know I'll regret their loss.

[joeybagadonuts]

Digitalmdj,

Since you do not like the colors you can paint it.

If you cant afford spray paint, we would be happy to send you a few dollars for a couple of cans of Rustoleum.

Please post your address so we know where to send donations.

JoeyB

[digitalmdj]

Just post the pictures of both machines. So people can see that the difference is not just a paint job . Also the handles are not the only difference.You guy are trying to avoid the truth that this new machine is a step backwards. People are not interested in what you think. They are here to get the best value for their dollar. It seem I am the only one who post pictures except for a few others. This only affirms that you have something to hide.

[joeybagadonuts]

Digitalmdj,

The paint job is just like the frosting on our doughnuts, some people like chocolate and some like raspberry filled.

It sounds like you don't like blueberry, but that does not make you bad.

Where should we send the money for the paint?

JoeyB

[digitalmdj]

People are more informed now thanks to Norvil and I . So keep trying to fool people and we will be right there to set things straight. So good luck in your illusion of grandeur.It wont sell machines. Putting out a quality product is the only way to get out of the fix your in.