Sketchup to Rhino.... got some questions

[photomankc]

Wanted to get some input from Rhino folks before I commit to a purchase.

I have found that I can at least understand Rhino, some of the other packages just baffle me in how they want you to do things but I find Rhino reasonably straight forward to work with. Still a few things that I do in SU that I have difficulty with in Rhino.

1.) In SU I can pretty quickly put an idea in place and then push/pull and move things around to fit pretty easy. If I find that I need a face a little further back no problem. Push it back. If that hole needs to go I can just delete the ends and its gone. Seems pretty simple to get rid of a pocket or slot too.

In Rhino it's a lot more steps to everything it seems like and I'm lost sometimes in getting a pocket or counterbore slot moved/removed without making a ton of work. Once it's differenced out of the solid I can't see an easy way to get it back in. Got it done one night but only after a lot of work, exploding, unions, joining, resurfacing, and then redrawing all the extruded slots and holes. Is there a simple way to go about that kind of work. I often don't have a complete plan when I start, I'm trying to work it out as I go which means corrections will be numerous.


2.) Guidelines/Measure - I miss that feature a lot from SU. Is there a Rhino equiv? In SU I can easily line up stuff in 3D space as well as position things with guides. They are super quick to create and easy to snap onto. In Rhino the options seem to be to draw lines to recreate that ability and often the lines go snapping to stuff I can't see and don't want it snapping too. SmartTracking drives me nuts. Before long I seem to have my line glued to a tar-baby that just keeps gloaming on more and more points till I give up and start over.

The proximity on some snaps also seems random to me. It will snap to a circle center only if I keep well away from that center of the circle. If I position the cursor in the center of the circle or arc it will not snap to it.

3.) Dimensions. Do none of the dimensions attach to the object in Rhino? In SU if the dimension is based on feature like a point on the object then it goes where the object goes when moved. In Rhino they sit where they were drawn no matter how the object is moved.

4.) Extrusions from curves always leaves behind the original curve as a separate entity in Rhino. So I draw a circle, extrude a cylinder and I move the cylinder to another position, then a circle is left in place after the move. Is there a way to prevent that?

5.) Is the 'History' feature something useful? Does it allow you to somehow change the dimension of an extruded shape and have the extrusion follow? I can't seem to find much about it but there were hints that it can now do this in V4.

I really do like it and have gotten MUCH further with it than I ever did with Alibre (I don't like that app at all), TurboCAD and ViaCAD rather quickly. I can get the Academic price on it too so it's almost too good to pass up even if I still sometimes use Sketchup to get started.

I am going to sit and really read through the manual but it seems largely geared towards doing things that have no set dimensions or that are already designed. It doens't cover much on fixing, or oops recovery.

I never looked at AutoCAD or SolidWorks. Too far out of my price range to really consider as a hobby user.

[spoiledbrat]

To all you hater's out there, here I am! Autocad stinks! Rhino Rocks!

1. Try the command, Solid_SolidEditTools_Holes_DeleteHole. This will delete the pocket you speak of, and leave the boundary curves for further editing.

2. Snap option for general purpose. Osnap for snapping to objects. You should be able to select and deselect the Osnap parameters. For instance, you probable do not want "Near" enabled if you are trying to snap to a point. On my screen, these are positioned along the bottom of the screen, for easy access while drawing. If you do not see them at the bottom of your screen, something is wrong. It may take time to get used to, but I turn those radio buttons on and off all the time while drawing.

3. Correct. Dimensions are a separate entity. When moving or scaling an object, you would select the dimensions too, if you want the dimensions to update.

4. When extruding a curve, check out the command prompt up top. If you would like the curve to go away, click on the "Delete Input" option.

5. It depends. Lets say you turn history on (up in the command prompt area : RecordHistory=On, UpdateHistory=Yes), and create a circle. Then, you make multiple copies of that circle. If you extrude the original into a cylinder, the rest of the circles will update. Still learning about this feature, but I hope that helped.

Rhino has an excellent user interface, with shortcut buttons available for everything (Type "Toolbar" into the command prompt, and customize away). It is the most intuitive cad program I have ever used.

I wish you luck in your endeavors. No, I am not a Rhino dealer. But I do drink that Kool-Aid. Yummm......

Cheers,

Rob

[ger21]

To all you hater's out there, here I am! Autocad stinks! Rhino Rocks!
...............................................

Rhino has an excellent user interface, with shortcut buttons available for everything (Type "Toolbar" into the command prompt, and customize away). It is the most intuitive cad program I have ever used.


Cheers,

Rob

You do realize that originally, Rhino was somewhat based on AutoCAD, although the modeling is done quite differently. You'll find, however, that a lot of commands function identically in both programs. (Before Rhino, McNeel created Accurender for AutoCAD)

[spoiledbrat]

Maybe so. Rhino was originally an IGES viewer that mutated into a stand-alone system. I was always amazed at the real time rendering engine, allowing you to rotate, pan, and zoom while shaded. And fast.

I will try to be nice to the Autocad family from now on.

[ger21]

Maybe so. Rhino was originally an IGES viewer that mutated into a stand-alone system.

I've never heard that. I recall it being developed as an inexpensive Nurbs modeler. I used to be big into 3D, and used some of the original Rhino betas, before Rhino 1 was released. Sorry for the hijack.

[photomankc]

Thanks a bunch. Wow, was I ever making holes harder than needed to be! And I kept trying to type the options thinking they were hints, noe I see how to use those. I think I'm sold. If I could just now figure out how to move an object and have it snap I'd be really happy.

[spoiledbrat]

This may not be the most efficient way, but I use this religiously.

I place a point on the object I want to move, using osnap to get it where I need it. Then, I drag the object and the point at the same time (click the point, then move mouse) . The move distance will be based off of the point location, and snaps/osnaps will be based off of the point as well. Creates a lot of useless points, but it does let me precisely locate objects.

[chmillman]

For a more accurate account of the history of Rhino, see here:

http://wiki.mcneel.com/rhino/rhinohistory

--ch

[chmillman]

To respond to some of the original points raised:

Rhino is not a solid modeler, so you will not find some of the features you expect in a parametric, dimension driven program. On the other hand, you will find stuff in Rhino that you could not even IMAGINE doing in a solid modeler. It all depends on what you need.

For adjusting/moving/deleting holes: yes, you can DeleteHole in most cases - except where the hole has an odd configuration or crosses a seam - in those cases you will need to do some manual untrimming and retrimming, etc.

The Center osnap activates when one is on the circle or arc itself, not at its center. This way you know which center you're snapping to.

If you do not want to keep the originl curve when extruding an object, just click on DeletInput=No on the command line and toggle it it to DeleteInput=Yes. I do not recommend this however, I think it's better to keep the curves on a separate layer, and just turn the layer off. You never know when you might need them.

--ch

[chmillman]

5. Lets say you turn history on (up in the command prompt area : RecordHistory=On, UpdateHistory=Yes), and create a circle. Then, you make multiple copies of that circle. If you extrude the original into a cylinder, the rest of the circles will update. Still learning about this feature, but I hope that helped.

This is incorrect - or at least incorrectly stated. History in Rhino is about parent-child relationships. The copies of the circle you made from the original (with history on) are children of the original circle. The extrusion is as well. If you modify (like scale) the original circle (parent), the children will be modified as well - so the copy circles and extrusion will update - as long as you haven't otherwise modified the copies beforehand (which will break the history).

However, if you extrude the parent circle, do not expect the child (copy) circles to extrude as well. What succeeding geometry you create from the parent (like an extrusion) is NOT transferred to the children - only modifications to the parent. In addition, only certain modifications to the original object (those that preserve the original object identifier) will not break the history to the children. For example, if you cut a piece out of the original parent circle using trim the relation to the child copies will be broken. But you can move, scale, do edits with control points, etc. to the original and retain the history.

HTH, --ch

[RAW]

Wanted to get some input from Rhino folks before I commit to a purchase.

I mostly just wanted to do a cross-forum shout-out (from HammockForum) when I saw and recognized your screen-name.

I also use Rhino3D. And it seems every day I'm finding some new feature that's embedded in the software that makes my life easier.

The disc has two levels of tutorials included. Level 1 alone is around 250 pages of material designed to get you up to speed on the basic features that you'll need to do your design work quickly and efficiently. The tutorials are easy to work through and really do shorten the learning curve dramatically.

And you're right, the academic price for this piece of software is truly a steal. Do it.

[photomankc]

Ha! Small world! I do remember you talking about your shop a bit on the hammock forums. Didn't get much camping in this spring, it was cold and rainy for a month and then suddenly it was sweltering hot.

Been completeing a few of my previous sketchup drawings in Rhino and getting used to things. I do really like the perspective/top/side views. Still miss my guidelines but been getting along ok without. I've found it pretty easy to work things the way I think, take a solid lump of something and start munching into it.

Already dropped the cash on the student version! Should have the package here next week. Time to start working up a model of my mill to start playing with CNC ideas.