How about a Rhino neck tutorial ?

[seansear]

How about a thread on creating a neck in Rhino. From scratch. I know alot of builders are always looking for someone else to give up a file they have worked long hours at. I think everyone would benefit from those here with the knowledge of just how to go about creating a neck in Rhino.

So lets start.

I want to build a strat style neck, with the 70's style large headstock.

What are the first steps to take when creating this.

Bruce

[turmite]

Hi Bruce,

The first step would be to define some paramters.

1. Is the neck to have a seperate fretboard or machined as a one piece then use a skunk stripe on the back.
2. Is the fretboard to have a compound radius?
3. Radius
4. Is the back of the neck symetrical or assymetrical?

Once those are answered, then some dimensions will be needed such as overall length, measurements at certain frets both thickness and width, radii for the back, neck angles, bolt hole placement and some datum point to start from.

Post this info and we will see if we can get this started.

Mike

[BobF]

Not exactly what you asked for but maybe some help.

http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/v...=10106&t=13037

[phil m]

I've got no idea how to go at this with Rhino but can I try my hand at doing this in Inventor and post it on your thread?

[seansear]

Hi Bruce,

The first step would be to define some paramters.

1. Is the neck to have a seperate fretboard or machined as a one piece then use a skunk stripe on the back.
2. Is the fretboard to have a compound radius?
3. Radius
4. Is the back of the neck symetrical or assymetrical?

Once those are answered, then some dimensions will be needed such as overall length, measurements at certain frets both thickness and width, radii for the back, neck angles, bolt hole placement and some datum point to start from.

Post this info and we will see if we can get this started.

Mike

Ok let's answer these first:

1. Let's make it easy and say seperate Fingerboard
2. Since we are doing seperate Fboard this is not needed ? However, depending on the neck building process it may be necessary to include at least the fboard in the drawing. It could simply be flat 1/4" thick. (more discussion may be needed)
3.
4. Let's start out symetrical

As far as the other dimensions go I will gather these and post later today.

I guess I chose Rhino as it is what I use. I am ASSuming it is probably the most widly used among hobbiest's.


Bruce

[seansear]

I have attached a 2d Neck drawing in DXF format. It should be to scale. If not it should only be off by a few thou. Close enough for working here.

Bruce

[CyborgCNC]

In machining a few necks, here is what has worked for me, both in the design as well in the machining phase....

The fretboard, I would recommend, that you DO design and machine. It makes it simpler to create a surface for the radius, and then let your machine cut it. Creating a "compound" radius on a CNC machine is almost child's play! :-) Also, you will be glad you did this when it comes to inlay! CNC is absolutely INCREDIBLE for cutting inlay pockets, and then cutting the inlay itself (perl/shell etc). Now the most important part: FRET SLOTS! Nothing will beat the accuracy of a CNC machine. In fact, you can make these slots 'follow" the curvature of the board (by making them 3D cuts), which will make for a stiffer board (Like to see someone "try" to do this by hand.... :-) )

So do not overlook the design of the fretboard.

I then cut the neck ...I cut the truss rod, flip it over, and then machine all the contours heel etc.

You might also want to take into consideration binding! So if you are going to bind the fretboard, make sure you compensate for the binding thickness.

You can then install your truss rod, glue the two together, and you would be all set.

Just my 2 cents on what has worked well for me...

[jabguit]

[quote=CyborgCNC;412718]In fact, you can make these slots 'follow" the curvature of the board (by making them 3D cuts), which will make for a stiffer board (Like to see someone "try" to do this by hand.... :-) )
quote]



Here's how I do it 'by hand':

Slot the fingerboard to a depth of .075-.080" (which will allow for the radius at the edges of the board.) Then the board is radiused. After radiusing, the slots are chased out with a hand saw with a depth guage which limits the depth of cut, to a total of .075" (for the fret wire that I use.) After that - only cleanup passes with 320 and 400 grit, which doesn't remove more than a few thousandths.

It can easily be done.

[CyborgCNC]

OK OK, so I was a bit "enthusiastic" on the hand part....

:-)

I was just trying to point out that it is much easier and a lot MORE accurate with a CNC machine.....

[jabguit]

Easier...yes. More accurate.....no.

Having had plenty of experience with both CNC and hand methods, I find no difference when experience is the deciding factor. It is, however much easier to load a blank and press a button to leave the work to a machine and do another task while the machine works and have consistent results - no argument there.

[CyborgCNC]

I agree with you on the repeat-ability of the parts being cut, but in all respect, I will have to disagree with you on the accuracy vs experience argument.

Yes, you can get very precise by hand, but there is a limit to how accurate you can measure something, and how accurate you can then cut it by conventional methods.

When you get a cnc machine that can get .001 or even greater accuracies, and then be able to repeat those cuts over and over again, in my humble opinion, there is no match, hands down. In addition, the ability to be able to see the outcome, BEFORE even cutting it (on a CAD/CAM screen) is in many cases in-valuable. For example being able to show a customer how their instrument will look like once completed before even the work begins, right down to a complete rendering of that custom finish!

Now please, do not get me wrong, some of the most spectacular guitars ever made were made by hand, and those traditions continue today, but I am a believer in technology, and I think the combination of a CNC machine WITH experience will yield incredible results.

I can't help but make correlations when I see people talking about the use of CNC machines to guitar building and other trades. In fact, some are down right AGAINST the use of a CNC machine. I can attribute some of those arguments directly to lack of knowledge, or "computer intimidation." Some of those arguments remind of some other "recent" battles...

Like the Film vs digital photography argument...

or the use of an "air brush" to touch up a photograph vs photoshop..

Among others....

:-)

[turmite]

I agree with you on the repeat-ability of the parts being cut, but in all respect, I will have to disagree with you on the accuracy vs experience argument.


When you get a cnc machine that can get .001 or even greater accuracies, and then be able to repeat those cuts over and over again, in my humble opinion, there is no match, hands down.
:-)

And here is where I am going to have to disagree with you! You knew it was coming.......right?

I don't think in real world machining of wood, you can hold .001" in any but the hardest of woods. You might with a brand new super sharpe cutter for about 30 sec., but as the wood dulls the bit, it's gonna move .001". I can "over measure" a part by a lot more than .001" with a set of dial calipers without much force, and I dare say the force when cutting is greater than what I might put on the wood with the calipers.

Mike