9 X 20 LATHE advise

[DrStein99]

I am looking to buy a lathe around 9" x 20"; I was wondering if anyone had any advice on good deals / best box for the money (I want to spend less then $1k).

This would be my first lathe.

I've looked at the one Grizzly sells, and looks like the same on in harbor-freight; but with less gadgets they sell with it.

Anyone else have any advise?

[mxtras]

Most of these, including the Jet, are absolutley the same machine. The Jet version seems to get a little better reviews because I think they demand more clean-up prior to paint - I donno. It's the same machine as the Horrible Freight or Grizzly. I don't know if they come from the same plant but the appear to be 100% identical except for the color.

I have the HF model and it is better than having nothing. It's reasonably accurate but the rigidity leaves a lot to be desired. The ways are not true - you can adjust the gibs pretty well but it's almost impossible to remove all lash and still be able to move the cross slide or compound throughout their travel without binding somewhere.

The machine works very well on aluminum and will cut steel up to about 1.5" - 2" pretty well, but it sucks for stainless or larger diameters. The layout is a little cramped and the leadscrew drive gears and arrangement suck. The supplied 3 jaw chuck is suprisingly accurate. The tool post mounting is wimpy. Get the Phase II quick change tool post before you even plug the machine in and your first project should be to make a 4 bolt mounting plate for the toolpost.

You will spend a lot of time cleaning but for the money, I think these little machines are pretty good. Maybe the Grizzly machine will come in better condition than my HF version. I paid around $700 (or so - can't recall exactly) two years ago.

Scott

[kdoney]

I have owned enco, grizzly, jet and harbor freight 9X20's and the jet is the much better machine. The jet was the oldest machine I owned so maybe it was built better because of the age of manufacture but the v guides on the cross slide and the cross slide itself was wider. Some of these parts are NOT interchangable. All of the machines cleaned up well and worked for what I had in mind, which was aluminum turning and threading.

I will have a new grizzly (never used) for sale on ebay in about 2 weeks which has been converted to ballscrew cnc with servo motors. Diameters will turn with .0005 precision.

[ballendo]

Hello,

We have 4100+ members in our active Yahoo group called 9x20Lathe

We'd be glad to help you with ANY questions, advice, comments, etc.

Ballendo (9x20Lathe admin)

Originally Posted by DrStein99 I am looking to buy a lathe around 9" x 20"; I was wondering if anyone had any advice on good deals / best box for the money (I want to spend less then $1k). This would be my first lathe. I've looked at the one Grizzly sells, and looks like the same on in harbor-freight; but with less gadgets they sell with it. Anyone else have any advise?

[bill south]

Kadony;
Not to hijack the thread and this is still related to the 9X20, but can you share with us the conversion to cnc or are there plans available? I'm wanting to convert my lathemaster clone (Travers Tool Company TTC) 9X20 to cnc???
Thx.
billyjack

[wizard]

Here is my take on your plans and budget.

There is a lot more to owing a lathe than just the purchase of the hardware itself. So if your budget is only $100 dollars let me first advise you that you may come up short on funds to get to the point of be abel to fully use the lathe. There is a bit of personal experience in this statement so do think about how you are equiped now.

It goes like this; you purchase the lathe then find immediate need for other things to make the lathe useful.

The first item that comes into play is the mounting of the lathe, you need a work bench of some sort and the sturdier the better. If you make such a bench out of either wood or steel plan on it being at least a few hundred.

Don't forget the need for power at the work bench also. That is not to be funny but if your shop is in the garage or the cellar there might not be a suitable outlet anywhere. Outlet installs aren't expensive in and of them selves but you should have a dedicated circuit for the lathe or atleast a very lightly loaded circuit. If you DIY not a huge problem but if you have an electrician come in and replace the aging electrical service it is another issue altogether.

It has already been mentioned that the compound mount is an issue. Do the upgrade that, but also mount a tool post on a block to do away with the compound when it is not needed. This is cheap and easy and a well done mounting block can be used in conjuntion with the compound when that is needed.

Many have already hit upon the need to clean and adjust the lathe. This is highly reccomended if you know what you are doing or know enough not to go to far. It needs to be done to some extent no matter what.

Once you get your compound done there are a number of things that should be looked at closely to address if needed. The drive train should be examined especially, I really didn't like the condition of some of the stub arbors on my machine for example.

Considering your budget I would have to say that a Harbor Frieght machiine on sale is your best bet, if you need to address some of the items above and below to make use of the machine. You should be able to hit $650 or cheaper on sale.

The other side of the coin, with respect to machining, is the need for atleast a few machinest tools. These would be micrometers, calipers, protractors, squares and such devices. Sometimes you can go cheap here and other times it is just a waste of money as you would be better off with Starret or one of the big names in tooling.

Allied with the tools is the tooling required to machine the metals of your choice. Initially this doesn't have to be too expensive at all if you start out with HSS or similar tool blanks and grind to suit your needs. Whoops this implies the need for a grinder that should be added to your budget. I would also reccomend a good set of drill bits, please don't go cheap here. A cut off tool may also be useful as would be a few boring bars. Beyond this it is a case of purchase when needed. Surprisingly this doesn'thave ot be an area of huge expense and second hand tooling is often a very good deal.

Finally their si the issue of tooling for the lathe itself or maybe more acurately accessories. Here I'm talking about Four jaw chucks, larges and smaller three jaw chucks and similar stuff. From my perspective a four jaw chuck is a requirement for lathing and should be seen as more importnat thanthe three jaw chucks that come with the lathe. So you need to invest here if nothing came with your lathe and maybe even if something did. It may be advisable to get something for holding work pieces in collets. There are many options here including ER type collets and 5C collets and everything in between. It isn't easy to advise if you will need them nor which is the best for your machineing needs.

One thing to watch out for with many of these machines and the other suppliers of chinese tooling is that things like live centers are crap. Sorry but there is no other way to put it. The morse taper on the live center supplied with may lathe does not fit the tail stock taper and a second chinese live center I purchased, a center that appears to be made by a different manufacture, does not fit either. I know the taper in the tail stock is good as I have several other Morse taper shank devices that fit just fine in the tail stock. So you may find that to achieve happiness you may have to invest in a live center of good manufacture. That would be US made or a good quality tool from a more developed country. There is a bit of unhappiness to be had with any of the Chinese tool suppliers, do not under estimate this and go into the transaction with open eyes.

The problem is that the Chinese stuff is cheap, far cheaper at times than used machine tools. You get what you pay for in one sense. On the otherhand if you where to guy a new lathe from a major machine tool builder you would not be able to get anywhere near to close to the price of a new Chinese lathe. That is if you can find a machine tool manufacture making similar machines. The closest competitors to the Chinese are Myford and a German manufacture, niether is in the same ball park price wise. So if you buy chinese do expect to spend a bit of money to replace questionable hardware overtime.

Dave

[DrStein99]

Thanks for all the advice! Before anyone else replies, I figure I should mention a few details more:

I have all / most all regular compliments to a normal shop - calipers, micrometers, grinders, saw, drill press, (a home-made 9-moth old AND WORKING cnc machine), etc.... All the bits and accessories are router/ drill press compatible, I do not have any morse-taper, or otherwise machine stuff.

This is not my first machine, but will be my first starter-lathe; and I do not have experience working around or with lathes; but understand their basic operation - am not really healthy on all the titles of all the options and parts to the whole thing.

Money, is obviously an issue and so is space - or I would be looking at ANY machine. These 9x20 machines seem to take up space I may afford and weight less then the 1k+ lbs used (and really nice looking) machines I've seen for sale.

-

I've got a few friends I can count on to help setup/line-up the box for the first time; so I got that under control.


So I would also like to hear what types of tool options, fittings or accessories I should look to make sure I pickup too; that are useful to most common practical lathe operations.

[JRoque]

Hey. I agree that most 9x20 (or 19") machines are the same. Some say the Grizzly machines are made on a stricter plant in China than others. I have one of the Grizzly and it seems as poor quality as the other. For that reason, I'd go for the cheapest brand you can find. I believe that would be Harbor Freight. If you have a local HF, they put them on sale for $500 or so from time to time. Even at regular price, you pay little or no shipping charges at HF. Any extra tools you get with the other models are throw aways and will need replacing anyway. As suggested, get the lathe and a toolpost on the same order so you can replace it right away. Don't buy any Chinese cutting tools for your lathe. US made tools will save you time and gray hairs and produce much better finishes.

The Yahoo group is great; I belong to that too. You can also get good info on mods from this site: http://bedair.org/9x20.html You can infer that needed "mods" equates to inadequately factory equipped so that'll give you an idea on what you get. Overall, it has it's place and will work for many projects. I've done a few but rather complex projects on it and have had good, while painful, results.

JR

[mxtras]

So - Doc -

Did you decide yet? Whatcha gettin?

Scott

[DrStein99]

It appears to me the machines are the same design grade. I take the same chance of getting defective stuff from anyone in this class, which all seem to offer return policies against mfr defects. The parts may or may not be interchageable - but definately all replaceable, and upgradeable. The machines don't break themselves, the operators do.

---------

As a newbie starter without experience, I believe the cheapest route is the best. If I look at my own learning habbits, it takes me a while to use the machine before I know what I will need for it, where to spend more money and where its least important. For that, I will buy the basics, incl the quick-change tool stuff - just to get up and running. I am confident with my mechanical skills that, over time - I will make the right upgrade decisions, and learn at a reasonable rate.

I can take a 15 minute drive to deal with the store manager, at harbor freight; this way, if my friend at the machine shop can identify defects, I can take it back without dealing with shipping.

Laced with all the supportive information I've read from people on the h.f. 9x20; I believe I get the big picture.

[victor937]

Hello Dr. and everyone else,
Well...after reading this thread, I think I'm going to take the plunge if i can talk myself into it by this Saturday. With a 20% off coupon, good through Sat, I can buy the HF 9X20 locally for $520 + tax.
I was considering the HF 8X12 shipped (not available locally), for a bit less money, but I like the idea of picking one up a few minutes from home for obvious reasons.
Anyway, I appreciate all the imput from the forum members.

-Vic

[widgitmaster]

I had a 9x20 Jet, it lasted one year and the spindle started growling like a Grizzley!
All I made with it was a thousand Delrin Acme nuts! and some aluminum parts!
I couldn't wait to get rid of it! Actually, I gave it away to someone on this Zone!

Then I bought a Birmingham 13x40 for $2487 and got 101 times the machine at litle over twice the price!
I would NEVER recomend any of the Chinese 9x20's, they are disposable toys!

I would recomend shopping around the Used Machinery Warehouses in your area, and get an old SOLID cast Iron machine that has all the features you would expect in a professional engine lathe! Like power feeds in X & Y axis, Metric & Inch threading, Collet Closers, Large bore spindle, Gear driven spindle, etc... The only feature my new lathe does not have is a carraige stop that turns off the power feed!
That is how I found my New lathe, I went to the warehouse to look at a used lathe, and saw the NEW one for a few pennies more!
The only 9x20 I have ever liked was made by SouthBend, it had all the features too!

Eric